Kiwi - GKPE - General Ramblings (2)

Moppie wrote in post #4367308
I tend to think of Marketing as Sales dishonest cousin.
So any company that builds itself around just doing marketing has to be about as dishonest as the law will allow. Since they are also related to sales, they are of course also greedy, lazy, and divorced from reality.

So when a young, niave student walks into a marketing organisation they are bit like a minke whale in a japanese fishing harbour.
They either have to evolve into Godzilla very quickly, or end up on someone dinners table.


Its been my experiance that anyone involved in either industry, or proffesion, who is of sound mind and body, who isn't greedy and lazy, either moves on and starts thier own company, changes jobs, or finds one of the niche industries that don't market to a wide audiance. For example large volume wholesale sales, etc.

Moppie you sound like the Sociology H.O.D. He was the king of ripping apart occupations and organizations. I would spend 2 hours listening to how much he despises the new trends in marketing. He even said they should widen the lanes on the motorways in Auckland and bust down all the poor people on the sides with all the state houses he was pretty hardcore. haha

weka2000 wrote in post #4367332
So whats everyones weekend plans ?

I have none so far and only 7 days to get my book photos done and sorted.

work and socialize.

i am login on at work.. hmm why i am at work and not on a race track i have yet to work that one out yet....

Mediation wrote in post #4367357
Moppie you sound like the Sociology H.O.D. He was the king of ripping apart occupations and organizations. I would spend 2 hours listening to how much he despises the new trends in marketing. He even said they should widen the lanes on the motorways in Auckland and bust down all the poor people on the sides with all the state houses he was pretty hardcore. haha

I spent more than a little bit of time at UOA, studying mostly philosophy and ethics, with a good dose of Psychology thrown in for good measure.

somethingsimple wrote in post #4366671
how long ago was this?

October (just before Labour weekend) was when they stuffed 400 prints for me. I've still got the prints and ready to present them when they ask for them. I got them back on a Thur after work and the client was coming to get them Friday. I had no time to ask Frogprints to reprint so went to Camera House late night Thursday and did them there. A month later I'm still trying to get compensation. They were so obviously off colour they should have been able to see. they all had a yellow tinge. The green grass was no longer green and the BM's dresses looked bl00dy awful :/ unfortunately I didnt notice till I got all the way home at 6pm when I looked at them. Outside of their business hours. I was in tears they were so bad. There was no way I was giving them to a bride and groom.

weka2000 wrote in post #4367332
So whats everyones weekend plans ?

I have none so far and only 7 days to get my book photos done and sorted.

We're moving house woohoo

lil_miss wrote in post #4367454
October (just before Labour weekend)...

We're moving house woohoo

man thats slack of them (frogprints)

good luck with your move, hope it all goes smoothly
remember content insurance policies are not valid during house moving

well i just threw another image the book's way - thats 3 now
might do one more and that will be it really
unfortunately i have not got model releases for the 'people' images i would like to submit so i guess that won't be happening

do you wedding photogs get your couples to sign releases? what do you do with family shots? it would get difficult to have ALL of the guests sign releases

somethingsimple wrote in post #4367480
good luck with your move, hope it all goes smoothly
remember content insurance policies are not valid during house moving

Ours is I've checked. We have a nationwide policy including transit.

somethingsimple wrote in post #4367480
do you wedding photogs get your couples to sign releases? what do you do with family shots? it would get difficult to have ALL of the guests sign releases

As part of the contract ours sign, we have a model release paragraph included in there. Generally they are signing on behalf I guess, but I dont tend to use family photos for anything, its mainly B&G and bridal party. I'm not sure whether its required to get all the bridal party to sign.. might have to look into that...

release forms..... not for wedding days.

I always just politely ask if I can post them on my site, if they have an issue I don't post them, no skin off my nose.

I have that issue more with my kids birthday parties..... I have some awesome shots from last weekend (my daughters 4th) but I can't post them up because I haven't found the parents of the kids in the shots to ask permission..... ah well.

I'll print them out a copy and ask when I hand it over.

I had a good chat with the canon rep down here. hmm looks like i should be able to source gear from them direct.. at the dealer price... thats will save a few bucks..

Moppie wrote in post #4367390
I spent more than a little bit of time at UOA, studying mostly philosophy and ethics, with a good dose of Psychology thrown in for good measure.

Ah so it all makes sense now. You truly do think like an Arts student. Do you're photographs reflect what you have learned? because mine do... kind of. lol

sothen wrote in post #4367516
release forms..... not for wedding days.

I always just politely ask if I can post them on my site, if they have an issue I don't post them, no skin off my nose.

I have that issue more with my kids birthday parties..... I have some awesome shots from last weekend (my daughters 4th) but I can't post them up because I haven't found the parents of the kids in the shots to ask permission..... ah well.

I'll print them out a copy and ask when I hand it over.

I looked through you're flickr late last night. Very awesome! you get heaps of attention on the flickr as well.

Mediation wrote in post #4367535
Do you're photographs reflect what you have learned?

If they reflected what I learned there would be nothing in them.......

lil_miss wrote in post #4367514
Ours is I've checked. We have a nationwide policy including transit.

As part of the contract ours sign, we have a model release paragraph included in there. Generally they are signing on behalf I guess, but I dont tend to use family photos for anything, its mainly B&G and bridal party. I'm not sure whether its required to get all the bridal party to sign.. might have to look into that...

phew!

re: release - i was thinking more along the lines of some fantastic candid moment involving some nameless guest at a wedding or event... oh well it still wont help me get releases for the shots i wanted to post so i guess i'll worry about it later

ive stuck my 4th shot up, now ive entered transportation, b&w/still-life/experiemental, birds & macro

oh wait i can still enter nature - one to go then im done
wonder if any will be selected?

lil_miss wrote in post #4367454
October (just before Labour weekend)

i ordered a couple of prints from them on the 19th and there was nothings wrong with mine. Thats strange

Moppie wrote in post #4367308
I tend to think of Marketing as Sales dishonest cousin.
So any company that builds itself around just doing marketing has to be about as dishonest as the law will allow. Since they are also related to sales, they are of course also greedy, lazy, and divorced from reality.

So when a young, niave student walks into a marketing organisation they are bit like a minke whale in a japanese fishing harbour.
They either have to evolve into Godzilla very quickly, or end up on someone dinners table.

Its been my experiance that anyone involved in either industry, or proffesion, who is of sound mind and body, who isn't greedy and lazy, either moves on and starts thier own company, changes jobs, or finds one of the niche industries that don't market to a wide audiance. For example large volume wholesale sales, etc.

Ouch... it looks like you have had very unpleasant experiences with some of the people in the industry... I do apologise, but do understand why you feel that way.

It has always been a stigma for us in industries that you mention above, i.e., niche industries... I've been in sales & marketing all my working life and I yet have to rip someone off... nor would I think of myself as dishonest or lazy...

Wazza wrote in post #4367217
Well I find wages are about 40% more, so is food, petrol, but other things the same price - like cars, and electronics are cheaper in UK, like big screen TVs. Cameras bit more expensive. So I definitely have more money here.

I can live with that!

dgcorner wrote in post #4367719
Ouch... it looks like you have had very unpleasant experiences with some of the people in the industry... I do apologise, but do understand why you feel that way.

It has always been a stigma for us in industries that you mention above, i.e., niche industries... I've been in sales & marketing all my working life and I yet have to rip someone off... nor would I think of myself as dishonest or lazy...

I have known, and do know some very good sales and marketing people.
My Father was in Sales and sales management for a very long time, before starting an import business that is very sales based. he would have to be one of the best salesmen in the country, and like yourself an exception to a generalisation.
No need to aplogise for the failings of others
I've also done a reasonable amount of low level sales myself, so I have some understanding of whats involved in the process.

Unfortunatly I also know plenty of sales and marketing people who fit very neatly into the stereo type.

somethingsimple wrote in post #4367589
phew!

re: release - i was thinking more along the lines of some fantastic candid moment involving some nameless guest at a wedding or event... oh well it still wont help me get releases for the shots i wanted to post so i guess i'll worry about it later

ive stuck my 4th shot up, now ive entered transportation, b&w/still-life/experiemental, birds & macro

oh wait i can still enter nature - one to go then im done
wonder if any will be selected?

Speaking of the book, does anyone think that anything I've posted so far would be worthy of submission?

Cheers.