Noise reduction and workflow

I shoot a lot of high iso stuff, so I bought the noiseware plugin to use in PSE5. My basic PSE workflow (if you can call it that) is just:

ACR (Smoothing, Levels, WB) >
Reduce noise (PSE filter/Noiseware) >
Resize >
Sharpen >
Convert to jpeg

That is basically it unless I convert to black and white, which I do pretty much at any random point in the workflow.

Before I had noiseware I would apply smoothing in ACR and run a reduce noise filter in PSE. Now that I have noiseware I do not apply any smoothing in ACR and run noiseware in PSE instead of the reduce noise filter.

So I have a few questions.

-I realize that sharpening is best applied after resizing. Is there a similar rule of thumb for noise reduction (before or after resizing)?

-Should I apply smoothing in ACR even though I will be using noiseware in PSE?

-Is there an optimal point to apply the b&w conversion (beginning or end of the workflow)?

I still don't have a really good feel for the finding the balance between noise reduction and sharpening that maintains the greatest amount of detail. Any tips in general would be great.

for my tuppence worth, I'd reduce colour luminance noise in ACR and any further noise in Photoshop, and do that noise reduction as early in the workflow as you can and use as little as you can possibly get away with.

It'll be an idea to trial a re-size before you apply any noise reduction, sometimes you get an effect where the noise clears to insignificant levels just through the resize function.

As for BW work, I do that after applying curves and before sharpening.

1. I apply sharpening in two or three points in the workflow: a slight bit of USM using and edge mask just after NR (if NR is necessary), a bit more selective sharpening to special features (optional, like eyes in a portrait), and high pass filter after resize. See this for exactly how I do this: http://www.thelightsri​ghtstudio.com …nYourSharpening​Skills.pdf

2. I usually use a bit of smoothing and color NR in ACR. Zooming in to 400% in a shadow area will help isolate noise. I find that a properly exposed image with a lot of DR will have almost no noise. But, if there is some blue and red globs at 400%, color NR at 3-5, and smothing at 7-12 usually zaps it.

3. I make the mono conversion early and often, meaning I may have a few adjustment layers, and change my mind as two what method or settings work better for a specific image. 9/10 of the time, I use a channel mixer adjustment layer.

I think the concept to understand is that you want to sharpen the edges, and avoid noise altogether with proper exposure. Sometimes that is impossible, and in that case, you want to reduce noise in surfaces, protecting the sharp edges. This is done with layer masks. You can find quite a bit of useful info on the site above as well as many tools that aid in the process of building these masks.

Address the issue before you start shooting?
ISO 200-6400 20D Tests

I understand how to reduce noise in normal type shooting situations, but I often find myself in those 'impossible' situations. I like to shoot live music in dark dark places. Like ISO 3200, f/1.4 1/40 plus a push in pp kind of dark. It's not like there are a few little specs of noise. There are times when it's a choice between shutter speed and proper exposure...and noise is somewhat more correctable/accepatabl​e in pp, where motion blur/camera shake really isn't. Part of my problem is that the thing I want to meter for is rarely the most well lit part of the scene.

Thanks for the links and the ideas though. I'm kind of a newb (okay not kind of) when it comes to layer masking, but I need to learn. I think the concept that I really wasn't sure of was the pros/cons of noise reduction and sharpening in multiple steps vs. a single step. I was thinking that I'd be killing too much detail if I used smoothing in ACR plus noise reduction in multiple smallish doses, but now that you mention it this seems to make more sense than trying to apply a heavy NR step at one time. It's entirely possible that I may find it is just best to leave a lot of the noise in...or try to kill the color noise, but not so much the luma noise or something like that. These are live music photos after all.

I couldn't work without them as they're useful for density, noise reduction, color correction, sharpening...

Airport runway shoot

RAitch Tutorial - Burn and Dodge with a Layer

Or, to blend two different exposures:
Mixed Lighting Issues Solved By Using RAW Format!!!

Need to remove a background from something?

Selecting areas in PS.

Me too. Sometimes I just leave the noise.

jfrancho wrote in post #2636733
Me too. Sometimes I just leave the noise.

Wow...words fail me. That is an interesting shot. Cool framing, and the subject comes through nice and clean (relatively speaking of course).

Thanks. This another from that same venue - lighting consists of 60w light bulbs in track lighting with colored gels. I'm pretty sure I zapped the noise in the shadows, but left it alone in the mid tones and highlights.

Fwiw, the lighting in your shots seems to be great degree better than what I attempt to deal with at times. I have two or three places that I try to shoot where the idea of lighting is a single red incandescent bulb (probably a 60w, but it seems more like 40w)...if I'm lucky, maybe a few strands of xmas lights.

Here is an example of what I'm talking about
light source 1 incandescent bulb + a neon sign on the wall and spill light from other parts of the bar
iso3200 f/1.4 1/40 (smoothing applied/exposure pushed in ACR, reduce noise applied in PSE)