100-400 or 200-500

ScottE wrote in post #2211440
It depends on your interests. If you just want to shoot elephant, giraffes and cape buffalo you may seldom need a 400 mm lens. If you want to shoot full frame pictures of a tiny klipspringer antelope on a distant rock bluff or a colourful bee eater in a not so distant bush, you will find that even a 500 mm lens on a 1.6x crop camera can be short.

Remember that in many African game parks you are not allowed to get out of you vehicle (tourists getting eaten by lions is bad for business) and vehicles are not allowed to drive off-road. You may be able to move your vehicle to get a clear shot around vegetation, but you cannot get any closer it the game is too far away for your longest lens. In Kruger in South Africa we got the evil eye from the rangers when we pulled off-road a short distance on a well worn bank to get photos of klipspringers on a cliff. If we had actually driven up the trail that went closer to the cliffs we would probably have received a sterner reprimand.

ScottE,

Thank you for your reply.

All of the larger animals would be delightful, but I am most intrigued by the cats with the occasional impala thrown in. In this case, if I wanted a variety of full body and closeups, what would you recommend?

Neilyb wrote in post #2211759
I have a Kenko TC, granted I lose quality but if I need it its there. I am not a pro and I already feel I have overspent on lenses.

Ssssshhhhh! My wife may be listening:p !

Neilyb wrote in post #2211759
I have a Kenko TC, granted I lose quality but if I need it its there. I am not a pro and I already feel I have overspent on lenses.

I have a 1.5X that sits in the bag for all those occasions. Emergency 600 f/8 IS sounds good to me (on new 100-400). I am very pleasantly surprised with the results from that TC, I recently posted a comparison on the 70-300 with and without TC.

I included a blind set of photos and asked readers to guess, so I wrote the answers right at the bottom. Yaknowwhat? As the photographer, I got the answers wrong even after pixel peeping the 100% crops. I mistakenly identified the feathers with TC as 'bare lens'...........

Now that, is a TC.

Ruffio wrote in post #2211845
ScottE,

Thank you for your reply.

All of the larger animals would be delightful, but I am most intrigued by the cats with the occasional impala thrown in. In this case, if I wanted a variety of full body and closeups, what would you recommend?

I prefer an EF-S body like the 30D because you get more performance out of your telephoto lenses than with a full frame body. Yes, I know you can crop the image from a full frame body, but you can also crop the image from a 30D and get an even closer shot.

In my opinion the choice of lens depends on the type of vehicle you use and your style of shooting. My trips have mostly been using a privately rented vehicle so I can use a window pod when shooting from the vehicle or a tripod when out side. For that reason I chose the Sigma 50-500 because it is both longer and shorter so you don't have to change lenses as often.

If I was going on a group type safari where you are shooting from the top of a Land Rover or the back of a Toyota truck I would choose the Canon 100-400 IS for its image stabilization because it is better for hand holding or shooting when other people are moving in vehicle.

I was in Uganda in August and the lenses I took were the 10-22, 17-55 f/2.8 and Sigma 50-500. I also took a device that clamps on the window and arm rest and mounts a ball head so I could mount my camera on the door. This setup gives complete coverage from 10 to 500 mm (16 to 800 mm full frame equivalent). The 50-500 was mounted on my camera all the time when we were on game drives. The 17-55 was used as a general purpose lens in cities and while hiking. I only put the 10-22 on when I needed to take super wide angle shots. Since we were also doing some mountain gorilla and chimpanzee trekking I also needed a faster telephoto lens for hand held shooting in dim jungle light. I took my 70-200 f/2.8 for that purpose. I got my 70-200 many years ago before the IS version was introduced and wished that I had got around to upgrading to IS when I was shooting gorillas.

ScottE,

Thanks again for your input. I think, in the final analysis, I will take a crop sensor body on that trip--whether that will be a 30D or the next upgrade we will see!

I am also undecided on the 5D / 350D question. The added weight of the 350 is negligible but comparing a cropped 5D pic and a 350D pic I am suprised how much better the 5D pic is in terms of sharpness and noise. I think my 350 D may be slightly off focus also. So really I am none too bothered about cropping if need be, I would rather have the quality. I have a 1.4 and 2x TC for emergencies, Kenko and the 1.4 seems to hold its own quality wise.

I think I may have convinced the GF the 100-400 is a great idea, she is worried tho that I will like it and not sell it on.

This is good reading so far:

Body: the 5D will produce better images with a greater emphasis on in/out of focus seperation than a crop sensor. (You will just need an appropriate lens for the distance)
Take a spare body, preferably a film body like the 3000V or whatever is around, and about 6 rolls of Kodak 100VS or E200 slide film (trust me on this)

For Botswana do not leave behind the 17-40. Leave the 24-105, take a 50mm prime (even 1.8 is more than acceptable) and the 100-400 or a 300f4is as well a sa 1.4X teleconverter.
If I could have only one lens, it would be the 300 f4is. Everything you photograph could be around the 300 mark, but in addition:

You will be photographing lions at close quaters, where you would use anything from 17 - 100mm.
Elephants will be around the 50mm or 200-400 mark,
Buffalo will be fleeing into bushes, to a distance where a 200mm will give you a full body shot.
Impala will require a 100mm - 150mm for full body, but you must be ready to shoot as the vehicle is stopping. then they will require a 300.
Good luck with those Klipspringer where youre going!

Landscape and scenery will benefit from the 17mm end, particularly when you look at the sky, you can get a foreground interest as well asmid scene and terrific sky.
For interiors of the amazing tents, and plane and lodges, you need a 17mm lens.
For insects and stuff, take along a 12 or 13mm extension tube to convert any lens into Macro (100-400)

As for tripod and mono pod: take one not both. I would choose a mono pod with a manfrotto G clamp and a ball head with QRP. As wella s a bungee chord to strap it to the roofrack, making it more stable

Also take a bean bag, those from the POD are great and come with a screw thread, leave the beans at home and fill in botswana with coffee beans, smells fresh all day.

Make sure you take a flash! daylight nightlight all the time.

For what its worth, I do run safaris into Kenya, and South Africa so have a good idea of what you want to be are dealing with, and my coments are based on experience with your (budget) and weight limitations in mind.

On the 100-400 lens, it is a magnificent vacuum, be aware that in dusty conditions it will draw in dust and spew it all over your mirror when you zoom in (push away), and if you zoom out (pull towards you), it will jetison (filtered) dusty air into your eye through the eye peice.
Put the 100-400 lens on inside your tent in the morning and dont take it off until your car has stopped and the dust has caught up and then settled down. Zoom as little as possible, but dont make a conscious effort, just minimise playing around.
Before removing the lens wipe the lens:camera area with a damp cloth to detract as much dust a possible.

I personally would prefer to buy a prime lens, because they will last longer, than a zoom in the long term. However there are exceptions: the 70-200f4 is great even with a 1.4X and the 70-300DOis for a lightweight walkies lens, its magic

As for your worries about price, I can only offer the coment that if you take the wrong equipment it will cost alot more to go out there again, so get it right first time (and take a film backup)
So list is:
5d
3000v
6 rolls of slide film
100-400
1.4x
17-40
50 1.8
12/13mm extension tube
550Ex flash
Monopod with QRP ball head
Manfrotto G clamp with brass 3/4-1/4 thread adapter
Bean bag (empty)
about 7kg's

Sometimes buffalo do not run off and sometimes it is handy to have a 500 mm lens on a 1.6x crop camera. Meet Ms Buffalo at the waterhole spa, getting a mud pack to enhance her beauty.

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On the 100-400 lens, it is a magnificent vacuum, be aware that in dusty conditions it will draw in dust and spew it all over your mirror when you zoom in (push away), and if you zoom out (pull towards you), it will jetison (filtered) dusty air into your eye through the eye peice.
Put the 100-400 lens on inside your tent in the morning and dont take it off until your car has stopped and the dust has caught up and then settled down. Zoom as little as possible, but dont make a conscious effort, just minimise playing around.
Before removing the lens wipe the lens:camera area with a damp cloth to detract as much dust a possible.

I already have problems of dust with 5D, one of my reservations with the 100-400 is just that! I will be taking my brushes and eclipse etc...but I am worried about dust getting in over the day showing up and getting worse. Thanks for this advice.

I am now wondering if I shouldn't get the 70-300 IS (which is the lens I have had, with the portrait problem, and still want as a light travel lens. I was happy with IQ and sharpness) This I would take along with the untrustworthy Tokina (which will hopefully be repaired) - which I would use if 400mm was needed. The film cam will stay behind I think, but the 350D will be in the bag as a backup.

17-40 and 50mm 1.8 sounds like a great combo, especially if I go the 70-300 route. As i am primarily an landscape photographer a tripod is my firend, but it is a heavy one, the money saved not buying 100-400 would get me a lighter alternative.

It's complex this safari business, just as well it is a once in a lifetime trip (till the next time )

Neilyb wrote in post #2220023
[I]On the 100-400 lens, it is a magnificent vacuum, be aware that in dusty conditions it will draw in dust and spew it all over your mirror when you zoom in (push away), and if you zoom out (pull towards you), it will jetison (filtered) dusty air into your eye through the eye peice.

That has got to be one of the most powerful pistons ever invented. It can propel a tiny dust particle with enough force to bounce off the mirror, pierce the focusing screen, blast through the prism and finally drill through the eyepiece diopter with enough residual energy to cause eye damage.

If you own a 100-400, hide it from the military. They may want to confiscate it and convert it into a devastating new weapon.

ScottE wrote in post #2226154
That has got to be one of the most powerful pistons ever invented. It can propel a tiny dust particle with enough force to bounce off the mirror, pierce the focusing screen, blast through the prism and finally drill through the eyepiece diopter with enough residual energy to cause eye damage.

If you own a 100-400, hide it from the military. They may want to confiscate it and convert it into a devastating new weapon.

Oh hush, stop giving away all the pro secrets, we may need to take back your decoder ring

All the REAL pros carry the 100-400 to fight off muggers after their gear. There's a reason to the push-pull yaknow, plus the dust particle will put 'em flat on the floor before they know what hit them, and leave no evidence.... "There's no way a speck of dust could'a gone straight through him!"

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Well it is decided. I am buying the 70-300 IS from Kerso. This will go with the 80-400 if it arrives in time. I tested my 24-105 with the 2x Kenko TC and even in my dark bedroom AF seemed to work fine, I am hoping that on the 70-300 in daylight this will also be the case. With this I will take 17-40, 350D, monopod, tripod(once i decide on a lighter version), 1.4 TC, 31mm extension tube, filters, 60GB hard disk storage, chargers. Once i have all together I will weigh and see where I am at.

Neilyb wrote in post #2228458
Well it is decided. I am buying the 70-300 IS from Kerso. This will go with the 80-400 if it arrives in time. I tested my 24-105 with the 2x Kenko TC and even in my dark bedroom AF seemed to work fine, I am hoping that on the 70-300 in daylight this will also be the case. With this I will take 17-40, 350D, monopod, tripod(once i decide on a lighter version), 1.4 TC, 31mm extension tube, filters, 60GB hard disk storage, chargers. Once i have all together I will weigh and see where I am at.

The 70-300 is a nice LONG zoom on the 350D. Surprised to hear you're not bringing the nicer 5D despite the better IQ. 17-40 is perfect on a 350D, although not an ultrawide like it is on full frame (it's just wide, but reasonably wide and will get the job done).

I dunno about your luck with TC's, but my 1.5X Kenko Teleplus SHQ did not work with the 70-300 on the 350D (motor sounds like it's gonna shake itself apart - yes, that alarming), and simply misses all the time on the 5D.

On no, I mean I am taking the 5D, probably not use the 350D so much but will carry it with the 70-300 on incase I need handheld and have no support. GF only has a 20D, 17-50 and 28-300 lenses and a cheap tripod, so she will be well within 12kg...I hope.

You got any shots from that 100-400 yet?

Well my Tokina 80-400 needs a part....so looks like I am stuck with newly recieved 70-300 IS and 2x TC. I will of course save on weight I will definately need the 350D for range.

On the up side my Manfrotto 714B tripod seems pretty stable, light and compact.