holy NY AirShow Photos! P-51,F-15,F-16 and A-10 in Formation!

jnick wrote in post #2660623
I said it the first time I saw these shots (emailed a long time ago), and looking at the pics - I'll say it again - unfortunately, these pics look chopped.

Not to doubt anyone, but the shadows don't match, nor does the jet blur from the exhausts. As an aviation fanatic, I'm almost positive these shots are chopped.

Not to mention, to my knowledge, there hasn't been any air shows in that location of New York, recently . . .

While I may very well be wrong; the pictures just do not look right.

(NOTE: I only think the background is edited. The images of the aircraft formations are legit, for obvious reasons)

You are certainly entitled to your opinion. However, Please check out this link:

http://www.jonesbeacha​irshow.com/gallery.htm​l

Memorial Day Weekend, 2006. Not 'recent'. So, it seems these photos may have been circulating awhile, and we just haven't seen them til recently.

Also, why would Bethpage Federal Credit Union post bogus photos????

If they are indeed 'chopped' then whoever did it, is excellent at their job!!

Jostel wrote in post #2661720
You are certainly entitled to your opinion. However, Please check out this link:

http://www.jonesbeacha​irshow.com/gallery.htm​l

Memorial Day Weekend, 2006. Not 'recent'. So, it seems these photos may have been circulating awhile, and we just haven't seen them til recently.

Also, why would Bethpage Federal Credit Union post bogus photos????

If they are indeed 'chopped' then whoever did it, is excellent at their job!!

I'd have to agree, the Bethpage FCU is not going to post bogus pictures on their site. The pictures all looked authentic to me, but anything can be done these days with digital pictures.

jnick wrote in post #2660623
I said it the first time I saw these shots (emailed a long time ago), and looking at the pics - I'll say it again - unfortunately, these pics look chopped.

Not to doubt anyone, but the shadows don't match, nor does the jet blur from the exhausts. As an aviation fanatic, I'm almost positive these shots are chopped.

Not to mention, to my knowledge, there hasn't been any air shows in that location of New York, recently . . .

While I may very well be wrong; the pictures just do not look right.

(NOTE: I only think the background is edited. The images of the aircraft formations are legit, for obvious reasons)

Well I am not sure you are very qualified to decide what has been "chopped" (?) or not.

Are you saying the photographer / photojournilist has intentionally
misled or misrepresented the images? I am sure you are not aware of it but unless you can PROVE that, it is slander and you are tarnishing a good photographer name and her work.

Doctering or falsifing an image used for PJ work is against ALL ethical standards and will get you terminated or blacklisted by any news agency, magazine, TV etc.

The photographer in this case is Victoria Arocho an 8 year veteran shooter with Associated Press, so i am reasonably sure that she is a NPPA member so she has signed the press photographers ethics charter.

My suggestion is that you transmit a mia culpa and a retraction to your statement ASAP. Failing that you had better have some great evidence that stands up in court

Doing a quick google shows that there have been several airshows at bethpage over the last 5 years so that defeats your "no airshow in New York" theory.

Les Baldwin

Maybe true, but when you have some free time, pick a shot that has a good prop blur, like the 1st or 4th one, & try to PS it into a different background.

The blur is caused by the heat produced from thrust from the F-16

Stunning photos!

HJ

Check out the image below. I'm just curious as to where the shadowed aircraft is? All of the aircraft are straight wing, propeller. None of the have swept wings as the shadowed aircraft does.

Also, those who have been to air shows will know that when a team of acrobatic planes are performing, it is ONLY that team performing. If the Red Baron Squadron were flying, "Klein Tools" would not be in their airspace. The only times mixed squadrons or aircrafts fly together is when there are heritage flights. However, those usually include 1-2 jet aircraft as well as one WWII prop plane.

Like I said, I'm not doubting that shots of the aircraft are fake. However, the overall picture, for instance, mixed squadrons - In my opinion, are photoshopped.

Finally, I wouldn't doubt for one second that BFCU would used a PS'ed image. It's mostly for advertising ;-p.

Once again, I'm not discrediting the photographer. Obviously the individual aircrafts had to be shot by someone, and for that, they ARE amazing. But the overall picture . . . they're a bit sketchy.

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LBaldwin wrote in post #2662949
Well I am not sure you are very qualified to decide what has been "chopped" (?) or not.

Are you saying the photographer / photojournilist has intentionally
misled or misrepresented the images? I am sure you are not aware of it but unless you can PROVE that, it is slander and you are tarnishing a good photographer name and her work.

Doctering or falsifing an image used for PJ work is against ALL ethical standards and will get you terminated or blacklisted by any news agency, magazine, TV etc.

The photographer in this case is Victoria Arocho an 8 year veteran shooter with Associated Press, so i am reasonably sure that she is a NPPA member so she has signed the press photographers ethics charter.

My suggestion is that you transmit a mia culpa and a retraction to your statement ASAP. Failing that you had better have some great evidence that stands up in court

Doing a quick google shows that there have been several airshows at bethpage over the last 5 years so that defeats your "no airshow in New York" theory.

Les Baldwin

Not for nothing mate, but I think you're over reacting a bit. You tell me where I EVER mentioned taking anyone to court, or tarnishing anyones name?

I have what's called an opinion. I saw a picture, made an observation and have doubt. Live with it.

Also, I NEVER said there hasn't been an airshow in NY in 5 years. Hell, I've BEEN to an Airshow in New York about 3 years ago. I stated I didn't think there was an airshow in New York which flew around those LANDMARKS. It's funny . . . If the airshow was in Jones Beach . . . why are they flying around the statue of Liberty? They Statue of Liberty isn't even close to Jones Beach. I also NEVER said that the PHOTOGRAPHER intentionally misled anyone. Once any picture hits the internet it is at risk of ANYONE editing the image and I'm sure you know that.

Like I said, it's my opinion. Feel free to disagree, however do not jump down my throat or put words into my mouth. I said in the above post, I do not discredit the photographer as the pictures of the aircraft HAD to be taken. I'm just saying that parts of the images just don't add up.

However, I'm not here to argue, but rather enjoy and share the art of photography . . .

Photoshop'd? Not Photoshop'd? Either way, the framing on the whole is a bit poor. Noses, wings, propellors chopped off, and one of those pictures has an irritating blur to it. I'd say the top 15% of photographers on this forum could probably pull off equal or better shots from the same position.

Discuss...

JNick, I have done hundreds of these types of flights in the past here is a basic explaination.

These are press flights. You (as the photographer) sit in a photo plane and the various formations form up on your position and you shoot a preplanned grouping of A/C. This is NOT shot during an airshow, the FAA would never allow it. At Watsonville CA we used to sit in an open Beech A-36 and the Airshow performers would fly past us in various groupings and in different 'poses' for lack of a better word. Everyone had excellent formation skills and were used to doing this and it is planned down to the final degree.

All of the performers are up at the same time and flying in one general direction, when given instructions to do so they momentarily fly outside the
direction to increase or decrease the angle of the A/C in relation to the others.
It is a stunt of sorts. Look at the rudder on the Klein tools A/C it is near max deflection, to kick the nose away from the photographer. The MiG is not in the scene most likely due to it's slow speed performance envelope being higher than the safety margin and it tried to drop out of formation

In the military stuff that can only be shot from an A/C that the rear door drops down probably a C-130 or other turbo cargo A/C. The prop stuff was from a left side door most likely a Beech A-36 or other small turbo prop that can fly slow enough.

These images do seem to have been shot over a period of days though. The reason that they use NY landmarks is for publicity. Nobody would recognize the famous jones beach from the air, but everybody would understand the Statue of Liberty as a background

All of the A/C have to have overlaping performance envelopes, that is to say you will generally won't see a Pitts with the Blue Angels but the exception to that is Sean D. Tucker.

His A/c IS hot enough to keep up for a few frames, if the Blues slow down.

No good. ethical photojournilist would risk his or her career by adding or deleting elements in a newsworthy image, unless it clearly states "Photo Montage or Photo illustration". The NYT times have fired a photog recently for something so narrow as darkening a background. Another photog was canned (reuters I think) for adding a column of smoke to an image. Does it happen, yes. But if you get caught it can be the end of your career as a news photog, no editor will trust you again.

Les

For more excellent west coast A/C photography go to my friend Tysons site here
http://www.tvrphotogra​phy.com/.

For more stuff on Sean D. Tucker and Team Oracle go here http://www.oracle.com …cle/teamoracle/​index.html
and then go to the photo section.

Les

LBaldwin wrote in post #2674632
JNick, I have done hundreds of these types of flights in the past here is a basic explaination . . .

Les,

I appreciate the time you took to write all of that out. I will take your word on this one as you definitely have more knowledge that I do regarding Air Show photography. The pictures just didn not look right to me as well as the odd discrepencies, such as the missing MiG and the landmarks. However I can accept your explanation.

Thanks again!

Btw, excellent photos in the two links you provided.