Bouncing flash versus diffuser

Don't have a flash yet (just bought my 40D 3 weeks ago) but looking to invest in one to shoot people indoors (lol). Have a few questions:

• In my limited understanding it seems like people choose to use a diffuser when bouncing the flash light off a wall/object is not possible. True or false?
  
• Do people ever put a diffuser on a flash then try to bounce the light off something else or is this overkill?
  
• Normally do you only bounce the flash off a wall/object if it is white (and relatively closer in distance) to achieve a natural lighting?

Ken,

Personally if I am only using one flash on camera indoor my first choice is to bounce off a neutral colored wall with no diffuser. In this case the wall IS the diffuser. By bouncing it off a wall it converts my small harsh light source into a large diffuse light source. No sense in adding a diffusser on top of the bounce. It will only serve to eat up more flash power. The next priority would be for me to bounce off the ceiling, again, with no diffuser. But, that being said I WOULD use a bounce card. I have one built in to my 580EX flash that I pull up when bouncing. I do this because you do want to throw some 'extra' light forward to help fill some of the shadow areas you may still get from a bounce flash. For example when bouncing off the ceiling most of the light is now going to be coming down from above and falling on the subject which can cause shadows in the eye sockets, not good, racoon face. But, using the bounce card throws just enough forward to fill those shadows to make it look better.

My last choice is to use a diffuser with no bounce and only use that method when there is nothing to bounce off.

Of course if i am shooting a wedding reception and know that the place has no where to bounce I will bring extra flashes on stands and use those.

Dermit wrote in post #5508757
Ken,
The next priority would be for me to bounce off the ceiling, again, with no diffuser. But, that being said I WOULD use a bounce card. I have one built in to my 580EX flash that I pull up when bouncing. I do this because you do want to throw some 'extra' light forward to help fill some of the shadow areas you may still get from a bounce flash. For example when bouncing off the ceiling most of the light is now going to be coming down from above and falling on the subject which can cause shadows in the eye sockets, not good, racoon face. But, using the bounce card throws just enough forward to fill those shadows to make it look better.

Great stuff...so basically you are using the cue/flash card strapped to a flash with the rubber band trick. So if you do this to decrease the amount of shadows/get extra light is there a scenario where there is 'too much' light? Meaning can your diffused light make the subject seem overexposed?

Also I plan to mainly shoot friends in bars/clubs stands might not be in the cards for me. In that case I guess my options are bouncing the flash off walls and using the diffuser. So a few more questions:

• When using the diffuser do you point the flash then directly at your subjects instead of 45 degree/straight up with a diffuser-less flash?
  
• Are there different types of diffusers for your Canon 580EX? If so in what situations do you use each type?
  
• Considering black is considered a 'neutral color' would you normally consider bouncing light off a black wall/ceiling? Seems to me to achieve nice skin tone on the subjects you would bounce more off white/beige/ivory colored walls.
  

Here's a good link.

Rene posts an excellent link. I've read it bofre, lots of good info! Notice one of the key common factors is that they almost always try and make sure the ambient light is a part of the exopsure. You leran how to do that, with the right mix, and that's most of the battle.

Eating lunch in the office while reading the link as we speak...haha. If you guys got any other ideas or links send them over my way. Thanks!

The key will be to try what you read. You have to make it sink in. You have to absolutely understand what is happening with every setting you dial in and what to adjust to get specific things to happen. So make sure you not only read, but go and do. And do it over and over until you can do it blindfolded in your sleep

I was planning to pick up a 580EX last week but just wanted to make sure I didn't overwhelm myself by throwing in a flash component since I was still figuring out how to shoot manually. Went out this weekend for the 2nd time with my camera and shot completely manually (which was pretty cool). Basically my goal this past weekend was to learn how to change the aperture/shutter speed (ISO I keep constant until I needed to crank that up to compensate for action shots) and still keep good exposure and I also played around with DOF/selective focus.

My initial goal with the flash is to shoot my friends while out so I'm going to give it a go with my 17-85mm f/ 4-5.6 lens sometime after I get the flash. I gather I should get myself a shorter focal length lens with a lower f-stop to shoot in tight dark spaces but we'll see.

http://www.photonotes.​org/articles/eos-flash/
http://www.abetterboun​cecard.com/

I have a Lightsphere diffuser on my 420EX flash that gives me the best of both worlds, assuming that ceilings are low enough to bounce the flash. With the diffuser pointed at the ceiling I get some direct light from the side of the diffuser and bounced flash from the ceiling. I think it's almost as good as studio lights at a fraction of the cost.

The flash/diffuser combination is so useful that I almost never take them off the camera. The lightsphere also works well with macro shots.

One of the things I don't like about diffusers is that they eat some of your light's power, and that's not always something you want. I realize there will be times when you can't ALWAYS bounce your flash, but I'm a big fan of bouncing with a bounce card on the flash, or off a wall or ceiling. I've also used some foam core board held by an assistant and firing my flash into the white foam cord as my bounce flash method as well.

There are other ways, I'd also suggest taking a look at www.strobist.com. They have more information that you might find useful, like taking your flash off camera and tripping it using "Poverty Wizards" or some other similar radio triggering device.

A 580EX or 550EX (what I have) have their own built-in diffuser that you can pop out, or you can use it as a sort of bounce card. I find it works fairly well. Flash is a very important thing to buy, IMO better to have a flash a medium quality lenses than L lenses and no flash at all. I had a 17-85 and took some nice pics with a flash.

The pop up card is not a diffuser, it does nothing to diffuse the light, it just bounces some of it forward. It doesn't bounce enough forward if you are any sort of distance away. That is why I prefer the better bounce card of the demb flipit.

I also have a Lumiquest Pocket Bouncer that I attached to my 430ex with some velcro. works great when the ceilings are non-existant, too high, or some gawd-awful color.

Shooting wrote in post #5516938
The pop up card is not a diffuser, it does nothing to diffuse the light, it just bounces some of it forward. It doesn't bounce enough forward if you are any sort of distance away. That is why I prefer the better bounce card of the demb flipit.

Unless the bounce card is a mirror then yes, it does diffuse the light.