Gamut and color space

I am not sure if any of you agree with this, but I was reading the other day and found out that the 5D has a larger gamut, in some colors, than Adobe RGB's color space. That means either you have to expand Adobe's color space manually in PS, by creating a custom color space, or use pro photo RGB.

I got this info from the book Photoshop Artistry in the color, calibration, and printing chapter which used the 5D as an example because of its great dynamic range for both lightness and color. It shows the typical cartesian plane with the color gamuts plotted and although most colors were inside Adobe RGB, it was outside of it for a few areas (I don't remember which). The authors recommend that we use pro photo color space when shooting with cameras of this caliber and in shooting in RAW to maximize color that is produced natively by the camera. They additionally say that most printers that use 8 inks or more can probably print outside Adobe RGB in some areas and this would produce better transitions, etc....

This may be controversial, but before long, printing pro photo's gamut will be fully realized in the photography world.

Happy shooting!

I think just about all Canon DSLRs have a bit bigger Gamut the AdobeRGB: Click and have fun

Not sure what you mean by "expand Adobe's color space manually in PS, by creating a custom color space": If you convert a RAW to AdobeRGB tiff, you won't get any colors back by converting to a larger colorspace (unless maybe if you use Perceptual intent, which would not be accurate)

As a matter of fact, most cameras, not just the 5D, have a capture space well larger than AdobeRGB:
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorial​s/prophoto-rgb.shtml
To what extent you can actually get that extra gamut onto paper is a debate that has been going on for several years.

René Damkot wrote in post #3264788
Not sure what you mean by "expand Adobe's color space manually in PS, by creating a custom color space": If you convert a RAW to AdobeRGB tiff, you won't get any colors back by converting to a larger colorspace (unless maybe if you use Perceptual intent, which would not be accurate)

Within the color settings of photoshop, you can adjust a color space to be expanded along the X and Y axes and the white point, then you can save that as a custom space to assign to your photos, but I wouldn't recommend you provide anyone else a photo in that space since they are probably using one of the generic spaces. I agree, once you convert a RAW file and save as another format, you have set yourself into whatever colorspace and cannot retrieve into that saved file (the original isn't set of course and should be saved separately as we all know) anything clipped because of gamut restrictions.

Thanks
I'll stick with AdobeRGB, BestRGB, WideGamutRGB or ProPhotoRGB for now (depending on the applications used and intended purpose). And sRGB for web and mail off course.

Yeah, I think that pro photo is the best as well since out of gamut colors will not be printed anyway and with the advent of soft proofing, you should be able to get expected prints regardless.

I'm lurking here.... reading your posts.. I always have problems with screen to print match... and my monitor is calibrated...

So you soft proof using ProPhoto RGB and that is most accurate for print? This is a very frustrating subject for me and I've spent sooo much time trying to figure it out.

What is ProPhoto RGB anyway...? and when you soft proof do you select, perceptual, relative colormetric, or something else?

Sorry for hi-jacking your thread... but seems like you guys will know the answer to this.

Kristy wrote in post #3265334
I'm lurking here.... reading your posts.. I always have problems with screen to print match... and my monitor is calibrated...

So you soft proof using ProPhoto RGB and that is most accurate for print? This is a very frustrating subject for me and I've spent sooo much time trying to figure it out.

What is ProPhoto RGB anyway...? and when you soft proof do you select, perceptual, relative colormetric, or something else?

Sorry for hi-jacking your thread... but seems like you guys will know the answer to this.

Pro Photo RGB is a working space, like sRGB and AdobeRGB. When you are working in one of these spaces in PS you are already "soft-proofing" for that profile (because you are working in it).

There may be several reasons why your prints do not match. First, are your settings in PS correct? Second, what profile are you using for your paper/printer/ink combination? What printer/paper/ink combination are you using? What type of Rendering Intent are you using?

This is a frustrating part for all of us when we start diving into color management. It is probably the hardest part about what we do (taking away all the business side of photography). But once you grasp the concepts you can be confident that your outcome will be what you were after.

Kristy wrote in post #3265334
I'm lurking here.... reading your posts.. I always have problems with screen to print match... and my monitor is calibrated...

So you soft proof using ProPhoto RGB and that is most accurate for print? This is a very frustrating subject for me and I've spent sooo much time trying to figure it out.

What is ProPhoto RGB anyway...? and when you soft proof do you select, perceptual, relative colormetric, or something else?

Read the post linked from my sig.
First post (long!) has a bunch of links, including one explaining ProPhotoRGB and softproofing. There is a post on page 3 explaining softproofing further.

In2Photos wrote in post #3265434
Pro Photo RGB is a working space, like sRGB and AdobeRGB. When you are working in one of these spaces in PS you are already "soft-proofing" for that profile (because you are working in it).

There may be several reasons why your prints do not match. First, are your settings in PS correct? Second, what profile are you using for your paper/printer/ink combination? What printer/paper/ink combination are you using? What type of Rendering Intent are you using?

This is a frustrating part for all of us when we start diving into color management. It is probably the hardest part about what we do (taking away all the business side of photography). But once you grasp the concepts you can be confident that your outcome will be what you were after.

Thanks for this... I soft using either the profile created by my calibration device, or using a printer profile provided the lab that I print at. I don't print my own images.. I send everything out. But I have problems with the prints looking really dark with a couple of labs, like the black point is completely different.. skin tones are weird-looking, not just overall darker... these labs use fuji paper.. and another lab everything prints really warm and the highlights are always blown.. like their printers have too much contrast...or something.. they us kodak endura paper. But this is bar none my most frustrating thing at this point in my photographic journey. I've read everything once, twice and a hundred times.. I've read so many color management things that it's embarassing.. I'm not a techinal person really, but I'm learning as I go along... I think I click the relative colormetric box when I soft proof.

René Damkot wrote in post #3265494
Read the post linked from my sig.
First post (long!) has a bunch of links, including one explaining ProPhotoRGB and softproofing. There is a post on page 3 explaining softproofing further.

Thanks for this link... I'll be up reading tonight when I have some free time to myself... Happy Friday to you both!

Kristy wrote in post #3267062
I soft using either the profile created by my calibration device,

After reading my post, you'll know why you don't want to do that