F A RULES ON GETTING IN TO MATCHES

hi can some one help me with some advice on getting in to league games.
i know you need a licence to attend such games and is it right you have to have had so many photos published in the press to get this licence.

also suppliying photos to indepentent web sits and having them pay for the use of you pics is this the same and can you get the licence this way all the advice you can give would be of a great help to me.



chris

Use the search button mate.. covered lots of times in here

Forget websites.. It has to be recognised media.. 15 sales with invoices and matching paper cuttings with your name on them.. HTH

ive tryed the local paper but all i get of them is they use there own photographer who i know in person and have said to me that they have to cover up to 4 matches on a sunday leaving just about 15 minutes to get the photos required from each game to me this is just mad as im sitting at some games for 90 minutes and could help out with the od photo now and then my photos are just as good as the photographer from the papers so its got nothing to do with quality its just doing my head in you see pics in the press that are rubish but its still imposable to get your foot in the door.

Theres only 92 league clubs and a heck of a lot of sports photographers.. its not the easiest area to get into..local papers have photographers on wages so getting them to pay extra to you is a losing battle no matter how good your pictures are.. there guys are already being paid so it isnt costing extra sending them..

ill have to start my own paper up and pay my self for my own photos that should work. then ill invite all the other photographer out there to send photos to me thay can then have them printed in my paper thay can pay me to advertise there pics and ill pay them to print them sorted then ill wake up and its all a dream.

Can't really offer any advise to you on this - Tony sums it up well though. You also need public liability insurance to shoot at a league ground.

Keep knocking at the doors of the papers - you will, eventually, get there. Sadly rejection and knock backs come with the territory for freelancing......take on board the feedback they give and act on it - that is all you can do. But keep asking - situations change, circumstances change and togs come and go.

Your photos are good- remembering back to your original post from about 3 weeks ago, the timing was good, however the PP needed a little work...which I think you sorted in a subsequent post.

Another approach that you could take, if you are serious about setting up a continuing relationship with the paper is to look at the other sports that your local paper covers.....other than football.

Is there an opportunity to cover other sports for them? I realised that Hockey and Rugby were the two weakest areas for our local paper so went out and put together a portfolio of rugby and hockey shots that showed, should they use me, the level and quality of coverage they had would significantly increase. They agreed and things went from there.

Since then I have got to shoot not only hockey and rugby, but also a lot of football, some Ice Hockey and will be adding athletics/running to that in the next week too. If you can get your foot in the door, show that you can shoot and submit photos to their requirements and deadlines, then other opportunities to shoot the stuff you want to, such as football, will present themselves.

Might be worth thinking about as an alternative strategy.

Hope this helps.

csjonesv1 wrote in post #2428949
ive tryed the local paper but all i get of them is they use there own photographer who i know in person and have said to me that they have to cover up to 4 matches on a sunday leaving just about 15 minutes to get the photos required from each game to me this is just mad as im sitting at some games for 90 minutes and could help out with the od photo now and then my photos are just as good as the photographer from the papers so its got nothing to do with quality its just doing my head in you see pics in the press that are rubish but its still imposable to get your foot in the door.

First of all, if you are aiming to go professional, try and use punctuation in your writing, as it makes it easier to read.

You state that you are 'as good as a pro'. Well, to be honest, that is subjective as there are both good and bad pro's out there. However, in reality you are light years away from someone like Rich Pelham, the Sun's staff snapper and recent winner of pro if the year. With all due respect, so far I have seen many snappers better than you here and on other websites.

I can assume that you are young judging by your opinion?

Secondly, you state that you would only have 15 minutes to get images up. Well, in the current shoot live environ, 15 minutes is a lifetime. What you will learn is that going 'pro' often takes the fun out of shooting live events. I have covered many games, more Prem Rugby over soccer and I have seen loads of toggers shoot for 10 mins here and there and then start the PP/wire work. Why shot 300 frames when 4 will pay the bills? I also would ask if you are that set on going pro, I can assume that you have a wireless laptop in place, maybe a 3G card etc? Are you familiar with metadata and exif data plus image names, titles etc, what about copyright?

As for it being impossible. Not really. Like all industries, time served, experience and overall ability will yield results and I urge you not go go banging on doors claiming to be the photographic messiah as when people ask to see your 'folio and kit list, they may send you packing.

I do wish you all the luck in the world, but as others have said before, the ability to hold and shoot does not make you a sports togger.

Good luck, keep trying, learn your trade and who knows what may happen.

I hope this retort does not sound rude, I am merely giving you advice that I followed.

Pete.

bristolpete wrote in post #2429656
Like all industries, time served, experience and overall ability will yield results and I urge you not go go banging on doors claiming to be the photographic messiah as when people ask to see your 'folio and kit list, they may send you packing.

This is very good advice and I'd strongly advise you to follow it.

The best of luck with your quest to shoot at a higher level. It's certainly wise to get a solid grounding photographing the grass-roots game first.

It's also worth pointing out that simply having the correct Licence doesn't always guarantee you access to matches. You still need to build your reputation and gain media contacts to get into the 'bigger' games.

---- Gavin

gmen wrote in post #2429712
It's also worth pointing out that simply having the correct Licence doesn't always guarantee you access to matches.

Thats actually a very good point I have already learnt but not often mentioned. In fact never really seen it mentioned much before.

bristolpete wrote in post #2429656
As for it being impossible. Not really. Like all industries, time served, experience and overall ability will yield results and I urge you not go go banging on doors claiming to be the photographic messiah as when people ask to see your 'folio and kit list, they may send you packing

Spot on Pete - couldn't agree more.

Gmen wrote in post #2429656
The best of luck with your quest to shoot at a higher level. It's certainly wise to get a solid grounding photographing the grass-roots game first.

Definitely don't run before you can walk - iron out your workflow, shooting etc (as per Pete's advice) at a lower level before moving up. Move up too quickly and then make mistakes you will find yourself flying down the levels rather quickly I would image. Remember this is a very results driven industry

Gmen wrote in post #2429656
It's also worth pointing out that simply having the correct Licence doesn't always guarantee you access to matches. You still need to build your reputation and gain media contacts to get into the 'bigger' games.

I have heard this as well - some smaller agencies don't get accreditation to the larger grounds/clubs.

League football is not the be all & end all of sports photography in my opinion. yes it would be nice to be able to try to get into that line of work, as it is what we seem to see on the back pages of our daily newspapers all the time, but maybe you should try to be as versatile as you can ,there are many opportunity's in other areas if you have the the time to get out there & shoot as many different things as you can. I think that is one of the reasons i admire Gavin (Gmen) so much he is a outstanding photographer in the first place & his understanding of how to shoot a mixture of sports in my opinion is his greatest strength & is what we all should strive to achieve. The only other thing i would say is to take notice of what the others have to say as the more i read here the more i learn, the people on this forum have a wealth of knowledge so try to make the best of there advice.

Best regards
Steve.

i think some of you have got a bit mixed up i dont want to go pro all i want to do is be able to get in to the first team games at port vale at this time i am able to just shoot the reserve games. also i did not say i would only have 15 minutes to shoot a game i said the photographers who work for the local paper only have 15 minutes and its the photographers who said to me that was not enough time to do a good job . i thinks its a great idea to look at other sports i will be following that up and as for my punctuation and spelling i know its rubish but get a grip im only writing a post on here if i did wright a letter or e-mail something importent i would of course do it better by using the spell checker ect . i do photography because i love it not to try and make a living from it all i want to do is be as good as i can at what i do and i cant see whats wrong with that thats why i came on here for c&c and advice this licence thing just gets under my skin for some reason thanks again for your advice.

chris

also i forgot to mention when i said some times the photos in the paper were rubbish what i a better word would be not factual ill give you a eg 2 weeks ago i sat for 90 minutes through a game got about 25 printable photos. that week the game was reported in the paper with a photo to go with the report saying bla bla scoring the wining goal but i was there and the photo did not go with the game the photo was from a game 4 weeks earlyer the paper had just put any photo in just to fill the page now can you see why i get a bit fed up or is it just me been over sensertive sorry in advance for all the bad spelling ect.

chris

how can we be mixed up? you never mentioned port vale or not going pro... we cant get mixed up.. we can only guess if you dont give us all the info.... sorry mate.. not a mind reader

csjonesv1 wrote in post #2434245
also i forgot to mention when i said some times the photos in the paper were rubbish what i a better word would be not factual ill give you a eg 2 weeks ago i sat for 90 minutes through a game got about 25 printable photos. that week the game was reported in the paper with a photo to go with the report saying bla bla scoring the wining goal but i was there and the photo did not go with the game the photo was from a game 4 weeks earlyer the paper had just put any photo in just to fill the page now can you see why i get a bit fed up or is it just me been over sensertive sorry in advance for all the bad spelling ect.


chris

about the papers using a shot of the player scoring the winning goal being from a different game isnt that where stock photos come into it, im sure even games where there are a few photographers in attendence not every goal is captured.Our local paper is lucky if they get the players name right

Steve.