DOF/aperature and AF help

Hello everyone..Happy Holidays too! I am very new to all this because I was tired of deleting most pics of kids playing sports. Most all of my shots in fall/winter are low light outdoor/indoor respectively and usually from afar. I always stop down as far as she'll go and then try to set the iso low (200-400) and shutter usually around 125-250 (always hand held too) then "use my histogram) as a gauge. Does this approach sound about right?
Then of course, I have found just lately(last 2 weeks..using a XT w/nifty f/1.8 ) many are just OOF? I think I'm not letting the camera focus before shooting...well you get the jist of it, I tend to babble too much TIA!

Actually, I don't. In low light you'll want to open up your aperture to f/1.8 or so, not stop it down. You'll also want a higher ISO if it's dim.

What mode are you shooting in? Do you have some examples (with EXIF) to post?

I juess I didn't phrase that correctly I meant I always open the aperature to it's fullest (lowest f/#) to allow the most light, which is always not enough then use tv and iso to further lighten. It seems I am always extremely challenged due to lighting, distance, and lack of knowledge (slow learner too) as well as equipment. Though my pro1 did/does have a fast lens it was very limiting for distance/field sports which forced me to upgrade to an XT. I'm wondering if I should be utilizing the exposure compensation program to assist me so I'm not always maxed out on settings?

Your 50mm is going to be hard pressed to make it with action shots. Simply for the fact that it's autofocus is slow and in low light it hunts pretty bad. You're on the right track with the low fstop number (lower fstop more light), but a higher ISO number means more light (and noise). Those will aloow you to get a fast enough shutter speed to take action shots (recommended around here is 400 or 500 at the slowest to freeze the action)...again if your autofocus will comply. I have both an XT and the 50mm 1.8 so I know first hand how bad that combo is for sports. The 50mm is a portrait lens, and a close up one at that. Don't get me wrong the XT is quite capable of nice pictures but the 20d / 30d and above autofocus system is definatley better at tracking and locking on quickly so a slow AF lens combined with the XT just compounds the focus issues. The only thing you can do to remedy your issue is get as good of glass as you can. The Canon 85mm 1.8 prime is a good, fast (autofocus) lens that some use for sports in a bind but doesn't have any kind of reach as far as that is concerned. I've seen a few people on here shooting sports with it if they are close enough tot he action. (courtside at the action end of a high school basketball game for instance)

Indoor or low light sports, you're going to need a f2.8 lens (or lower 1.8 etc). Some people do it with an Canon 70-200F4L for instance, as a good all around lens, but a lot are unsatisified with it's preformance unless its outdoors on a nice day. I thought I would be fine with a $200 70-300mm 4-5.6 Sigma for even general use but I frequently found that I needed more light and anything over 200mm is damn hard to have a clean shot without image stabilization. I ended up buying a 70-200 F2.8 Sigma used for 600 bucks. It's not ideal for sports (not long enough reach) but it works well and in lower light, so as much as I use it for sports it's not worth a couple grand to me for a long reach IS low fstop lens.

Shop around, read the forums, ask questions, and visit fredmiranda.com for lens reviews from actual photographers to schedule your next purchase.

Just a quick add.

The term "stopping down" is because you are making the aperture opening smaller.
Because the aperture number is expressed as a fraction, even though you don't see the "1/" in front of the number, thus a f2 aperture is really 1/2 the focal length.

(or something like that) I don't feel like confirming what I remember today (and I am tired)

The key thing is smaller number is opening up, (letting in more light) larger number is stopping down (letting in less light).

Depends on your actual conditions of light, but to set out and play around, i'd stick the camera on Av, and set the aperture as wide as possible.

Then I'd whack up the ISO to 400 or 800, and see where that gets you. The XT can output perfectly usable photos at higher ISOs.

In terms of using the 50mm, the depth of field when close up can be so narrow that when you focus on an eye of a face, then even the ears can be out of focus. You imagine that a person is moving, then they would only have to move a few inches for them to suddenly start being out of focus.

Try stopping down the lens so that your increasing the depth of field to try and capture larger areas within focus.

When in Av or Tv modes, if you apply an exposure compensation, then the camera simply adjusts the other settings to increase the exposure of light.

In Av, and you've locked the aperture, and set an exposure comp of +1 ( whatever ), the camera will simply increase the shutter time to get the extra amount of light.

In Tv, with a locked shutter speed, and set an exp. comp of +1 the camera will try and open up the aperture to get more light in.

Thanks all, as of late, I'm shooting HS basketball and look forward to a HS play as well. I always shoot manual-mode/wide open aperature. I'm hoping to acquire an f/2.8 later next year for fall soccer and football HS games. I know my 75-300f/4.0-5.6 is cheap but hopefully and should suffice for the "bright" summer stuff. So...for now, it seems...I only have the nifty to use and my pro1.

I have the XT as well, what I do is ....

1) set the camera to Av mode
2)open the aperature as wide as you can, (you will need at least 2.8 I bet)
3)set your ISO to 1600 (in good gyms you can lower it but not much)
4)let the camera pick the speed (hopefully you will get at least 1/400+

Take the pictures home, download them, get rid of the majority of them and clean the good ones up and then run them all through a noise reducer like Noise Ninja or Neat Image...

Thanks again, we have a basketball game tommorrow night so I'll mess around. Ya know, the lighting just seems so good in a gym, yet is considered low?? Strange.....especially compared to fall football night games where it is really so much darker. I was able to get some ok pics with the pro1 @ f/2.8 1/160, iso 200-400 just were crappy. I have a ways to go I see..even with the new XT...guess it'll just take time and a good lens (eventually).

You really need to get your iso up to 800/1600 in these low light situations. You also want your shutter speed to be 1/400 minimum, better at 1/500. For this you are going to need faster glass. For basketball I would suggest the 85mm f/1.8 or the 100 f/2, both good performance at a fair price. For night football I would go with a 70-200 f/2.8 either Canon or Sigma. The 300mm would be better, but we do need to think about the budget at times.
My settings for basketball: M mode, 85mm f/1.8 wide open, iso 1600, ss 1/500, custom white balance and ec at +1/3. Good luck.......

Bruce

Thanks Bruce!

vetkrazy wrote in post #2357716
My settings for basketball: M mode, 85mm f/1.8 wide open, iso 1600, ss 1/500, custom white balance and ec at +1/3. Good luck.......Bruce

I was looking at the manual today and it states exposure compensation adjustment in any creative zone "but M"? page 89. How will I set this using "M"mode? TIA

You don't. You use the +1 or -1 settings instead of the 0 to manually offset your exposure by 1 stop. EC is applied to any automatic exposure, which may vary. Manual, you're always setting the exposure yourself, so can make the offset yourself.

OK, it just seems I'm always at my fullest extremes due to poor/low lighting so I thought this may be another adjustment I can learn to utilize to give me a little breathing room. Again, this is all new to me since leaving P&S last fall only to find very bad..blurry shots using "auto"mode on the pro1. So...I figured I better learn to use the camera creative zone functions if I want "any" descent pictures. I tend to just muddle along and sloooowly learn:o

Keep it simple.

Think aperture = depth of field. Do you want to isolate action from background / foreground (means you need good focusing skills) = small f numbers, or do you want more of b/gnd f/grnd in focus = larger f numbers

Then think ... action photography (like sports, not including chess) start by thinking fast shutter speeds to freeze the action - over 1/200

Decide on camera mode, stick to aperature priority or shutter speed priority at first.

I almost always shoot aperture priority. In your basketball scenario I would select f9ish for reasonable depth of field (more forgiving on focusing). Then choose an ISO to get the shutter speed up above 300 or more. I would also shoot JPEG (for speed) in servo mode with continuous focus. Concentrate on framing and let the camera take care of everything else. Check LCD regularly. Keep trying.

If I got 1 good shot out of 15 or 20 I would be pleased. This is not unrealistic even pros in the film days would go through a roll of film and be happy for one great shot.

Try borrowing a (reflective) light meter and using it to see what aperture / shutter speed / ISO combinations will work under different light conditions - you can learn a lot. Allows you to rule out a lot of your trial and error combinations.

This pic is not the greatest but was taken with my 350d and the standard 18-55 kit lens at quarter a football field length (f9, 1/1000, ISO400, high speed program mode, continuous focus)

Neil

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