Canon R7 rumors - APS-C?

Trique Daddi wrote in post #19210155
I shoot High School football at night with a 7DMKII and a 70-200mm 2.8. I have enough saved up for an R6 but can't afford the loss in focal length. I know the higher ISO capability of the R6 is tremendous but the lens choices for shooting under the lights are limited! I will buy a 100-500mm but at 7.1 I am not convinced the R6 will be clean enough shooting at such a high ISO. Not even sure what it would require! Just waiting!

The R6 will be cleaner, but at a greatly reduced pixel density. If you crop out a 1.6 from an R6, you will only have an 8Mpx result vs a 20Mpx result. Once you equalize the two, the delta between the two won't likely be good enough to warranty the switch and the cost, IMO. However if you only need 8Mpx results from your sports shots, then I would have a different answer.

Your situation is exactly why I kept the 5D4, at least I don't lose as many pixels on target (12Mpx 1.6 crop), but also at a stop or more cleaner ISO. The R5 is likely a better option for what you need quite frankly.

According to Bill Claff's data, the 90D sensor and an R6 sensor cropped to APS-C are essentially identical in performance.

Given that the 90D will have 32Mp to play with and the R6 only 9.4Mp, you will most likely be better off with the 90D sensor for the odd time when everything lines up in an exposure and you can make some use of the extra resolution.

russbecker wrote in post #19210321
According to Bill Claff's data, the 90D sensor and an R6 sensor cropped to APS-C are essentially identical in performance.

...

This makes absolutely no logical sense in any way.

I am merely reporting what Bill Claff's data shows. My interpretation is that the underlying electronic architecture of both sensors is the same generation, so for a given sensor area, APS-C in this case, you get the same measured DR as a function of amplifier gain. With the current generation sensors, Canon has made considerable gains in reducing readout noise bringing their sensors in line with those from Sony.

The R6 will show more DR than the 90D if you can utilize the entire sensor area of the R6, i.e. sink some money into a longer lens. If you have to crop the R6 to APS-C, then the performance from a DR perspective is essentially identical.

russbecker wrote in post #19210760
I am merely reporting what Bill Claff's data shows. .

Understood, my comment was not aimed at the messenger, but rather the source.

I agree the R5 would be a better solution but Canon has priced me out of the market! With out a lens solution for the R6 and the higher cost of the R5. I wait and save! Very disappointing!

CyberDyneSystems wrote in post #19210931
Understood, my comment was not aimed at the messenger, but rather the source.

agreed

The trouble with the net is any crack pot can be an expert and spout off information thats just rubbish......Just look at Ken Rockwell. Nuff said

TeamSpeed wrote in post #19145132
There will never be RFS lenses, ever.

https://www.usa.canon.​com …-s18-45mm-f4-5-6-3-is-stm

Yup, I already ate my hat on that one! And it looks like to keep their costs down (not ours necessarily), there won't even be an MF/AF switch on the lenses. So these will have either an IS switch or nothing at all on them, very basic in form.

That is the only thing that would have made sense to me, just making RFS lenses after what we have today wouldn't, but having very "cheap" (from a manufacturing standpoint), zero switches, lenses does make sense.

^^^^There's an AF/MF switch on the new cameras (R7 & R10).

Lou

Yes, that was what prompted my comment about that. When the photos were leaked, I had already drawn that conclusion, due to it being the only logical conclusion (so not a very far stretch of the imagination), and it seems the release info confirms it.

Not sure how I feel, because I suspect also as part of the cost savings, you won't have both AF and MF at the same time, either the lens is AF and your input to the focus ring is ignored, or you have full MF focus. Some EFS lenses are like that already but I suspect maybe all RFS lenses will now be that way. No coding around "did the focus ring change while we were AF the lens? Yes? Ok honor their input and override our own focusing decisions for a few seconds"... Very simple lenses, but the prices probably won't quite reflect that simplicity, we shall see.

The best thing Canon could probably do is replace many of the EFM lenses with slightly different but similar versions. So the 15-45 could become a 12-55mm perhaps, and the 55-200 could become a 60-250, etc and as long as the IQ is outstanding, they will sell and EFM owners might switch.

TeamSpeed wrote in post #19381981
Yup, I already ate my hat on that one! And it looks like to keep their costs down (not ours necessarily), there won't even be an MF/AF switch on the lenses. So these will have either an IS switch or nothing at all on them, very basic in form.

That is the only thing that would have made sense to me, just making RFS lenses after what we have today wouldn't, but having very "cheap" (from a manufacturing standpoint), zero switches, lenses does make sense.

A lot of this control-from-the body stuff seems OK until you try to use the lens you paid for on something other than a Canon body. I was thinking to myself one day while out and about, "when I go home, I have to try to remember to try my Lens2Scope adapter on the the RF800/11. Then, I remembered that the Lens2Scope is EF mount. So, I thought, "now we need an RF Lens2Scope", and then I remembered that the RF800/11 is focus-by-wire. Can't use it with my Pentax Q, either. Even if someone 3D-prints an adapter, I can't focus the lens.

John Sheehy wrote in post #19382555
A lot of this control-from-the body stuff seems OK until you try to use the lens you paid for on something other than a Canon body. I was thinking to myself one day while out and about, "when I go home, I have to try to remember to try my Lens2Scope adapter on the the RF800/11. Then, I remembered that the Lens2Scope is EF mount. So, I thought, "now we need an RF Lens2Scope", and then I remembered that the RF800/11 is focus-by-wire. Can't use it with my Pentax Q, either. Even if someone 3D-prints an adapter, I can't focus the lens.

Yes, this begs the question how would one use these RFS lenses on a FF RF body? Sure it could go into crop mode, but what do you do about the lens MF vs AF?

TeamSpeed wrote in post #19382556
Yes, this begs the question how would one use these RFS lenses on a FF RF body? Sure it could go into crop mode, but what do you do about the lens MF vs AF?

Good question. Maybe firmware will be updated on FF RF cameras to do it electronically, or maybe the option is already in firmware, never revealed because no one ever put an RF-s lens on their camera. Or, it could just be AF-only with no MF option except maybe manual override.

John Sheehy wrote in post #19382584
Good question. Maybe firmware will be updated on FF RF cameras to do it electronically, or maybe the option is already in firmware, never revealed because no one ever put an RF-s lens on their camera. Or, it could just be AF-only with no MF option except maybe manual override.

Canon anticipated this problem. In the R6 manual it says that for RF lenses without an MF/AF switch you can choose MF or AF in AF menu #2: Focus Mode. There is no such option now so I assume a lens without focus switch needs to be attached for the option to become available.

EDIT: Screenshot from the manual

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