Epson Bulk Ink Systems

Does anyone recomend a bulk ink delivery system for the Epson 2400. I have always just used Epson ink cartridges and I am spending a small fortune even with using a dicount ink supplier. I dont want to compromise my prints by going this route either. Any suggestions or recomendations would be appreciated.

If you don't want to compromise your prints, you'll need to take Epson K3 ink from larger cartridges. Usually people use the large cartridges sold for the Stylus Pro wide format printers.

Your best bet may be to sell the R2400 and buy a 3800 - which has much larger cartridges that work out a fair bit cheaper.

David

Transcendence wrote in post #3330120
Does anyone recomend a bulk ink delivery system for the Epson 2400. I have always just used Epson ink cartridges and I am spending a small fortune even with using a dicount ink supplier. I dont want to compromise my prints by going this route either. Any suggestions or recomendations would be appreciated.

I too tired of buying the most ridiculously expensive fluid on the planet and looked for a solution.

I don't think moving to a CIS does compromise your printing. In point of fact, I feel I get better results with the ink I chose.

In my case, using an R1800, Mediastreet G7 pigment inks, and a Mediastreet Niagara IV CIS (http://www.mediastree​t.com). I did my own profiles (although Mediastreet will do them for you too). On the papers I print on (Red River Polar Satin is my favorite), I get better prints than I did with OEM ink, OEM paper and the stock supplied profiles. To be fair, I think had I done the custom profiles for my printer with the OEM ink and paper, i woudl also get better results. One should do that too if one wants to stay on a pure OEM track.

I've been doing my own longevity testing of the Mediastreet inks on some Ilford paper in my west facing office window. It will be a year in about a month, and there is no difference between the OEM and Mediastreet prints. There is no fading. There is no color shift. They are performing just as well as the test OEM print right alongside it. I printed the same picture on the same paper (Ilford) and then covered half of both prints with a book.

The economics are compelling - A set of the inks plus gloss optimizer is $159 (4oz bottles). This is about equivalent to 8 cartridges SETS for this printer. At the discounted price of $11 from Atlex, this comes to 8*$11*8 or $704 vs the $159 for the inks from Mediastreet for a cost savings of $545. I'm on my third set of bottles so my costs savings are more than $1500 over 24 equivalent ink cartridge sets (which also dispels the myth about damage to your printer propagated by Epson marketing).

For what I save, I could buy a new printer every 8 cartridge changes.

Here is a gallery of the Niagara IV connected to my R1800.

http://www.pbase.com/j​ohnj80/printing

I also believe you save more in ink because you completely get rid of the extraneous cleaning cycles that happen when one cart runs out and you replace it. The printer then charges all cartridges even if they were not replaced. Since I never change carts, and since the Niagara IV has a chip that resets everytime the printer is power cycled, it is never a problem.

As good as OEM prints (I'd say definitely better), no cartridge changing, huge cost savings - what not to like?

J

I use MIS inks and refillable cartridges with a 1290. Very satisfied.

JohnJ80 wrote in post #3333781
I too tired of buying the most ridiculously expensive fluid on the planet and looked for a solution.

I don't think moving to a CIS does compromise your printing. In point of fact, I feel I get better results with the ink I chose.

In my case, using an R1800, Mediastreet G7 pigment inks, and a Mediastreet Niagara IV CIS (http://www.mediastree​t.com). I did my own profiles (although Mediastreet will do them for you too). On the papers I print on (Red River Polar Satin is my favorite), I get better prints than I did with OEM ink, OEM paper and the stock supplied profiles. To be fair, I think had I done the custom profiles for my printer with the OEM ink and paper, i woudl also get better results. One should do that too if one wants to stay on a pure OEM track.

I've been doing my own longevity testing of the Mediastreet inks on some Ilford paper in my west facing office window. It will be a year in about a month, and there is no difference between the OEM and Mediastreet prints. There is no fading. There is no color shift. They are performing just as well as the test OEM print right alongside it. I printed the same picture on the same paper (Ilford) and then covered half of both prints with a book.

The economics are compelling - A set of the inks plus gloss optimizer is $159 (4oz bottles). This is about equivalent to 8 cartridges SETS for this printer. At the discounted price of $11 from Atlex, this comes to 8*$11*8 or $704 vs the $159 for the inks from Mediastreet for a cost savings of $545. I'm on my third set of bottles so my costs savings are more than $1500 over 24 equivalent ink cartridge sets (which also dispels the myth about damage to your printer propagated by Epson marketing).

For what I save, I could buy a new printer every 8 cartridge changes.

Here is a gallery of the Niagara IV connected to my R1800.

http://www.pbase.com/j​ohnj80/printing

I also believe you save more in ink because you completely get rid of the extraneous cleaning cycles that happen when one cart runs out and you replace it. The printer then charges all cartridges even if they were not replaced. Since I never change carts, and since the Niagara IV has a chip that resets everytime the printer is power cycled, it is never a problem.

As good as OEM prints (I'd say definitely better), no cartridge changing, huge cost savings - what not to like?

J

that's it. i'm gonna get it. i was just about to ask if the chip ever gets reset, but you answered it. so would you say that the ink levels still show accurate on the computer? or do they show at all?

adam75south wrote in post #3344309
that's it. i'm gonna get it. i was just about to ask if the chip ever gets reset, but you answered it. so would you say that the ink levels still show accurate on the computer? or do they show at all?

It looks like it resets it to about 80-90% at every power on. If you use the printer and never shut it off and used it until you, according to the chip, should have run out of ink it will give you an ink out light. but, if you turn it off and on, it is all reset.

I discovered that when I printed 4-5 13x34" panos all in one sitting.

What happens, IIRC, is that the printer keeps track on the chips of how often and how much ink it took out of that cartridge and estimates how much ink should be left - it is not measuring actual ink usage and amount remaining in the cart. THere is no sensor in the catridge to report ink remaining.

Look around at the available CIS systems and see what you like - they will all work ok with whatever ink. I do recommend the Mediastreet inks, however.

J

i'm very new to printing, but your custom profile for the red river polar satin and media street ink should work for any r1800...right?

It should, yes. But it will be more dialed in on my R1800 than on others due to variance in printers. Should be similar variance to that found with the Epson OEM profiles.

If you want it, let me know - I'll send it to you.

J

thanks alot john. it'll be a few weeks before i can get the ink system along with the paper to give you some feedback, but if you don't mind i will definitely take it. pm sent.

btw john, to add to your savings argument, you also save ink because nobody uses the little epson ink cartridges until they are completely empty, you will always throw away some of the epson ink.

How bad is the drying out issue with the Mediastreet cis?
I don't print very often but when I do its a lot and I was losing more cartridges to drying out than use so went to having them done instead.

That is pretty much how I print - Nothing for weeks and then intensely for a week or two. Generally, I need to clean the heads several times and then it is fine. It really isn't an issue of cleaning as it is of getting the bubbles out. Same thing happened to me with the OEM inks.

The benefit with the CIS and the Mediastreet inks is that it really doesn't matter now because the inks are something like 80-90% cheaper and the performance is the same or better.

J

Do the MediaStreet inks have the same print permanence/archival quality as the Epson UltraChrome K3?

Mediastreet inks were tested for longevity by the same guys that do Epson's (Wilhelm). You apparently can test them for a certain level of longevity - more testing takes more money and more time. Mediastreet came back at longevity longer than 50 years (or something like that - call them they can provide the specifics). That means that up to the time the test was terminated there was no color shift or fading (there is a set of specs that go with that).

I am testing it on Ilford Smooth Pearl - a paper that is not known for its longevity. After 11 months, no fade, no shift, no difference between unexposed print. Same results for Epson ink on the same paper. For reference, dye prints, not in the window of my office, but on a wall back away from the window facing at right angles to the window have noticeable fading/shifting in several months. After a year, they look pretty bad - very noticeable damage.

Also for reference, an Ektacrhome print will only last about 7-8 years per Wilhelm Imaging Institute. These are greater than 50 years (IIRC) which really means longer if cared for properly (glass, no UV etc..). That is pretty much starting to get into diminishing returns at that point. Prints you put in books (scrapbooks) of pigmented ink essentially last forever per some reports I've seen - like expected to last 200+ years.

Currently, my office window faces west with no obstacles all the way to the horizon. So, these prints get quite a bit of strong and direct sunlight each day - clear path straight to the sun. I'm pretty impressed with pigmented ink technology for sure.

J.

Thanks John.
I'm spending a lot on these little cartridges for my R2400.
But I want to give people good stuff that won't fade,
at least not in their lifetime.
Harry