Canon vs. Nikon, again...

snegron wrote in post #18989381
... then EF will be disappearing in less than 3 years from now.

Extremely short-sighted. If Canon is worried about sales, income, profits, Canon will keep supplying EF lenses for at least 10 years. And continue to provide service on them for at least another few years. If Canon dumps on its current customer base, who is going to buy the RF stuff? No, there is no way Canon is going to squander its market-share with that kind of short-sightedness.

Canon has extended the period of "no new development" for EF lenses. That is way short of stopping production. Canon introduced the EF system in 1987. The last FD camera came off the production line in 1992. If they were still making FD cameras, they were still making FD lens, well after the introduction of EF. And EF was a total improvement over FD. RF is not yet poised to displace EF.

Again, today's consumer market is not the same as it was in the 80's and 90's. Just look at all technology around you. Every other month or so we see newer updates to practically every item of technology we own!

Also, when Canon transitioned from FD to EF it was still a film market. Cameras were merely light tight boxes for lenses/film. Advances in AF technology (think EOS) is what caused Canon to transition from FD to EF lenses.

As you are very well aware, cameras today are no different from any other "disposable " item of newer technology. I still own five D200's and two Nikon D1X's. They were state of the art when released but are now considered obsolete. One of my D200's was even still new in the box it came in until last year when I decided to let kids use it for a photo club I run. If you go on specs alone, my old D200's are incapable of even producing an image compared to even the cheapest of new DSLR's on the market today!

That "newer is better, older is bad" mentality is what rules the market today. Like cellphones, laptops and other digital technology, cameras of today are no different. If the technology marketing gurus say that mirrorless is the new trend, most (the vast majority) of people will follow like money-spending sheep.

Then the logical course for a company that wants to remain profitable is to stick with what sells. R lenses will be marketed directly and indirectly (through forums and major sports/news events showing pros with their new equipment).

By all means please feel free to visit this thread again in 3 years to see if any of what I mentioned came to happen.

Production facilities have to be retooled for RF lenses, they don’t just switch to new technology without consideration for production/demand. EF lenses are cheaper to produce, and since Canon has just introduced another EF mount camera, there isn’t evidence that they will be dropping all EF lens support immediately. I also don’t agree with your summation that all EF lenses and cameras are made to be disposables. There are people who still use early generation EF lenses, and even DSLRs. My 135mm EF hasn’t had a model upgrade, and it’s working fine after 14+ years of ownership (and Canon has been producing the same model for years).

I don't understand what's going on in this thread? EF lenses ain't going anywhere, and if/when Canon decides to end the EF mount altogether I'm going to buy the lenses I want at a steep discount.
Secondly, why so much redundancy? That's a whole lot of money wrapped up in depreciating, 'disposable' electronics. If I was in your shoes [OP], I'd ditch all the Nikon stuff ASAP - I tried to do Canon and Nikon simultaneously and it was impossible for me to go back and fourth - the controls are polar opposite. I would just focus on what makes you content now and not try to predict the future.

I am curious, however. Which lens is Canon missing from the EF lineup that you are interested in? Also consider that with the change to mirrorless, your EF lenses still have relevance no and far into the future. I've been spending money on old Minolta glass (SR) because I like to shoot film and I know that some time down the road I'll be using them on a mirrorless camera. Mirrorless means all your lenses are still relevant in 3 years, 5 years, 10 years, etc..

Is op asking which company is going to make new DSLR lenses longer?
Is it for collecting?
I have around ten for both in total and it is way too many for use.

It's complicated...!

I have been a Nikon user for many years (since 1984- prior to that I had a Pentax outfit). Since 1984 I have purchased many lenses (AiS first, then AF-D lenses). Only DX lens I own is a Nikon 17-55mm f2.8. I didn't purchase all my Nikon stuff at one specific time though; it took around 30 years or so!

My current Nikon DX bodies are used mostly by my photo club kids (two D1X's, four D200's, four 28-105mm f3.4/4.5 AF-D's).

Some time ago I was looking for a lightweight travel camera, so I purchased an Olympus EPL3 (hated it, melted the first week of owning it). Purchased a Panasonic G3/two-lens outfit, but I never really cared for the images I got with it (too pixilated, smeared details even at lower ISO's). Then got a Canon T3i/two-lens outfit for travel (bigger sensor than the G3). Soon after I got a Canon T6/two-lens outfit because it was on sale and was lighter than the T3i. Then Amazon had a sale on the Lumix GX85/two-lens outfit...another attempt at the illusive "perfect travel camera".

I decided it was time to upgrade as I was shooting mostly sports (non paid work). Nikon had nothing to offer (only the D300S at that time). So, I decided to plunge into Canon with a 7dmk2, 16-35mm f4.0L, 70-200mm f2.8L. Two months later Nikon released the D500. Had I known that Nikon was going to produce the D500, I would not have purchased that 7dmk2. This thread would not have even existed because I would have continued using Nikon.

Then I purchased a Canon EF-S 17-55mm f2.8 because it was on sale. (Comparable to my Nikon 17-55mm f2.8 AF-S DX)

Fast forward a year or so and I spotted the D750 on sale. I thought it would be nice to have a full frame body to use with all my Nikon lenses I have accumulated since 1984.

A freak cycling accident back in November caused me to give up mountain biking, so I sold my mountain bike. With that money I purchased a new Nikon 55mm f2.8 AiS Micro. I got a bad copy, so I returned it to B&H and requested a gift credit as I knew I was going to eventually buy something photography related from them anyway. Almost immediately I noticed they had the Canon 6dmk2 on sale!! I went to my local BestBuy and tried out the 6dmk2 and the RP side by side. I loved the feel and look of the 6dmk2 in my hands! Researched a bit more and decided it was a better camera than the RP for my needs, so I purchased it from B&H.

I have only owned the 6dmk2 for about a month now. I have been using it side by side with my D750.

Yes, it is mind-numbing having to go from one camera to the other; both cameras have controls in different places, even mounting the lenses is opposite! Absurd as it may seem, I actually enjoy the challenge. It keeps my mind sharp...

I enjoy sports photography, however I am frequently asked to do portraits and weddings (been shooting weddings on and off since 1985). At some point I would like to get a 300mm f2.8. I would hate to spend money on a lens like that to then find out (like my luck in the past has proven) that it can no longer be used on newer bodies.

Yes, Canon has an adapter that can fit EF to R, but I'm sure Canon is going to produce a 300mm f2.8 R in the near future. It would not be a smart idea for me to spend a small fortune on an EF now if everything will change in a year or two to R.

As for dumping all my Nikon equipment, that would make sense. However, Nikon seems to be committed to continue to produce F mount lenses together with Z mount lenses. The big question then is will that really even matter if Nikon goes out of business? Also, I get crazy sharp images with that D750 and all my old Nikon lenses! Way, way sharper (pixel peeping) than my 6dmk2. Colors are nicer with my 6dmk2 though...

All this is speculation on my part. I just don't want to invest more money on a dying system (EF or F). Don't get me wrong, I love both my Canon and Nikon outfits, but I'm not ready to take the plunge into full frame mirrorle$$ at this time.

kf095 wrote in post #18989734
Is op asking which company is going to make new DSLR lenses longer?
Is it for collecting?
I have around ten for both in total and it is way too many for use.

Nope. Not for collecting. See my detailed response to Lucky7 from a few minutes ago.

snegron wrote in post #18989834
It's complicated...!

I have been a Nikon user for many years (since 1984- prior to that I had a Pentax outfit). Since 1984 I have purchased many lenses (AiS first, the AF-D lenses). Only DX lens I own is a Nikon 17-55mm f2.8. I didn't purchase all my Nikon stuff at one specific time; it took around 30 years or so!


>SNIP<

You're quite the gear collector ...

Can you point to one camera that you picked up again and again and, if so, why?

I personally strongly believe there is much to be said for picking one camera/set of gear and sticking with it. I learned very early on, in the context of CAD software decades ago, that most times we bleat about a product, blame it for all kinds of problems, when in fact the problem was us and our fickle nature. When you force yourself to master the thing completely, it can be surprising how many of those supposed problems go away.

It's also a good way to exercise your mind and creativity!

Very good question! Both the 6dmk2 and D750 are relatively new to me, so I find myself using both of them equally. This is mostly due to me testing them every chance I get.

The D750 controls are very familiar to me because of using Nikon for so many years. The 6dmk2 feels like a much lighter version of my 7dmk2.

If I had to choose just one camera I think I would implode!

As for which camera I used the most prior to the D750 and the 6dmk2, it was the 7dmk2 for indoor sports. For travel (road trip by car), I took the 7dmk2 and a Nikon D200. For travel by air I took either the Canon T6 or the Lumix GX85. For weekend theme park trips (Disney), I take either the T6 or the GX85 depending on what camera bag I take (bag depends on the weather; if there is a chance of rain I go with a larger bag to accommodate a raincoat and the GX85 and a waterproof Lumix point & shoot. If it will be sunny or large crowds expected I go with a smaller bag and the T6 because the images will turn out better).

If it's a trip of a lifetime (in the U.S), I would take the D750. The sharpness is absolutely amazing! If it's a trip of a lifetime (outside the U.S.) I would take the T6, the GX85 and the waterproof point & shoot.

Next week I will be shooting a soccer game. I plan on taking my 7dmk2 and 6dmk2 as a backup. This weekend I would like to take pics at a local art festival then go shoot a few pics of birds/wildlife; for that I'll be taking my D750.

All these cameras perform differently, kind of like either different musical instruments or similar instruments in different key notes. They each perform very well in different categories. The two most similar are the 6dmk2 and the D750. However, I can count on the D750 to produce insanely sharp images, but the skin tones of the 6dmk2 are amazing!

p.s. I'm not so much of a gear collector than I am a gear accumulator! I use all my gear (except for my old Nikon film bodies).

I think you might be a hoarder, lol.
My sister has the same 'problem' when things are 'on sale,' haha. She just can't resist...! It ends up costing her a LOT more in the long run.

I still recommend picking one and getting rid of the other. If you choose the D750, figure out how to make the skin tones more pleasing. If you choose the 6DII, figure out how to get sharper images. Figure out which 2-3 lenses get the most use, get rid of the rest.

The best thing I ever did was get rid of everything and use a 5D 'classic' and a 35mm prime for a year. Lots of limitations to overcome, and lots to learn in the process. Today my travel camera is a Fuji X100F. There's a lot of limiting factors with the X100 series, and that is the best part.

Canon completely pissed on their loyal users corn flakes when they changed from the FD mount even though there was absolutely nothing wrong with it. Nikon, their mirrorless crap aside, have stuck with the F mount since 1959. When you have invented perfection, why screw with it? I have numerous film cameras, from my original FTN to the F4 and a D700, D7100, D500 and D850 and ALL of my AIS Nikkors, from 8mm fisheye to 600mm telephoto STILL work flawlessly with them. How can you ask for better than that?

There's not a clear answer about what was best with getting AF. Canon's approach was like ripping tape off the skin quickly. Every EOS camera is fully compatible with EF lenses (old camera with new lens, or new camera with old lens). Nikon is more complicated if you're looking for AF compatibility. I've met several people getting into photography not knowing about the Nikon nomenclature and if their body has an AF motor.

Still haven't made up my mind about which route I'll be taking regarding a 300mm f2.8. In the meantime I just purchased an EF 85mm f1.8 USM new from B&H for my 6dmk2. Did a few initial test shots compared to my Nikon 85mm f1.8 AF-D on my D750 and came up with the same results as with my previously tested lenses in both brands; Nikon images appear truer in terms of color and sharpness is insane. Canon images are much more pleasing in terms of color; much more suited for portraits and wedding images. In the near future I would like to post a thread with images comparing both outfits.

So, now both my Nikon and Canon systems are complete for my shooting style. Only thing missing is that 300mm f2.8 in either Nikon or Canon! Probably going to rent one of each brand to get a better feel for which direction to go. And no, I can't afford to buy a 300mm f2.8 in both brands!

ScottMurphy wrote in post #18991343
Canon completely pissed on their loyal users corn flakes when they changed from the FD mount even though there was absolutely nothing wrong with it. Nikon, their mirrorless crap aside, have stuck with the F mount since 1959.

Looking back, Canon was struggling #2 in the photography market with their FD mount products. For decades Nikon was a strong #1 in the marketplace.

1. Canon theoretically 'pissed off' their loyal base of users with the launch of the EOS bodies and lenses in the 1980s
   
2. Canon then moved beyond Nikon to take the #1 position in the market, while Nikon (who kept its users very happy with continuity of the F mount) fell back to #2, and Nikon has never yet recovered.
   

Nikon might have been considered#1 in professional sales, but I don’t think Canon was struggling with the FD mount. The best selling camera of all time was an FD mount after all.