Recommendation: Editing software program for my old computer

SkedAddled wrote in post #18934924
I agree with this, at the same time that I also agree with John.

I attempted a very roundabout way to attempt an 'upgrade' from XP to 7 some years ago,
and that attempt failed miserably: All registered file-types opening with something like
Paint Shop Pro 7, etc... Yeah, it was a failure.

StarlingGirl, allow me to suggest this:
In all of the discussion here about your situation, there has not yet been mention of
replacing your computer system. There have been suggestions about transferring
what you'd like to keep after 'clean' installations and so forth, and the advice has been
rather solid, but what about just plopping down a hundred or so bucks for a refurbished
system which is more recent? There are many online vendors who offer such bargains,
lots of them offering free shipping. NewEgg is one such example, providing warranties
with purchase.

You'd likely get a far more-current system than you have now,
probably getting past the headaches you may be experiencing.

Just a thought...

Hi SkedAddled,

Thanks for your reply. I appreciate it. $100! I would do it. BTW, I'm not sure I'm reading all the posts in correct order here. I apologize in advance. I'm a little confused with my options at this point and really do not want to take advantage of everyone's time. There are many opinions. I'm not sure what the minimum requirements are regarding my needs for photo editing. I'm thinking it's less than I originally thought. My current system seems to functioning 'sufficiently' at the moment, but the transfer from Sandisc to HD is very slow. I think my existing graphics card is working - I mean I can see my pictures using DPP. I do have to upgrade to Windows 10 on top of all this. Add to the mix, the numbering systems of the processors don't make sense, a later (higher) number doesn't mean the processor is better than the lower numbered processor. I believe they have different 'series' or something. I don't know. LOL. I'm a little computer literate and know basics, but nailing down the requirements, a comparable system at the best price I can find (Money is tight) is going to take some research on my part. With all the differing opinions, it doesn't appear that it's going to be an easy task.

I so much appreciate every perspective because we all have had different experiences, and I appreciate yours as well.

StarlingGirl wrote in post #18935850
Hi John from PA,

You have my attention. This novice thought it was a good idea too. I'm not sure I have the product key either. I do have a Windows 7 (need to upgrade to W10) and my backup, and system image (which I guess is part of the backup) is so large. I did a disk clean up and still end up with only 28.9GB of free space on 'DATA' drive. My D: (DATA) disk is 0% defragmented, while c: drive is 1%. I cannot account for why it is so high! Do you think it's normal?

Hosted photo: posted by StarlingGirl in
./showthread.php?p=189​35850&i=i92839625
forum: RAW, Post Processing & Printing

Hosted photo: posted by StarlingGirl in
./showthread.php?p=189​35850&i=i169855569
forum: RAW, Post Processing & Printing

You can recover your Windows product key and get the procedure for getting a free copy of Windows 10 by reviewing my comments in the thread at https://photography-on-the.net …showthread.php?​p=18904875. If you use the free Belarc utility I mention it will recover virtually all our product keys (good to have).

John from PA wrote in post #18935855
First of all let me state that I've upgraded numerous systems to SSD's so the response varies, but I can positively state that a noticeable improvement was attained in all cases. This is unlike the common recommendation of say perhaps 10 years ago where you went to the trouble (and often considerable expense) to upgrade RAM and when you got all done, the perception of a change just wasn't there.

So, specific examples, on one Windows XP laptop, specifically a Dell D620, with 8 GB ram and an HDD...the boot time to the desktop screen was probably about 2-1/2 to 3 minutes. On that machine only DPP 3.x would run well; DPP 4.x had issues with XP. The machine was updated to an SSD (still 8 GB RAM) and the boot time was brought down to about 30 seconds. I later upgraded this machine to Windows 10 and the boot time is about 20 seconds and DPP 4.x runs fine. The client still brings the machine to me every month or so and for a minimal fee I maintain an "off site" backup.

The most recent machine, a Lenovo desktop (Win 7 Pro 64-bit) about 10 years old, was updated to an SSD initially. Boot time went from probably 1-1/2 minutes to about 45 seconds, as best I recall. With the soon to be end of Microsoft support to Windows 7, the client brought the machine to me for the Windows 10 update, which I did about a month ago. I did not elect the clean install option and the client was very pleased that absolutely nothing had to be reinstalled. In fact one printer that the client used, a Canon BJC-85 has no Windows 10 driver, but it still works properly!

I see elsewhere you are considering "clean install". I would not do that if you have a functioning Windows 7 machine. Keep in mind you need the installation software for everything you now have. That will mean things like Office may have to be repurchased and reinstalled. Do you like an older version, like say Office 2010 as opposed to the newer "cloud" based version. Do you run Outlook and are you willing to lose all your old email unless you take precautions. All this is retained with the update as opposed to the clean install.

Hi John from PA,

Again thank you so much for your thoughtful response! I Absolutely do not want 'cloud' based software -- what a gimmick. Anyway, Here's what I am thinking of doing with all the input so far.


This is the specs for my computer: https://www.newegg.com …tations/p/N82E1​6883103966

I was thinking of adding 1TB SSD and another 4GB of RAM from here (because it's guaranteed to work with my system): https://www.crucial.co​m …er/veriton-x2631g-i54440x
I'll have to figure out which ones though.


Two questions:
1)Do you think it'll resolve my 5 hour transfer from SanDisk to my HD.
2) Do you think I can run lightroom in the future (which seems to be the 'goto' s/w)?


As ever, thank you!!

StarlingGirl wrote in post #18935862
...
Two questions:
1)Do you think it'll resolve my 5 hour transfer from SanDisk to my HD.
...

This is impossible to tell for sure without knowing all of the components. Adding ram and switching to a ssd will make the PC much snappier for sure and probably will reduce the time, but how much will depend on the other components .
What type of memory card are you using? A class 2 card and a class 10 card will have very different performance limits.
What USB version does the PC support. Not sure why the specs do not include that, but USB 1.1 and USB 3.1 are very different when it comes to performance. This also includes the type of reader you are using. (I'm guessing it's usb 2.0)

If you are using a class 2 card and transferring using usb 1.1 you wont see a big gain in performance I think. But if you have a class 4, 6, 10 card and using usb 2, you might see a pretty significant improvement.

StarlingGirl wrote in post #18935862
Hi John from PA,

Again thank you so much for your thoughtful response! I Absolutely do not want 'cloud' based software -- what a gimmick. Anyway, Here's what I am thinking of doing with all the input so far.


This is the specs for my computer: https://www.newegg.com …tations/p/N82E1​6883103966

I was thinking of adding 1TB SSD and another 4GB of RAM from here (because it's guaranteed to work with my system): https://www.crucial.co​m …er/veriton-x2631g-i54440x
I'll have to figure out which ones though.

Two questions:
1)Do you think it'll resolve my 5 hour transfer from SanDisk to my HD.
2) Do you think I can run lightroom in the future (which seems to be the 'goto' s/w)?


As ever, thank you!!

I can't give you 100% positive answers on your two questions. Whatever device in the transfer "chain" is the slowest dictates the transfer speed. Transferring from the SanDisk to the HDD, or a newer SSD will depend on the actual Sandisk speed and the USB port protocol of your machine At least as I write this doing a search on your machine does not yield the USB port specs (USB 2, USB 3 or 3.1).

As far as running LR, I personally only use DPP so I can't address that question. Perhaps someone else may be able to do that. But I do not think it would be any worse than your current situation.

Importantly, check to see that Crucial on the SSD upgrade provides migration software and a cable with their SSD offering. The migration software (and cable) will provide the means to make a "mirror" image of your existing HDD onto the new SSD. If you need the cable, it typically is about $8 at Best Buy. Then when the SSD is installed the PC should boot off the SSD witout any more work. Retain the old drive for a week or so just in case you have issues. You can even install it into the desktop chassis as you likely have extra cables for a drive. It then can be a backup drive, etc. once you gain confidence in the new SSD installation.

gjl711 wrote in post #18935873
This is impossible to tell for sure without knowing all of the components. Adding ram and switching to a ssd will make the PC much snappier for sure and probably will reduce the time, but how much will depend on the other components .
What type of memory card are you using? A class 2 card and a class 10 card will have very different performance limits.
What USB version does the PC support. Not sure why the specs do not include that, but USB 1.1 and USB 3.1 are very different when it comes to performance. This also includes the type of reader you are using. (I'm guessing it's usb 2.0)

If you are using a class 2 card and transferring using usb 1.1 you wont see a big gain in performance I think. But if you have a class 4, 6, 10 card and using usb 2, you might see a pretty significant improvement.

I do have a 3.1usb. My card is a SanDisk Extreme pro 170mb/s 64GB if that helps, but again I'm not sure of what the speed is on the card reader. This is what the properties indicate for hardware ID for it: USBSTOR\DiskGeneric-SD/MMC/MS_PRO___1.00
Doesn't look like much.

Thank you for your time!

John from PA wrote in post #18935874
I can't give you 100% positive answers on your two questions. Whatever device in the transfer "chain" is the slowest dictates the transfer speed. Transferring from the SanDisk to the HDD, or a newer SSD will depend on the actual Sandisk speed and the USB port protocol of your machine At least as I write this doing a search on your machine does not yield the USB port specs (USB 2, USB 3 or 3.1).

As far as running LR, I personally only use DPP so I can't address that question. Perhaps someone else may be able to do that. But I do not think it would be any worse than your current situation.

Importantly, check to see that Crucial on the SSD upgrade provides migration software and a cable with their SSD offering. The migration software (and cable) will provide the means to make a "mirror" image of your existing HDD onto the new SSD. If you need the cable, it typically is about $8 at Best Buy. Then when the SSD is installed the PC should boot off the SSD witout any more work. Retain the old drive for a week or so just in case you have issues. You can even install it into the desktop chassis as you likely have extra cables for a drive. It then can be a backup drive, etc. once you gain confidence in the new SSD installation.

Hi John from PA:

Thanks very much for your insight. I'll be sure to check that the cables are included or not and the migration software.


Again thank you.

StarlingGirl wrote in post #18935862
This is the specs for my computer: https://www.newegg.com …tations/p/N82E1​6883103966

From this link, we find that the system's motherboard utilizes an Intel H81 chipset.

According to Intel's website, the H81 chipset offers USB 2.0 and 3.0, with no mention
of any lower revision. Therefore, it's fairly safe to argue that you have, at minimum,
USB 2.0 port connections available.
Typically found most commonly on the rear panel of a circa-2013 PC, any USB 3 ports
are most likely to have a blue color plastic within their sockets instead of white or black.

USB 2.0 and above should not require several hours for a less-than 10GB transfer,
so I'd expect any or all of the: 1)card reader, 2)memory card, 3)USB cable.

Posting a clear picture here of the Sandisk card's label will tell everyone involved here
just how fast it should be able to read/write.
Likewise with a picture of your card-reader's label.
The camera itself may be a bottleneck slowdown, if that's your method to copy to hard drive
instead of removing memory card from camera to insert into a card reader.

So, the system has a Core i5-4440 processor at 3.1 GHz, which is likely plenty fast
and capable for most modern photo-processing software. 4GB memory isn't paltry either,
but if you can afford to double that or more, things may go along more smoothly
with everything you use the system for.

There's up to a total of 4 SATA ports for drives, with 2 of them likely being SATA III,
which should also be blue instead of white/black. A solid-state SATA III drive plugged
into one of those ports should realize transfers at up to 6.0 Gb/second, which is
faster than many mechanical drives are capable of.

Given all of the above, my suggestions are
1) Verify the Sandisk memory and card-reader speed capabilities
1) Try another USB cable, specifically rated for USB 2.0 or 3.0
3) Definitely get an SSD and more RAM if budget allows.
An SSD will give you a colossal speed improvement in everything the system does
which is internal. Anything EXternal such as USB drives, card readers, etc. are all
limited to their slowest point in the connection, including devices themselves.

Got curious so I ran a test. Pretty decent PC, Extreme pro class 3 card, 7200rmp hard drive (4tb WD Black), USB 3.1. and moved 18,018,666,060 bytes (16.7gig). It took 15:17.41

StarlingGirl wrote in post #18935812
Hi Spencerphoto,

I shot on manual mode the whole time as recommended. Believe me, it was excruciatingly slow playing around with Aperture, Speed, light meter, focus, ISO, composition. It's hard to tell outdoors on the small camera screen whether it's a good picture or not -- especially when I'm not sure what defines a 'good' picture yet. It is overwhelming.

I seem to be a minority of like one, maybe two, but I don't see the need for shooting in Manual. I think for birds shutter priority would be fine, then set ISO to Auto, the camera will take care of ISO and aperture for you and you won't be underexposing. You would want to make sure the camera doesn't go nuts and crank the ISO up to too high a level. I do landscapes mostly, so shoot in aperture priority, that's the setting you are concerned with for a landscape (depth of field). Birds of course you are trying to freeze things so controlling the shutter speed is the important setting.

patrick j wrote in post #18936019
I seem to be a minority of like one, maybe two, but I don't see the need for shooting in Manual. I think for birds shutter priority would be fine, then set ISO to Auto, the camera will take care of ISO and aperture for you and you won't be underexposing. You would want to make sure the camera doesn't go nuts and crank the ISO up to too high a level. I do landscapes mostly, so shoot in aperture priority, that's the setting you are concerned with for a landscape (depth of field). Birds of course you are trying to freeze things so controlling the shutter speed is the important setting.

I use shutter priority almost exclusively but that is because of what I shoot where in general my first thought is stopping action, then I think in terms of depth of field. I have also come from an era where the 1st "automatic" cameras only had shutter priority, cameras like the Konica Autoreflex which served me well until my 1st digital (a Canon G2)

StarlingGirl wrote in post #18935938
Hi John from PA:

Thanks very much for your insight. I'll be sure to check that the cables are included or not and the migration software.

Again thank you.

A thought comes to mind if you are serious about making these potential upgrades/updates. Do you know what BIOS revision is currently on your machine? Do you know how to update the BIOS? See https://us.answers.ace​r.com …QdDY5c3dyUSUyMS​UyMQ%3D%3D for some assistance.

That Belarc Advisor I mentioned in an earlier post is at https://www.belarc.com​/products_belarc_advis​or. As I suggested download it and run it. It might take about 5 minutes to extract everything. Then print and retain the printout. It should tell you the BIOS level and things like your Windows Product key.

John from PA wrote in post #18936033
I use shutter priority almost exclusively but that is because of what I shoot where in general my first thought is stopping action, then I think in terms of depth of field. I have also come from an era where the 1st "automatic" cameras only had shutter priority, cameras like the Konica Autoreflex which served me well until my 1st digital (a Canon G2)

I left a comment about this on YouTube a few weeks ago and basically was told I don't know what I'm talking about (shocking that could happen on the internet, isn't it), but my thinking is that the nature of exposure is that you have an independent variable and a dependent variable. If you set your shutter, say, then your aperture has to be a certain thing to give you the correct exposure, you can't fidget with it. So in manual mode you are juggling two things that are not independent of each other, you can pick one or the other, then you are more or less locked in on the second setting. I'm sure there are some instances where manual is desirable, but I don't know what they'd be, beyond using it as a substitute for exposure compensation.

patrick j wrote in post #18936048
I left a comment about this on YouTube a few weeks ago and basically was told I don't know what I'm talking about (shocking that could happen on the internet, isn't it), but my thinking is that the nature of exposure is that you have an independent variable and a dependent variable. If you set your shutter, say, then your aperture has to be a certain thing to give you the correct exposure, you can't fidget with it. So in manual mode you are juggling two things that are not independent of each other, you can pick one or the other, then you are more or less locked in on the second setting. I'm sure there are some instances where manual is desirable, but I don't know what they'd be, beyond using it as a substitute for exposure compensation.

I too got a similar reaction on POTN when I first got my 60D. Many expressed their disbelief that I would shoot using shutter priority. I personally think but admit I could be wrong, that many people don’t understand the interaction of the variables (shutter speed, aperture, ISO). Or if they do, they can’t think in those terms. I started as a teen working in a camera store with a camera that didn’t have a meter. All I had was the famous (more or less) “sunny 16 rule”. It got me through years of photography until I could afford a meter! If you missed you pushed or pulled that film in the lab. I suspect many don’t even know what shutter priority means; they are likely the same people that can’t divide $39.99 by two in their head. [Real story, a person waiting on me had to use their iPhone to do the math.]

patrick j wrote in post #18936019
I seem to be a minority of like one, maybe two, but I don't see the need for shooting in Manual. I think for birds shutter priority would be fine, then set ISO to Auto, the camera will take care of ISO and aperture for you and you won't be underexposing. You would want to make sure the camera doesn't go nuts and crank the ISO up to too high a level. I do landscapes mostly, so shoot in aperture priority, that's the setting you are concerned with for a landscape (depth of field). Birds of course you are trying to freeze things so controlling the shutter speed is the important setting.

Hi Patrick J,

Shooting in manual is supposed to encourage getting up the learning curve faster - i think. Your right shutter priority probably will help. I did end up having some movement in my picture due to to low shutter speed, but that is one lesson learned, and I learned it quickly. LOL. I'll try manual for a while. If I think I'm getting discouraged, I'll jump on shutter; especially if the shots are limited. Like it was on that day. I think I learned a lot from that manual shoot so I'm not convinced yet to turn off manual just yet. Tonight I was out walking the dog - shooting manual with a macro with little light. I bumped up ISO trying to increase shutter keeping the light meter centered. Shutter was very low: 1/30 or close - hand held, while walking the dog. LOL Can I play with it in post? LOL. Just having fun.


Once I know what this camera is capable of and I can control it that's when I'll take it off manual. So one day soon I hope I will be in your shoes.

Thank you for your thoughts. I totally appreciate them.

Best.