An online petition asking Adobe to sell Camera Raw alone

gjl711 wrote in post #19324342
I'm curious, what would one use support for other than license or billing issues? I am one who never calls support other than the reasons I mentioned. Anything install or use, I go straight to the web and can solve my problem in minutes with a few searches.

Licence and billing issues.

Get over Adobe! There are other raw conversion's. I use and love Affinity Photo. Nothing much else to say, other than Fast Stone, Darktable. Let go man, I did and don't regret it. There are many free ones that do the job.
David

stronics wrote in post #19324383
Get over Adobe! There are other raw conversion's. I use and love Affinity Photo. Nothing much else to say, other than Fast Stone, Darktable. Let go man, I did and don't regret it. There are many free ones that do the job.
David

Why get over it. Between ISO Adaptive presets and Auto (which is AI) I can export a decent looking file in seconds if I need to. Personal website integrated with LR. New advanced masking. That’s just a few things to mention they have added over the years.

I like the product and don’t plan to give it up just yet. I have planned back ups if I do. Affinity is one that I have but don’t use.

stronics wrote in post #19324383
Get over Adobe! There are other raw conversion's. I use and love Affinity Photo. Nothing much else to say, other than Fast Stone, Darktable. Let go man, I did and don't regret it. There are many free ones that do the job.
David

I have a licenses for Affinity Photo and have used it often, however, when it comes to raw processing software the minimal development tool set of Affinity's Develop persona is just too limiting and compares poorly to the top of the line converter/processors like ACR, Lightroom, Capture One and PhotoLab, etc.. It is by far the weakest link in the otherwise excellent Affinity Photo..

digital paradise wrote in post #19324301
I've always had good support with Adobe. Had a few instances with DXO telling me too bad. May be it was just bad luck but I'm far from impressed. I'll never get over only getting 9 months use out of PL3. Adobe has been getting slapped all over the place since 2017 but when I bring that up nothing. Excuses but nothing ever negative, on any forums.

I don't understand this comment. Did your version of PL3 stop working after 9 months? DxO is on an annual upgrade cycle, but their previous versions keep working. They just do not add new cameras to the old version. Adobe did the same thing with Lightroom when it was a perpetual license application, with the only exception being their upgrade cycle was longer than once per year. DxO's upgrades are less expensive, though -- about $50 if you buy them during their Black Friday sale, which is soon after a new version is released.

Scott M wrote in post #19324517
I don't understand this comment. Did your version of PL3 stop working after 9 months? DxO is on an annual upgrade cycle, but their previous versions keep working. They just do not add new cameras to the old version. Adobe did the same thing with Lightroom when it was a perpetual license application, with the only exception being their upgrade cycle was longer than once per year. DxO's upgrades are less expensive, though -- about $50 if you buy them during their Black Friday sale, which is soon after a new version is released.

Yes it did. I purchased PL3 in the fall of 2019. The R5 came out in August of 2020. No RAW support until PL4 came out in November which I would had to pay for to use the software. Since I had sold all my EF gear before I got the R5 (I had an R) the software was useless. Both Adobe and C1 pro came out with RAW support within 6 weeks.

DXO did not get my money again. If they had released RAW support in a timely manor or had at least provided RAW support after PL4 I could still be using PL3 today. I might not have deep prime but I could still use it. Even Prime is very good.

In my books getting to use perpetual software forever and having a choice to upgrade is a myth.

digital paradise wrote in post #19324644
Yes it did. I purchased PL3 in the fall of 2019. The R5 came out in August of 2020. No RAW support until PL4 came out in November which I would had to pay for to use the software. Since I had sold all my EF gear before I got the R5 (I had an R) the software was useless. Both Adobe and C1 pro came out with RAW support within 6 weeks.

DXO did not get my money again. If they had released RAW support in a timely manor or had at least provided RAW support after PL4 I could still be using PL3 today. I might not have deep prime but I could still use it. Even Prime is very good.

In my books getting to use perpetual software forever and having a choice to upgrade is a myth.

With a perpetual license, you can decide when to upgrade based on your needs and what the upgrade supports. With a subscription, you are paying regardless of whether you need an upgrade. And based on DxO's upgrade pricing, it's much less expensive to upgrade ($50 - $70, depending on which sale you get) than paying for a year's subscription with Adobe.

DxO does have their flaws -- the main one for me is that they are slower in adding support for new cameras -- but their pricing model is not flawed, IMO. I upgraded to PL5 this year for $50, as I am changing over from EF to RF mounts over the next few months. Unless DxO adds a new feature that's attractive to me, though, I will probably pass on PL6 next autumn.

Adobe's pricing model works well, depending on what services you actually use from that subscription. In my case, I only used Lightroom to process my RAW files. I never used its DAM feature, didn't need Adobe's cloud storage, or PhotoShop. Once Adobe went to a subscription model, the pricing was just too high for what I was using it for.

Scott M wrote in post #19324651
With a perpetual license, you can decide when to upgrade based on your needs and what the upgrade supports. With a subscription, you are paying regardless of whether you need an upgrade. And based on DxO's upgrade pricing, it's much less expensive to upgrade ($50 - $70, depending on which sale you get) than paying for a year's subscription with Adobe.

DxO does have their flaws -- the main one for me is that they are slower in adding support for new cameras -- but their pricing model is not flawed, IMO. I upgraded to PL5 this year for $50, as I am changing over from EF to RF mounts over the next few months. Unless DxO adds a new feature that's attractive to me, though, I will probably pass on PL6 next autumn.

Adobe's pricing model works well, depending on what services you actually use from that subscription. In my case, I only used Lightroom to process my RAW files. I never used its DAM feature, didn't need Adobe's cloud storage, or PhotoShop. Once Adobe went to a subscription model, the pricing was just too high for what I was using it for.

Is that so? Did I have a choice to upgrade in the fall of 2020 or did DXO "force" me to upgrade so I could use their software? This is the first time I have ever used the word force. Since 2017 I've seen it used a thousand times about Adobe. I don't recall Adobe sending Don Corleone to make sign up for subscription Thought I'd have some fun with it.

Just like there are people you will never, ever convince that subscription is a good thing, you will never convince me that what DXO did was OK. I respect their views and decisions and I would hope to get the same in return. Waiting from August until November and then asking for more money was completely unreasonable. Anyone trying to convince me otherwise is wasting their time.

I'm dropping my Spotify subscription too. I'm paying for millions of songs that I'll never listen to. I could use that money to buy an album every couple of months.

drsilver wrote in post #19324664
I'm dropping my Spotify subscription too. I'm paying for millions of songs that I'll never listen to. I could use that money to buy an album every couple of months.

We have considered getting it but we are not sure. The new trend I don't like is now they show the first few episodes of a series on cable. Then you have to pay for a streaming service to see rest. Now we record new shows and wait to see if they fill up before we start watching.

We had Netflix for quite some time but never really appreciated until the pandemic. A lot decent programming. I'm not a big fan of Bezos but we broke down because of the last year and again some decent programming. I wonder why I pay so much for cable especially when I have to look at the station banners and they now slip in commercials. I might have to re-subscribe for Boba Fett but I'm on the fence about that. That is about our limit.

I keep calling my cable company trying to find ways to save money. Once a year all I need to say is CRTC (Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission) and I get $20 a month off the bill for a year. A few years back the CRTC ruled customers should not be forced into bundle programming and be able to choose individual stations. Of course the cable companies somehow forgot to change that on their sites. We like HBO but don't need Crave. That is a bundle so when I complain they knock off the $20

digital paradise wrote in post #19324660
Is that so? Did I have a choice to upgrade in the fall of 2020 or did DXO "force" me to upgrade so I could use their software? This is the first time I have ever used the word force. Since 2017 I've seen it used a thousand times about Adobe. I don't recall Adobe sending Don Corleone to make sign up for subscription Thought I'd have some fun with it.

Just like there are people you will never, ever convince that subscription is a good thing, you will never convince me that what DXO did was OK. I respect their views and decisions and I would hope to get the same in return. Waiting from August until November and then asking for more money was completely unreasonable. Anyone trying to convince me otherwise is wasting their time.

Actually, if you wanted to continue to use Adobe's updated products, you were forced into a subscription. My copy of Lightroom 6 doesn't support my current equipment. I have to pay for a subscription if I want to use LR for that equipment.

Subscriptions work for some people, but not for everyone. In my case, if I pass on next year's PL6 upgrade as I plan, I will spend $50 over 2 years for using PhotoLab. By contrast, it would cost me $200 for an Adobe subscription over that same time period.

Scott M wrote in post #19324673
Actually, if you wanted to continue to use Adobe's updated products, you were forced into a subscription. My copy of Lightroom 6 doesn't support my current equipment. I have to pay for a subscription if I want to use LR for that equipment.

Subscriptions work for some people, but not for everyone. In my case, if I pass on next year's PL6 upgrade as I plan, I will spend $50 over 2 years for using PhotoLab. By contrast, it would cost me $200 for an Adobe subscription over that same time period.

I didn't feel forced as I didn't have to get the subscription. I almost didn't but there were things that made it worth it. Based on your statement you are then saying DXO forced me as well because PL3 was dead after 9 months.

Of course subscriptions are not for everyone. I have said that many times here and I don't care what anyone uses. You may pass every other other year and I wish I had the choice with DXO the last go around. I never passed when I had a perpetual licence as I liked the latest offerings. I read a lot of forums and people can hardly wait to get the new version every fall. It's how DXO and others survive.

It's not about the money. I've spent thousands on camera gear so software is a nothing. It's about customer service and I just don't like DXO when it comes to that. Not the first time they ticked me off. Just like some don't and will never like Adobe. When Adobe ticks me off then I'll drop them like a hot potato. It's only 15 seconds to the cancel plan button.

I had a website via Zenfolio that cost me $150 a year. The plan comes with a personal website which is integrated with LrC. It costs me less every year to subscribe. There is a big benefit to me.

If the Creative Cloud bundle was, say, $30/mo, but they offered LR by itself for $10/mo, would you feel better about that?

drsilver wrote in post #19324696
If the Creative Cloud bundle was, say, $30/mo, but they offered LR by itself for $10/mo, would you feel better about that?

?? The photography plan that includes Lr and Ps and a number of other applications (desktop and mobile) and features is $9.99/mo. Occasionally, one of the retailers like B&H offer it at a discount that amounts to about $7.99/mo. It's a bargain in my opinion for what you get.

davinci953 wrote in post #19324771
?? The photography plan that includes Lr and Ps and a number of other applications (desktop and mobile) and features is $9.99/mo. Occasionally, one of the retailers like B&H offer it at a discount that amounts to about $7.99/mo. It's a bargain in my opinion for what you get.

That was my point. A big beef here is, "I don't want to pay for stuff I don't use." The whole CC bundle is already $10/mo. How much lower would they expect Adobe to go with a la carte offerings?

I'm with you. I think the CC subscription is the best value in photography. But if someone is philosophically opposed to the subscription model, they'll need to find a different vendor.