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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EOS Digital Cameras 
Thread started 12 Sep 2019 (Thursday) 14:42
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-= 90D owners unite! Discuss and Post Photos

 
cdmazoff
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Feb 21, 2020 17:46 |  #1531

Anyone using iTR and AF Zone (9 point) for BIF through the viewfinder? I have my iTR turned off, but I'm wondering about whether or not to give it a go.


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Jeff ­ USN ­ Photog ­ 72-76
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Feb 21, 2020 20:34 |  #1532

I turned mine off. Still trying to decide whether to add a 1Dx mkii to go with the 90D or just stick with the 6D mkii and the 90D, 90D for BIF.

The AF on the 90D can be hit or miss


"sometimes having is not so pleasing as wanting, it is not logical but it is true" Commander Spock
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John ­ Sheehy
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Post edited over 1 year ago by John Sheehy.
     
Feb 22, 2020 07:01 |  #1533

Jeff USN Photog 72-76 wrote in post #19013941 (external link)
I turned mine off. Still trying to decide whether to add a 1Dx mkii to go with the 90D or just stick with the 6D mkii and the 90D, 90D for BIF.

The AF on the 90D can be hit or miss

It depends on the conditions. When shooting BIFs against a blue sky, the 90D almost never misses for me, even at 10fps with the full-sensor AF pattern. When the background is much further away than the subject, it tends to do very well. When the subject is close to the background from the camera's perspective, it may not notice that there is something closer than the background, about half the time, and the AF may lose the subject even after having it in focus. I could improve that a little by setting the camera to stick with a subject at the highest priority, but then initial acquisition speed can take a small hit, and many BIF opportunities can be fleeting, with very short windows of opportunity.

I prefer high-pixel-density APS-C for most bird photography I do in my home area in NY, but when I visited Florida last week, I had huge Egrets and Wood Storks flying right over my head constantly, so I had to switch to my 70-200/4L IS (the original) from the 400/4DO II prime. I would have clearly done better with a 1Dx-series camera and a 70-200/2.8L III in that situation. If I were doing that all the time, it might justify a 1DxIII purchase. I don't relish the idea of choosing between a 1DxIII and a 90D when leaving the house; the 90D would give better subject quality when focal-length-limited (most of my photos), but the 1DxIII is an awesome AF machine, by all user reports. I drool over the idea of 1DxIII-like AF with a 90D sensor.

Besides conditions, we all have different goals in photography. I shoot for my own enjoyment, and I am more interested in getting the maximum possible subject quality when I get the subject in focus than I am in getting a near-100% percentage of keepers. No Canon FF camera gives better IQ (in terms of both noise and resolution) than the 90D in focal-length-limited situations. I doubt that the 1DxIII, even, is any better cropped to 1.6x than the 90D at ISO 51200 for noise, and the 1DxII is already a little bit noisier than the 90D at the same subject magnification.




  
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mikeivan
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Feb 22, 2020 08:36 |  #1534

cdmazoff wrote in post #19013873 (external link)
Anyone using iTR and AF Zone (9 point) for BIF through the viewfinder? I have my iTR turned off, but I'm wondering about whether or not to give it a go.

I am going to try this. MY BIF keeper rate with 90d is abysmal. Better with single focus point than any auto-selection. I am too old and unsteady for that setting. Worth a try, thanks for the suggestion.


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DreDaze
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Feb 22, 2020 10:13 |  #1535

cdmazoff wrote in post #19013873 (external link)
Anyone using iTR and AF Zone (9 point) for BIF through the viewfinder? I have my iTR turned off, but I'm wondering about whether or not to give it a go.

what is ITR? i've been trying to use the full AF point for birds in flight, and start with the middle, and let it try and catch up


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DreDaze
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Post edited over 1 year ago by DreDaze.
     
Feb 22, 2020 10:17 |  #1536

this was more of a just for fun experiment...i'm pretty amazed how much better live view focusing is in the dark in comparison to the viewfinder...viewfinde​r was just hunting, so i put it in live view and it locked on pretty quick...also the highest ISO i think i've ever shot at...used topaz denoise...settings f4 1/60 12800

IMAGE: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49559521418_0f13a676d9_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/2ivp​v6d  (external link) p-week8_20_0121 (external link) by andre gregoire (external link), on Flickr

also with the 500f4IS and this camera, i feel like my cropping abilities are crazy..original shot, and then the crop
IMAGE: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49559681951_841c3027b1_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/2ivq​jP2  (external link) p-week8_20_0064 (external link) by andre gregoire (external link), on Flickr

IMAGE: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49559921502_23ee5e0728_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/2ivr​y2d  (external link) p-week8_20_0064sc (external link) by andre gregoire (external link), on Flickr

just another sample shot
IMAGE: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49560128417_666fe3823f_b.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/2ivs​BwH  (external link) p-week8_20_0088 (external link) by andre gregoire (external link), on Flickr

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cdmazoff
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Feb 22, 2020 13:07 as a reply to  @ DreDaze's post |  #1537

iTR is "intelligent Tracking" option in Settings under autofocus. You can enable it with face tracking or enable it w/o face tracking or disable it completely

The word is to disable it completely, which I have done about a week after I bought it because of abysmal results for BIF

I always shoot with my 1.4 ex III attached to my 100-400 mk2... which puts me at f8..

I've never tried shooting without the tele (it's the wrong distance for me) but without the tele I could use 45 full autofocus with iTR ..

However. as John Sheehy points out and as I have noticed... AF is really much better when you have great light and a blue sky..

So: I have put a short cut to the iTR in my Custom Menu and will try turning it on (and off) next good blue sky day.

But because I'm using the 1.4 I will only be able to use Zone AF 9 point for iTR (I could try Large Zone 27 point but they are not all cross).

iTR doesn't work with single point

I'm interested in tracking a cluster of birds (buffleheads) as they take off and land..


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Jeff ­ USN ­ Photog ­ 72-76
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Post edited over 1 year ago by Jeff USN Photog 72-76.
     
Feb 22, 2020 14:20 |  #1538

John Sheehy wrote in post #19014149 (external link)
It depends on the conditions. When shooting BIFs against a blue sky, the 90D almost never misses for me, even at 10fps with the full-sensor AF pattern. When the background is much further away than the subject, it tends to do very well. When the subject is close to the background from the camera's perspective, it may not notice that there is something closer than the background, about half the time, and the AF may lose the subject even after having it in focus. I could improve that a little by setting the camera to stick with a subject at the highest priority, but then initial acquisition speed can take a small hit, and many BIF opportunities can be fleeting, with very short windows of opportunity.

I prefer high-pixel-density APS-C for most bird photography I do in my home area in NY, but when I visited Florida last week, I had huge Egrets and Wood Storks flying right over my head constantly, so I had to switch to my 70-200/4L IS (the original) from the 400/4DO II prime. I would have clearly done better with a 1Dx-series camera and a 70-200/2.8L III in that situation. If I were doing that all the time, it might justify a 1DxIII purchase. I don't relish the idea of choosing between a 1DxIII and a 90D when leaving the house; the 90D would give better subject quality when focal-length-limited (most of my photos), but the 1DxIII is an awesome AF machine, by all user reports. I drool over the idea of 1DxIII-like AF with a 90D sensor.

Besides conditions, we all have different goals in photography. I shoot for my own enjoyment, and I am more interested in getting the maximum possible subject quality when I get the subject in focus than I am in getting a near-100% percentage of keepers. No Canon FF camera gives better IQ (in terms of both noise and resolution) than the 90D in focal-length-limited situations. I doubt that the 1DxIII, even, is any better cropped to 1.6x than the 90D at ISO 51200 for noise, and the 1DxII is already a little bit noisier than the 90D at the same subject magnification.

I agree the 90D is great against the sky, a lot of my shots are with ducks or geese right up against the woods and it is hard to see the subject from the trees ROFL

Today I was trying single point focus, when I thaw out I will see what I got

Oh by the way I found out you have to add a new battery, also the CFast card runs up to $400 and then a $100 reader, I am sticking with the 90D and the 6Dmkii for now, will watch for the R5 and will they ever come out with a 7Diii


"sometimes having is not so pleasing as wanting, it is not logical but it is true" Commander Spock
"Free advice is seldom cheap" Ferengi Rule of Acquisition #59
I might not always be right, but I am never wrong! Once I thought I was wrong but I was mistaken!

  
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mikeivan
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Feb 22, 2020 17:13 |  #1539

DreDaze wrote in post #19014227 (external link)
also with the 500f4IS and this camera, i feel like my cropping abilities are crazy..original shot, and then the crop
QUOTED IMAGE
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/2ivq​jP2  (external link) p-week8_20_0064 (external link) by andre gregoire (external link), on Flickr

QUOTED IMAGE
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/2ivr​y2d  (external link) p-week8_20_0064sc (external link) by andre gregoire (external link), on Flickr

Thanks for posting these wonderful images. My experience is similar to yours! I bought my 90d for the Megapixels and I am very happy with the quality of my crops of the crop sensor,
my example is attached, of the entire sensor:


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and a 4x5 crop:


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Unfortunately, the quality of the 90d autofocus for BIF (nine points, center zone or all points) does not equal or even approach the performance of my old 7dii. It is so obviously inferior, that I suspect that it was purposefully limited. My initial experiments with ITR are modestly encouraging, but still not sharp or quick as my 7dii. :( It is what it is. Maybe a software update will appear some day.

MIKEIVAN

  
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Mnbruce
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Feb 22, 2020 21:47 |  #1540

IMAGE: https://photos.smugmug.com/Nayarit-2020/i-cbT7Nvq/0/acecfd72/L/IMG_3066%2B-L.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://photos.smugmug​.com …MG_3066%2B-L.jpg&lb=1&s=A  (external link) on Smugmug



  
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Mnbruce
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Post edited over 1 year ago by Mnbruce.
     
Feb 22, 2020 21:49 |  #1541

IMAGE: https://photos.smugmug.com/Nayarit-2020/i-dk5wPjb/0/7b8354dd/L/IMG_4125%2B-L.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://photos.smugmug​.com …MG_4125%2B-L.jpg&lb=1&s=A  (external link) on Smugmug

IMAGE: https://photos.smugmug.com/Nayarit-2020/i-CMRR4QN/0/b7d44660/L/IMG_3388%2B-L.jpg
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David_Wales
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Post edited over 1 year ago by David_Wales. (4 edits in all)
     
Feb 23, 2020 03:58 |  #1542

Hello to all, from flooded UK.

Having read all 103 pages; yes I have a lot of free time, the 90D is like British Marmite (yeast extract spread), you either love it or hate it. Personally, having bought the 90D back in November I'm still sitting on the fence as to its capability to produce consistent and continguous quality images. The following BIF; Black-tailed Godwits, Knot and Redshank, images were captured with 100-400mm is usm ii:


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Whilst I was happy with some of the images, the 90D failed to lock onto a single point, hence the birds are all out of focus, just the occasional wing might achieve focus with use of back button focusing. I expected more from the Canon combination.

I will carry on regardless with 90D, and l try suggestions from this thread to see if my image quality improves.

Regards.



  
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David_Wales
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Feb 23, 2020 05:40 |  #1543

Two images from 90D and Sigma 150-600mm C combination:

Long-tailed Tit


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Treecreeper


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Not entirely happy with soft focus, but I will continue with 90D and try different settings to get better quality images.

Regards



  
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PCousins
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Feb 23, 2020 07:56 |  #1544

David_Wales wrote in post #19014661 (external link)
Hello to all, from flooded UK.

Having read all 103 pages; yes I have a lot of free time, the 90D is like British Marmite (yeast extract spread), you either love it or hate it. Personally, having bought the 90D back in November I'm still sitting on the fence as to its capability to produce consistent and continguous quality images. The following BIF images were captured with 100-400mm is usm ii:


thumbnail
Hosted photo: posted by David_Wales in
./showthread.php?p=190​14661&i=i248316008
forum: Canon EOS Digital Cameras



thumbnail
Hosted photo: posted by David_Wales in
./showthread.php?p=190​14661&i=i12701469
forum: Canon EOS Digital Cameras


****I will link further images to my site***

Whilst I was happy with some of the images, the 90D failed to lock onto a single point, hence the birds are all out of focus, just the occasional wing might achieve focus with use of back button focusing. I expected more from the Canon combination.

I will carry on regardless with 90D, and l try suggestions from this thread to see if my image quality improves.

Regards.


David I too have been reading and kept with this thread with the aim of buying a 90D at the Photography show at Birmingham NEC mid March where I have bought gear in the past and always got great deals. There are some great photo's in this thread captured with this new body which raises my hopes and then there are the disappointments which leads me to reconsider having a change of mind. I use the same lens as you 100-400 II as well as a 600mm prime and often capture flocks of Godwits or plovers in flight at RSPB Nature reserves and always my shots are in focus, lock on and tack sharp, with a bust of 10-15 photo's everyone being the same. That is using 2 bodies (1d4 & 1ds3) that are over 10 years old.
This type of BIF shots should be easy for a new 90D body. Something cannot be right. There must be some settings that are wrong. I'm inclined to want to keep my ageing old tech camera Bodies if BIF shots cannot better or match the photo's I took a month ago below at Bowling Green Marsh. Could you please expand more so on the settings you used. Thank You.....Paul


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David_Wales
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Feb 23, 2020 11:26 as a reply to  @ PCousins's post |  #1545

Hi Paul,

Thanks for reply.

Lovely images of Godwits.

The above images were all shot in AV, Auto ISO; I forgot to change iso range and shutter speed so I might know where I went wrong, however I'm in process of configuring C1 and C2 to compensate for my lack of photography ability. The wetlands where I live I'm having to shoot with the sun/bright light from front on at 2° clock; if 12 straight ahead, therefore water glare is a constant issue.

I shoot in RAW or JPEG, sometimes both.

Custom Mode C1av now set to:

RAW, AI Servo, Spot AF, Evaluation Metering, High Speed Continuous, iso speed setting Auto, iso speed range 100-3200, Auto range 100-6400, Min shutter speed 1/250, Picture style standard, High iso speed Low, Auto focus tracking +1, Accel/decel tracking 0, AF pt auto switching 0, AI Servo 1st image priority Focus, AI Servo 2nd image priority middle, Lens drive when AF impossible 0, Select AF area select mode all, Limit AF methods all, AF area selection method 0, Orientation linked AF point 1, Initial Servo AF 1, Auto AF pt sel EIS iTR AF 2, AF point selection movement 0, AF point display during focus 0, VF display illum 0, AFM none.

Custom Mode C2m now set to:

RAW/JPEG, One Shot, 9pt Zone, Evaluation Metering, Low Speed Continuous, f5, 1/2000, Auto iso, iso speed range 100-3200, Auto range 100-12800, Min shutter speed 1/500, Auto lighting optimizer standard, AWB, Picture Style Neutral. C. FN I Autofocus Tracking sensivity 0, Accel/dcel tracking 0, AF pt auto switching 0, AI Servo 1st image priority middle, AI Servo 2nd image Priority middle, Lens Drive 0, Select AF area all, Limit AF methods all, AF area selection 0, Orientation linked AF point 1, Initial Servo AF pt 1, EOS iTR AF 2, AF point selection movement 0, AF point display during focus 0, VF display illum 0, AF micro adj (not done yet can't see any back or front focusing from these images.

Exposure compensation changed as necessary.

Sigma set to Focus Priority, Dynamic View, I know the Sigma needs some calibration, just have to wait till rain stops so I can get outside to get right distance ranges for focusing chart.

Canon 100-400mm left on default settings.

Any points gratefully received.

Rgds David




  
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