Decorum in the forum?

In the dim and distant past pictures in the sharing section were for sharing and a picture in the critique section was there for serious critique (and as Tommy has pointed out that is still the case)

However…..

I tend to only offer critique to:-

a. People who’s work I know and I know that they will appreciate it.

b. Pictures that are exceptionally fine (in my view) and that needs to be commented on

c. Pictures that are trying to be fine but need some tips.

I tend not to comment on the many snaps that are posted, not because they are not worthy of comment but because when I have done so in the past the reaction was far from good both from the OP and other people wading in with their “Ahhh but he looks so adorable” posts.

There are fun threads on her like the TPBM thread where serious critique is sometimes given but the rules have become so blurred over time that anything goes (mind you I have yet to see a “that picture sucks” post.)

I guess that it is a volume thing, the more people, the more pictures the less likelihood of constructive responses. Having said that, you can not help but notice that when a particularly fine photograph is posted it does attract significantly more comments than the “also rans”.

I too have concerns over the “This has been up for an hour now with 35 views and no comments!”posts. Please think before posting this type of comment, the non responding viewers my have simply been trying to spare your feelings.

I too follow Tommy's viewpoint that the "sharing" section is there for us to share shots that please ourselves and we want to share. When I respond to shots in these sections, it's sometimes with a "nice shot" comment, but I'll always try to back that up with a description about what I liked.didn't like about the shot. I'll also enter into a discussion if need be.

In the CC section, if I respond to a photo, I'll contructively critique it as much as my limited experience allows me to, since the CC section is there so that photos can be critiqued, not to be appreciated. I think that's the distinction here.

If I happen to post shots that don't get any repsonses (and it happens), I don't get upset by it (slightly disgruntled, yes). I simply assume that those particular shots are of no interest to the viewers and I try another tack.

My opinion is, if you post a photo here, be ready for the good and the bad comments you'll receive. I think it's naive to expect only positive comments.

When I first joined this forum, I left some comments about a picture of a female body builder in the Glamour section. I was absolutely lambasted for saying that, in my opinion, the muscular build of the woman detracted from the glamour. The shot, in the "Sports" section would've been great.

I meant absolutely no disrespect to either the photographer or the model, but the very fact that I said that I didn't think that a woman of such a muscular build was glamourous, people got all up in arms. Most comments were that I shouldn't comment on the model, despite the fact that the model was the most important aspect of the photo.

So, based on the reactions I got back then, I tend to temper my comments a bit, but I'll still leave little doubt if there's something about a photo I don't like. I think negative comments are the ones we can learn from, and not sharing those negative comments can actually be counter-productive...

I think part of the problem is that this place isa victim of it's own success and it's just too DAMN busy! I only have just enough time to track subscribed and new threads. I would dearly love to delve into the depths of 3 or 4 share forums and look at the images and comment but its not possible always.

I also tend to look for known names whose photography I respect. Inevitably, their images are quality and the comments are positive. I am guyilty of shying away from a comment on a photo which is not up to the mark as I won't say 'good pic' when I don't mean it.

I understand that, Al. Sometimes we don't have the time to sit and take a good look at an average or below average shot and dissect it enough to raise a comment if our first impression is that it's not that good.

I totally agree that there's an awful lot to see.

I also feel that I don't have enough a) knowledge and b) reputation to dissect an image. Quite often, my view is different to the majority so often I just say nothing Lazy I know and I feel guilty for it.

But as Tommy said, Shares are for sharing, C&C is for critique. I post shots (yes, I do .. sometimes ) for people to see, I'm happy to take criticism, but that's not why I post. Yes, it's disappoining not to get many comments, but s**t happens!

The forum is so busy that nobody can comment on all they see so don't be discouraged by a high view count and low response count. For example I have share threads with view counts from 45 to 180 with 0 comments. But that does not discourage me from posting (when I actually get time to go photographing that is )

Since buying my 350D 16 months ago I can honestly say I think I have learned a few things, at least 60% of that is down to this forum, the rest is from books and magazines. I have been very happy to recieve critisism and have learned alot from it. I have continued to go out and take pitcures, develop my style and all because I know someone here will say "Cool pic" or "Try doing this!". Without the feedback I probably wouldn't have taken it up the way I have (bit of a passion now and an expensive one too)

So in return I try to be honest about any other images I see here, when I feel there is something I can add. Often it is a case of "Tweek the levels" "Use a CPL" or "Crop a bit tighter", then I feel fine adding my constructive crit. If I think there needs to be more in depth critisism/guidance I will mail/PM said poster and try to put them on the right track (this way avoiding any public embarassment) and I have always had positive feedback from those few I have mailed/PM'd.

I am not saying I am an expert but I have learned enough here to give something back and I hope I can do so. If you post here you want feedback, otherwise don't post.

What he said in spades!

A few random thoughts on the subject.
This is an excellent forum and I'm a little surprised by the concerns and opinions expressed, specially considering that this is an Public forum.
There are a lot of excellent photographers who regularly post and provide a lot constructive feedback, including Dimitri who has provided valuable feedback to my posts.
It is a very busy forum and it takes a lot of time to view all the posts and provide comments. Most people do not have the time to comment on all of them.
Photography is very subject in nature. Everyone has an valid opinion.
Oohs and aahs are good and we all need them. If it's not appealing to people we need to know that too.

Joe

mij wrote in post #2386353
But if you have not let learned the "rules" of photography (including when to break them) then it is difficult to look at a picture and be constructive about what would improve it. Instead you just feel it does not look right even though you do not know why.

While many on here may have already been photographers when they joined the site, there are many who arrive with their first camera, no knowledge, just maybe a book at best. It is the latter sort that Owin was referring to.

I think it is totally unreasonable to expect those sorts of people to have to provide constructive criticism before they are deserving of any in return, unless the site (or at least the photo sharing boards) wants to consider itself off limit to beginners, which would be a real shame.
I will stand on something that another member said above....we read what we want to read.
If you read all its been written by me in this post,then you`ll see that i`m talking in general and not only about CC , i also mentioned questionning,and don`t tell me that when you see a picture (any picture) you don`t have anything to ask ?
Then that means that you are perfect.
Besides which as much as anything else when you arrive anew it takes time to establish yourself to build up the confidence to offer such advice, especially when it goes against the general consensus. Putting pressure on people to have to comment before that is more likely to scare them away.

I never mentioned advice,i said CC which means comments and critisism.

First you need to make yourself know,you don`t have to give any advice but when you see a picture you can always see something that will make you wonder and ask why,the OP in this case very gladly will give you the answer you are looking for and the one that will help you get better.
Also at the end of your question,you can always add a nice compliment such as...and btw,your picture looks lovely.
Bingo...you are in for a winner,i assure you that everybody here will try to help you on any way.
On the other hand,when you don`t get involved in other peoples posts...how will they know you and why should they get involved into your posts,can you answer me this?

,i wonder how these people know each other so well...they go around the way i`m talking about perhaps

Now you are talking sense Michael.

chander wrote in post #2386476
I think whether one should critique on smones post is his own will - whether he provides some useful information or just admires the pic...The base line is that we are part of a FORUM...a PUBLIC place where people can share their stuff...and if u dont want any comments u should mention it (well I do have seen such posts - personally i think that kills the whole idea of being in a forum)...U cant (and i think shouldn't) stop anyone for commenting in any way...How they should do it a different topic and their own to decide....

U r right at pointing out the disease but its better to work for a cure and even that wont work till the patient wants it and is willing to accept it...What i mean is that one should ask for CC and accept whatever he gets in return and learn from it.



First of all I will say that I am myself a newbie...A person who joined the forum couple of years back when I came across it and saw what a wonderful art photography was...Spent a lot of time reading posts and understanding various aspects...but still I made a mistake and a big one...I had the wrong Approach when I posted my first pics an year after joining the forum...

Dimitri might not be remebering but I too did something of the same sort of blunder mentioned above ...At that time i considered photography as just clicking pictures and getting appreciation...But now I am not ashamed to admit that I made a mistake coz I have moved on from that phase...I have been learning a lot from a lot of experienced and nice people and photography is smthing thats helped me understand myself better...

Wat I am trying to say is that do what u are here to do --- learn & share...The casual ones might fall out themselves or understant the true meaning - like I did...





The above words are 110% True....u will learn if you want to... no one can make u learn...and there are different levels of intrest in which people take to photography...some just want u to see what they saw and some want u to feel what they felt when they shot and much more sometmes... ...And every person has got limitations and the possibilities are enormous in photography...
The best way is ask questions about ur pics; about other people's pics ...QUESTIONS (a mere 9 letter word) is the key to transform urself into smthing completely different....

And my friend Dan, u mentioned the word Decorum...I think there are some other more serious things that come under this topic and that should be taken care of...Well, as an example i will say, I saw a post some days back from a guy who had purchased a Rebel XTI from Dell and it was damaged on delivery. So he contacted Dell and talked to the manger(a Indian Girl). She apologised for the inconvinience and gave him heavy disconts and a propmt service. Its a long story and in the end the guy had a free upgrade to 30D afterpaying just $482 in all, all coz of the Dell manager who willing helped him. Still that guys makes fun of her coz of her being an Indian and having a different accent and then some other pple follow in the same way. That hurt me a lot coz I too am myself from India and firmly beleive in the equality of people. Shouldn't smone have stoped him? Decorum should have been maintained at that time! So what shud have I done...replied back with harsh words? Wud that have helped in any way? No !!! Coz it doesn't change anything ...I know there are a lot of gr8 people out here who don't discriminate based on caste, creed and nationality. They help u when u want it and as purely as possible...

I think I have said more than what I should have but its just because I firmly believe in this forum and its ethics and I trust that any serious person's post wont go unnoticed !!!

Well,from my side i can assure you for that,my door is always open for people who are looking for answers and i can provide them.

EOSAddict wrote in post #2386181
Interesting! I would hope not,

Don`t get me wrong Al,i don`t like anybody leaving the forum either,its not good news at all.

That said, I'm expecting to get a hard time!

,oh dear,what can i say,i wish i could help you on this Al.

J T wrote in post #2386834
I had a feeling Dimitri would be bringing it strong in this thread.

,i had to Jim,when i saw it it was already on page 2 , well....look at it now.

oops....that shows your age Jim.:p

Even that can definitely get you noticed and make the majority of people feel like helping you out when you need and ask for it.

Hey, Dimitri - your posting skills need a bit of critique! You keep mixing up the bits of post that you are replying to with your replies. I can tell by those "/quote" tags left lying about. If you were as careless with your camera you get a lot fewer of those "Oooh! Aaah!" comments - that's for sure!

BTW I agree with (most) of what you say. I have also benefited greatly from these forums but I soon recognized that you must contribute feedback as well as receive it - that is my golden rule here.