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Thread started 03 Aug 2007 (Friday) 08:49
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NOT official ---40D

 
Yohan ­ Pamudji
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Aug 07, 2007 10:56 |  #91

chinch wrote in post #3681976 (external link)
canon nor any manufacturer will never do this. it's not even realistic as a consumer.

you think i can get 90% of a $50,000 car for $15,000 tomorrow. LOL. point me where i'm there tomorrow with a long line of friends & family.

The numbers I put up were just as an example to illustrate that it's always diminishing returns as we get into the high end. In high end equipment, paying twice the price doesn't get you anywhere near twice the performance, so there's a sweet spot in terms of price-performance ratio that will be different for every user.

The point was that if you can get a significant portion of 1DIII functionality in a 40D (which you already can in the 30D, so the 40D should be even better), pros who make their own living will give the 40D very careful consideration. Self-sustaining pros care very much about cost, despite your claim otherwise.

what competition? nikon is stuck in the sony 1.5x quagmire and new glass not compatible with FF. Sony, pentax.... snore.

I didn't say good competition :) Pentax is barely a blip on the radar, but Nikon's sales in this segment are better than Canon's. And why does it matter that Nikon is stuck at 1.5x when the Canon's xxD line is 1.6x? LOL!

all irrelevant to customers who dont live on canon message boards.

You think cross-type sensors are irrelevant? Have you ever tried focusing with an outer AF point on the 20D/30D in dim lighting? It's a nightmare compared to using the center AF point. Having all the AF points be as sensitive as the center cross-type point would be a huge improvement, maybe not to you but to people who actually need it.

i dont' see it whatsoever. canon probably has 4 bodies superior to ANY single competitor (1DS, 1DmkII, 1dmkIII, 5D). on the low end Rebel XT is dynamite too.

So because Canon is better in other market segments, this has what to do with the 30D segment?

you're just moaning that you have to pay $4999 for a 1DmkIII not $1600.

Now you're just putting words in my mouth. I don't expect to pay $1600 for a 1DIII. I just expect the 40D to have improved features that other manufacturers have already offered in this segment and I'm confident that Canon would do better than them, like more cross-type AF sensors, better noise performance, and weather sealing (not that important; just icing on the cake).

no it doesn't. all it will do is maybe give you cleaner, crisper pics to which many here grossly overprocess anyways.

If having better AF doesn't help you capture images in your shooting situations then great, but don't generalize your shooting habits with everybody else in the world. I've been in numerous dimly lit wedding reception, banquet, award ceremony, etc. situations where I would've killed to have the outer AF points be cross-type, and this was on a 1DII, not just a 20D. Canon finally saw the benefit of spreading out cross-type sensors and adding more of them, and did so on the 1DIII. I don't expect that many on a 40D, but I would hope they would at least add more of them.

I'll say it again: better equipment does make you a better photographer. Once again, not in the artistic sense but rather in the ability to execute one's artistic vision. Give a photographer a disposable camera and a 30D. Assuming he/she knows how to use both cameras, which one will he/she produce better photos with? Let's up the ante: tell that photographer to use the 2 cameras for a dimly let party. Does the camera matter? You bet it does.

With all due respect, the 30D (focus or ISO) and forthcoming 40D isn't going to limit your photography compared to the D200 or D300 or some pretend "competitor" camera... that i can say with certainty. :)

All cameras are obstacles that limit our photography in some form or another. Some are just less so than others, and for my purposes the 20D is already better than the competition for what I shoot, let alone the 30D. In terms of center point AF and high ISO noise the 20D is terrific, so I agree that the 40D should be better than the competition for my needs. But that doesn't mean I don't expect improvement in the next model, and when the competition demonstrates that it's possible to fit particular features into the cost constraints of this market segment I think it's reasonable to hope that Canon would do the same.




  
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Citizensmith
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Aug 07, 2007 11:16 |  #92

Pity, I was kind of hoping for some info on the 40D on a thread like this by now.

You folks go back to your chattin' instead :)


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chinch
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Aug 07, 2007 15:50 |  #93

Yohan Pamudji wrote in post #3684207 (external link)
You think cross-type sensors are irrelevant? Have you ever tried focusing with an outer AF point on the 20D/30D in dim lighting? It's a nightmare compared to using the center AF point. Having all the AF points be as sensitive as the center cross-type point would be a huge improvement, maybe not to you but to people who actually need it.

i manually set the outer AF points on my 10D with great regularity ;)

really this is silly complaining, probably from tekkies with bad skills, bad glass and/or slow glass (ie. kit lenses up to the superduper zooms like the 24-105/4)

Yohan Pamudji wrote in post #3684207 (external link)
but Nikon's sales in this segment are better than Canon's.

better sales for a few months does not really equate to "better than canon". i do believe with certaintly canon sold more drebels than nikon sold their <d200 lines to date and that trend will continue.


Yohan Pamudji wrote in post #3684207 (external link)
So because Canon is better in other market segments, this has what to do with the 30D segment?

i'd argue the 30D is better than the D200 myself but i was leaving that out since some here seam to have d200 worship (probalby cause it reads great on paper with "weatherproofing" and all ROTF).

if you were starting out looking for a new $1300-ish dSLR the 40D is a no brainer if you can't step up to the 5D. No other brand has compelling products, lenses or upgrade paths in regard to dSLR. lets get real.




  
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JohnnyG
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Aug 07, 2007 16:20 |  #94

Citizensmith wrote in post #3684301 (external link)
Pity, I was kind of hoping for some info on the 40D on a thread like this by now.

You folks go back to your chattin' instead :)

I agree! I guess people are getting bored waiting and getting off topic!:rolleyes:

If you want some info., have you seen the feature lists that are leaking out?
Here they are and you'll notice the two sets mostly agree. Here they are:


40 D specs
I apologize if it has been already posted here, but here’s a refresh:

From the same spanish reliable source (Rafa Irusta Blog site: En busca de la Luz) that did revealed the specs of the 400D and the MkIII before get the official announcement (and match them !!), here are the specs:

  • Sensor 1,6x - 10 Mpx
  • Self cleaning sensor
  • 3 "LCD
  • LiveView
  • Formats JPG, RAW and sRAW
  • ISO 100 to 1600 in steps of 1/3
  • Shooting speed 6,25 fps, 75 JPG or 17 RAW
  • Available grip BG-E2
  • 18-55mm lens renewed
  • No weather sealing
  • Possible DIGIC3

Possible launch date: around August 23th, Thursday ...

Sorry but not too revolutionary specs as many people expect or want.

6th - Another set of specs from Dslr (external link) --
  • 10M pixel CMOS 1.6x
  • DiGIC III Sensor Cleaning System
  • 6.5fps (3fps selectable)
  • sRAW support(RAW 12MB and sRAW 7MB - 14bit?)
  • 24 Custom function
  • 3 Custom mode(C1,C2,C3)
  • LiveView, Weather Sealing(?)
  • 230,000 pixel 3" LCD and 7 step brightness control
  • ISO 100-1600 1/3 stop. 3200 expand
  • ISO display in viewfinder
  • New wireless transmitter WFT-E3
  • New EF-s 18-55mm f3.5-5.6 IS
  • New grip BG-E2N
As you can see, pretty similar, but note WFT-E3 and the new lens - the side view of the camera below doesn't have the little cap covering the WFT connector - no bad thing given how easily I 've heard they fall off the 1D3 ;-)a
One comment I've seen made a few times is that the order of the buttons has been changed, compared with older models - I'm not sure just how important this is given the changes in shape and general handling between models. The suggestion is that if someone faked the pics, they would have kept the details like this the same (thanks ;-)a

Canon EOS 5D Mark II, 100-400IS L, 24-105 L[COLOR=black][FONT=&qu​ot] IS, 50mm f/1.4, Canon 430EX/580EX II, Kenko 1.5X, Epson R1900, Manfrotto 679B Monopod, 3021BPRO tripod, 808RC4 Head, 486RC2 Ballhead

  
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Mark0159
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Aug 07, 2007 16:21 |  #95

Citizensmith wrote in post #3684301 (external link)
Pity, I was kind of hoping for some info on the 40D on a thread like this by now.

You folks go back to your chattin' instead :)

I wouldn't called it chattin, I think more a long the lines of a internet disagreement. :lol:


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timbop
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Aug 07, 2007 16:29 |  #96

chinch wrote in post #3685823 (external link)
i manually set the outer AF points on my 10D with great regularity ;)

really this is silly complaining, probably from tekkies with bad skills, bad glass and/or slow glass (ie. kit lenses up to the superduper zooms like the 24-105/4)


And this is dismissive arrogance.....


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Formerly: 80D, 7D, 300D, 5D, 5DM2, 20D, 50D, 1DM2, 17-55IS, 24-70/2.8, 28-135IS, 40/2.8, 50/1.8, 50/1.4, 70-200/4IS, 70-300IS, 70-200/2.8, 100 macro, 400/5.6, tammy 17-50 and 28-75, sigma 50 macro & 100-300

  
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Yohan ­ Pamudji
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Aug 07, 2007 16:54 |  #97

chinch wrote in post #3685823 (external link)
i manually set the outer AF points on my 10D with great regularity ;)

really this is silly complaining, probably from tekkies with bad skills, bad glass and/or slow glass (ie. kit lenses up to the superduper zooms like the 24-105/4)

Er... what do I say to that? I guess I'll just concede the point, since you've made yours so precisely and convincingly. I'm gonna go sulk and take my 35L, 85L, 135L, f/2.8 L zooms, and bad skills home :rolleyes:

better sales for a few months does not really equate to "better than canon". i do believe with certaintly canon sold more drebels than nikon sold their <d200 lines to date and that trend will continue.

Once again, this has what to do with the 30D segment? You're right that the Digital Rebel is a strong line and sales are brisk, but that has nothing to do with the 30D segment where the picture is very different for Canon.

i'd argue the 30D is better than the D200 myself but i was leaving that out since some here seam to have d200 worship (probalby cause it reads great on paper with "weatherproofing" and all ROTF).

I already said the 20D is better than the D200 for my needs, so the 30D would be the same. I have no problem with such a claim. But there are aspects of the competition's cameras that I would love to see in a 40D. Is that such an unreasonable wish? Let's face it: the 20D to 30D upgrade was weak and weak sales show what the market thought of it. If Canon wants to be competitive in this sector they need to do better. If not for customers then for their own bottom line for sure.




  
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Yohan ­ Pamudji
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Aug 07, 2007 16:56 |  #98

theflyingkiwi wrote in post #3685988 (external link)
I wouldn't called it chattin, I think more a long the lines of a internet disagreement. :lol:

A "lively" chat, I think. Nothing like an ad hominem attack to add some spice to the conversation, eh? :lol:




  
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Yohan ­ Pamudji
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Aug 07, 2007 17:00 |  #99

JohnnyG,

I saw those new specs at Northlight too. 24 custom functions? How many are on the 30D, 19? I wonder if we'll get a quiet mode like the 1D-series where the mirror doesn't slap back down until you let go of the shutter release button? That would be a nice feature to have if the 40D continues to be the noisy cricket of the Canon lineup. I bet some of those custom functions will be to control the 580EX II settings from the camera. Ooh, interchangeable focusing screens? Probably not.




  
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Headcase650
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Aug 07, 2007 17:43 |  #100

Maybe a custom function For the hypothetical Auto ISO. Maybe set its range to shift with in.


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chinch
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Aug 07, 2007 18:50 |  #101

timbop wrote in post #3686036 (external link)
And this is dismissive arrogance.....

call it what you want, but i notice you fail to dispute it

anyone "whining" about the "40D specs" is just either ignorant or TOTALLY unrealistic in their expectations. sorry but that is just the way it is.

i stand by the fact that alot of xxD "message board camera enthusiasts" shooters are clueless - not saying you are - but alot of random whining about an unannounced camera WHEN CANON HAS THE BEST CAMERA IN EVERY CLASS FROM P/S ELPH TO 1DMKIII is just too much here to read sorry.




  
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timbop
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Aug 07, 2007 19:23 |  #102

chinch wrote in post #3686949 (external link)
call it what you want, but i notice you fail to dispute it

anyone "whining" about the "40D specs" is just either ignorant or TOTALLY unrealistic in their expectations. sorry but that is just the way it is.

i stand by the fact that alot of xxD "message board camera enthusiasts" shooters are clueless - not saying you are - but alot of random whining about an unannounced camera WHEN CANON HAS THE BEST CAMERA IN EVERY CLASS FROM P/S ELPH TO 1DMKIII is just too much here to read sorry.

I didn't dispute because it would be a waste of my time. The specific comment you dismissed was about the UTILITY of having high precision cross sensors on the periphery, rather than just the center - it had nothing to do with whether the purported 40D has such a feature.

Nonetheless, apparently no one should shoot in a way other than your specific situations and perfect technique. If you don't like reading the kinds of comments made by the majority of the posters in this thread, then MOVE ON and stop berating people.


Current: 5DM3, 6D, 8mm fish, 24-105/4IS, 35/2IS, 70-200/2.8IS, 85/1.8, 100-400/IS v1, lensbaby composer with edge 80, 580's and AB800's
Formerly: 80D, 7D, 300D, 5D, 5DM2, 20D, 50D, 1DM2, 17-55IS, 24-70/2.8, 28-135IS, 40/2.8, 50/1.8, 50/1.4, 70-200/4IS, 70-300IS, 70-200/2.8, 100 macro, 400/5.6, tammy 17-50 and 28-75, sigma 50 macro & 100-300

  
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Paul ­ Tinworth
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Aug 07, 2007 19:26 |  #103

I'm very excited about the '40D', I must say! The supposed specifications may not be enough to please everyone, but that's entirely subjective in my view.

One major thing that sticks out to me is this rumour of an 18-55mm IS lens. I don't think it's plausible when the 17-85mm is available. I reckon it's purely a rumour, but I suppose we'll see in due course.

I'm not taking anything as solid fact, yet. Perhaps everyone should do the same! ;)


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Citizensmith
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Aug 07, 2007 21:29 |  #104

It will be an updated 18-55 apparently, but it certainly won't have IS. That would put the cost up way to much to be the cheapo kit lens. Whoever said it had IS was talking crap and should be disregarded for ever. And laughed at.


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JohnnyG
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Aug 07, 2007 21:48 |  #105

Citizensmith wrote in post #3687906 (external link)
It will be an updated 18-55 apparently, but it certainly won't have IS. That would put the cost up way to much to be the cheapo kit lens. Whoever said it had IS was talking crap and should be disregarded for ever. And laughed at.

I would not put it past Canon to have a kit lens with IS. IS is a very popular feature in the marketplace now especially with the camera companies putting it in the body. The public really likes that and expects it. People can say that IS in body is no good but the public thinks it is. So I would not be surprised that they chose to put it in the kit lens for an extra price of course. It's like dust removal is now required!

So that's my very humble opinion.:lol::lol::lol:


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