Soft Box vs. Umbrellas

theusername wrote in post #5494254
There's nothing interesting about the quality of light

What's "interesting" about the quality of light. It can be beautiful. That's what counts.

Lotto wrote in post #5495941
3) I can place a SB lot closer to the subject.

I can agree with the other points, but not this one: A shoot through umbrella can be about as close as a SB IMO.

One advantage to an umbrella: Keeps you and your equipment (about) dry when you get caught in the rain

Tareq wrote in post #5496221
Will larger umbrella be a good idea?

Having options is always good.
Why would you want a larger umbrella?

Lotto wrote in post #5495941
To me, beside giving more even and softer light, softbox has better directional controls, specially the ones with recessed front lip and fabric grids.

1) To prevent light hitting the BG, SB does better job than umbrella.

2) I can feather the light better with SB.

3) I can place a SB lot closer to the subject.

4) I can turn a large softbox into a smaller SB by using a gobo to block portion of the SB off.

5) Sometimes when I need ground level or upward lighting, I just take the SB/strobe off the lightstand and lay them on the floor. Lot tougher to do that with a bounce amb.

1) yes a softbox does a better job, but with the correct distance from the BG this can be done with an umbrella

2) yes, better but still can be done with an umbrella

3) umbrellas can be placed close also

4) can be done with an umbrella too

5) OK, this might be one instance

Im not arguing which is better, I just dont understand what you can do with a SB that u cant with an umbrella. You may be able to do things easier with an SB, but these things can still be done with an umbrella IMO

form wrote in post #5491613
I bought umbrellas because they were inexpensive, and sufficient (I thought) for my purposes. Little did I know that I would quickly develop a craving for more control over light because I have seen what controlled light can do that widely dispersed light can't. Sometimes it's the difference between acceptable quality and great photos.

TMR Design: I hope you don't take offense to this, but it looks like you're doing about the same level of photos that I do, and am not satisfied with. Feel free to disagree if you like, but here are a few samples of a recent shoot:

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One or two umbrellas for key and fill, sometimes reflector for fill, and sometimes third flash in partly deflated umbrella for edge light. Flashes were 580EX and up to 2 sunpak 383S, white bounce umbrellas 41-43".

This is not satisfactory level work for me.

Sorry to say I do not agree with you at all.

If you feel my work is not satisfactory then that is your opinion and you're entitled to it, but I do take offense. I won't comment on your work.

I own and use softboxes. I've used octaboxes and strip banks. I have a home studio that I've carefully built so I have control over every aspect of my lighting. I did not choose to voice a positive opinion about umbrellas because I am limited in knowledge, skill or experience, or the funds to have other modifiers.

May I see some of the comments you've received on those shots you're posting. Do you have pages and pages of people chiming in to praise your work and comment on the quality of your lighting. I do, both here and at Nikon Cafe.

Please do not include me in your comparisons. I see a world of difference between my shots and yours.

Ihave jsut ordered some umbrellas and as an introduction to lighting im sure i would like touse them first and see their limits.

I may want a softbox in the future but we will see how i get on with the umbrellas first.

René Damkot wrote in post #5496305
Having options is always good.
Why would you want a larger umbrella?

I don't know, just to use it if it is necessary sometimes, as each modifier has its own pros, so to have something better than nothing and always wishing to have this and that, but what do you think, will you go and buy larger umbrella or larger softbox?

They are subtly different.
I like a shoot through umbrella for portraits. Sometimes a softbox works better for what I want. Sometimes a Hazylight. Sometimes a diffuson panel. They are just slightly different. Experiment.

IMO the placement of the modifier can make a bigger difference then the type.

Another modifier you might want to look at is the Photek Softlighter. Very nice quality of light.

Also: Have a look at Shootsmarter. (You'll need to log in, but that's worth it)

Here is an article showing the difference between different sized umbrellas at different distances.
Here is one with softboxes.

René Damkot wrote in post #5496436
They are subtly different.
I like a shoot through umbrella for portraits. Sometimes a softbox works better for what I want. Sometimes a Hazylight. Sometimes a diffuson panel. They are just slightly different. Experiment.

IMO the placement of the modifier can make a bigger difference then the type.

Another modifier you might want to look at is the Photek Softlighter. Very nice quality of light.

Also: Have a look at Shootsmarter. (You'll need to log in, but that's worth it)

Here is an article showing the difference between different sized umbrellas at different distances.
Here is one with softboxes.

Thank you very much.

I think i have to work with my octabox and the strobe reflectors and the grids, later i may add larger umbrella or softbox if needed.

I'm comparing the pictures you posted to the pictures I posted. My style is different from yours, but I think that the end result is of similar "quality." You can take offense and use the grand amounts of praise you receive for your work in your defense; it doesn't bother me. My eyes see no compositional advantage in yours or mine, and the lighting achieved is "different." Your lighting is simpler and looks intended to blend the daytime with the flash, whereas mine attempts to compete with the daytime and provide most of the light in the places I want it to.

The only other major difference between your results and mine is that your bokeh suggests a longer focal length that I don't have.

See what you want to see. I won't dispute this with you but quite frankly your images look amateur at best. I'm done here my friend.

Do yourself a favor and speak about your work as it stands. Don't compare to others. It makes you look foolish. You work is not satisfactory as you stated. Mine is light years from that. OK. Have a nice day.

Clearly my eyesight does not have the same capacity for perception of quality as yours does. I bow to the more experienced photographer with the more expensive equipment. Maybe you could explain to me how yours are better, so I can improve my future efforts?

TMR Design wrote in post #5495875
I take offense to these kinds of blanket statements. Speak for yourself and not those you don't know.

I thought that I had emphasized the sarcasm with dual at the end.

Maybe the subject is just touchy and someone has lost their sense of humor.

Hi Randy,

In a public (text based) forum it can be very difficult to distinguish sarcasm from a serious comment. My apologies for the misinterpretation.

That's why they invented those little smiley faces because what you said is completely true with any text based communication, especially emails.

1. Here's something that may or may not be useful (and could be fixed with a sand bag). Outdoors, umbrellas tend to blow over more easily in the wind than a SB. Also, I use a Lastolite Ezybox, so when it does blow over, it isn't broken - unlike my last two umbrellas.

2. Also, I believe that when comparing a shoot through and a SB, efficiency can become an issue.

I hope 'TMR Design and 'Form' would cut it out....or at least take it over to some place like the DPReview "Lighting Techniques" forum where "grenade throwing" and thin skinned reactions is normal.

In my view, whenever images are posted, C&C should be expected....which, while not necessarily always positive, should be constructive and/or instructional. If one becomes easily "offended" by C&C....well...don't post 'em.