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FORUMS Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon Digital Cameras 
Thread started 16 Nov 2003 (Sunday) 19:28
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Nov 17, 2003 17:15 |  #16

scottbergerphoto wrote:
vvizard wrote:
Cool! Thanks for the info. Didn't know this. That can make me use "M" with great success I think. But on the other hand, that raises another question in my little mind. What's the big point about "M" if you're gonna follow what the camera say? Won't the exposure then be exactly what the camera would have used in "Av" or "Tv", if I chose the same aparture or shutter-time (depending on program)? And my take is that in Av, the camera can set the exposure helluva lot faster than I can in "M" =)

The camera meter and any incident or reflected light meter is calibrated for 18% grey. Most scenes average out to 18% grey, so usually your camera meter does a pretty good job of exposure on its own. There are however many siuations where the meter is correct for 18% grey but not for your intended image. Snow, a black suit, landscapes with a bright blue sky are examples. You have to read the camera or light meter reading and then decide how your scene differs from 18% grey. Meter readings must be interpreted. Black/dark objects need to be exposed less and white/light colored objects need to be exposed more then the meter would have you believe. The majority of pictures I took in this gallery ( http://www.pbase.com …reen_wood_cemet​ary&page=1 (external link)) would have been terribly overexposed in the blue sky if I followed the camera meter or the incident meter I was using. The relative darker landscape told the camera meter to give more exposure, which would have resulted in a white sky. That's why using Manual exposure and understanding what the camera meter is telling you is critical to getting correctly exposed pictures.
I highly recommend reading:" The Confused Photographers Guide to the Zone System", by Farzad.
Enjoy,
Scott

Just walking out of the darkroom and coming from a black & white background, this is the way I would approach it. Even using the computer to "punch up" a photograph is a lot like dodging and burning in the darkroom.




  
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CyberDyneSystems
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Nov 17, 2003 17:34 |  #17

RFMSports wrote:
Creative Zones! Oh my, that will display a full can of worms. Some people think the creative zones are the devil himself reborn! Actually they aren't all that useful for some of us, but I have found that by playing with a few of them, knowing what their default settings and goals are, that there are some circumstances where I can flip right over to one of them and actually find it useful.

Most folks wish Canon would have let us program our own creative zones. Personally I think that's an awesome idea, but in the meantime, I do use them, but very rarely.

I think you have your zones in a muddle :D

I bet you use the "Creative" zone most of the time :)

That's Manual, TV, AV, and P,.... :)


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Canuck
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Nov 17, 2003 17:46 |  #18

RFMSports wrote:
You may learn more technical stuff about photography, but it won't help you at all the learn more about your camera. The best way to learn your camera is to learn what it can do and what it can't. Learn its limitations and work within those limitations to maximize your talent.

Read, read, read. There is a new magazine out (paper) that's called Digital Photo Pro. Looks to be pretty good so far with some great articles. You might check that out.

Get out and shoot and don't be afraid to experiment. Go against the grain and the rules and shoot what you want. If the rules say 1/125 f8. then shoot 1/15 at F32, or whatever. It's digital, you're not wasting film. Go wild and get creative. It's a freaking blast to shoot these cameras.

I wholeheartedly agree with these statements. By all means play with the camera, that's why you got it! See what it can and can't do, and figure out its boundaries!
You know about the exposure and bellshaped curve? I have had a lot of really good pics that are nothing like that bellshaped curve. Go figure. I go like this, especially digital. Take the pic. If you mess it up, try again, and again till you get it right. That's why I like landscape shots. It is not like they are going to move anytime soon! On the other hand, if you are going for raere shots like I was for Concorde, there are a ton of other planes coming in every 45 seconds so you set up from that and hope for the best. It takes experience. I have to admit, it took me a few hundred pics to get it the way I was looking and seeing how this camera acts in situations. It can be frustrating, but it is worth the frustration, the end of the day! I had a problem taking pics of Carreg Cennen Castle in Wales. I was just learning how to use the Sigma 120-300mm F2.8 EX and got some really crap shots the first time. It took some negoitating to get back that way as it was really outof the way for where we were going on the second trip to Wales. Wales is awesome! I hope to get back there eventually.

Cheers form England,
Canuck




  
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xxlt
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Nov 18, 2003 18:56 |  #19

*Come on!....This has been a Great thread..Let's hear your insights and feelings*
Your inspiration is really flowing ...much better reading than a how-2 book. :)

bill rom Ohio




  
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Canuck
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Nov 18, 2003 19:41 |  #20

xxlt wrote:
*Come on!....This has been a Great thread..Let's hear your insights and feelings*
Your inspiration is really flowing ...much better reading than a how-2 book. :)

bill rom Ohio

True enough! You have real people of varying ablilities and real time feeback on what has been said and can ask for clarification and other questions and get answers too. The book is one sided in that it is finite in what is in the book. Here this isn't the finite that the book is and can learn tons. I definitely have and the end of the day it makes one a much better photographer. It could be said that I'm a keen amateur photographer. Gotta get back to playing w/ my Canon EOS 10D and Sigma EX or Canon L glass.

Cheers from England,
Canuck




  
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defordphoto
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Nov 18, 2003 19:48 |  #21

CyberDyneSystems wrote:
RFMSports wrote:
Creative Zones! Oh my, that will display a full can of worms. Some people think the creative zones are the devil himself reborn! Actually they aren't all that useful for some of us, but I have found that by playing with a few of them, knowing what their default settings and goals are, that there are some circumstances where I can flip right over to one of them and actually find it useful.

Most folks wish Canon would have let us program our own creative zones. Personally I think that's an awesome idea, but in the meantime, I do use them, but very rarely.

I think you have your zones in a muddle :D

I bet you use the "Creative" zone most of the time :)

That's Manual, TV, AV, and P,.... :)

Yeah yeah. That's what I think I meant. :) I meant those 'other' zones with the shapes of joggers and flowers and crap on them. Those pre-programmed things are whatever the heck they're called


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JMSetzler
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Nov 18, 2003 19:53 |  #22

I would not particularly suggest using the M mode and the trial and error method of learning. It would take a long time for you to be able to associate the changes you have made with the results you are getting. I would suggest reading and learning about exposure first, and then the M mode will be understandable :)

http://webpages.charte​r.net/setzler/exposure​.pdf (external link)

My own tutorial text on this topic...




  
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defordphoto
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Nov 18, 2003 21:40 |  #23

By all means we should all trial-and-error. That's how you learn what really works and what really doesn't. In the meantime we should also read, read, read.

Tutorials are fine and your's looks to be quite well done, but in knowing and learning the so-called rules I always encourage photographers to not be afraid to bend, break and even snap those rules for the sake of art.

Many times the perfect photo with the perfect light and the perfect sharpness and the perfect exposure is so clinical it borders on the mundane,

Screw the rule of the thirds! Screw the must-be-handheld formulas. Sometimes, yes sometimes let that photo be soft-focused. Crank up the ISO and use the grain. Relish the grain. Overexpose and blowout the highlights. Waste the details. Toss the $500 tripod away and handshoot at low speeds.

Sometimes we get so caught up in trying to shoot the Perfect Photo that we fail artistically.

And as a sidenote, to prevent any misunderstandings, this entire post was not directed at you JMSeltzer, but the discussion as a whole. This forum has been way too jumpy lately and I just want you to be sure that I was not jumping your case. Your tutorial looks nice and I'd encourage all beginners to give it a looksee and even print it out for reference.


defordphoto | Celebrating the art of photography®
SD500, 10D, 20D, 30D, 5D, 1DMKII, 1DMKIII
www.ussbaracing.com (external link) | www.rfmsports.com (external link) | www.nwfjcc.com (external link)
An austere and pleasant poetry of the real. Ansel Adams

  
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xxlt
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Nov 19, 2003 06:12 |  #24

Go here for your free gift: https://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthre​ad.php?t=20559

Happy Holiday's




  
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