Poor exposure with umbrella- Need help.

Wherever the flash is pointed is what it 'sees'.

coralnutz wrote in post #5726051
I didn't realized the ttl would work through or bounced off of the umbrella. I thought the flashe's sensors needed top "see" the subject to figure it out.

I only have sunpak 383s so don't really know anything about ttl.

TTL= "Through The Lens" The camera needs to be able to see what the flash is illuminating. The flashes need to be able to "see" each other to communicate.

The first two look like they were shot without the two flashes being completely charged, and the last one looks like only the 580 EX fired. I use the following setup, which is very similar to yours with excellent results:

420EX (slave) bouncing into umbrella (not enough power for shoot through IMO) as my key light
580EX II (master) mounted on camera for fill

I shoot using ETTL II and adjust the ratios to get the desired result (approx 3:1). Typically camera in manual at f/7.1, 1/125s, ISO 100.

This setup works very well for two person head and shoulders portraits or maybe 1-2 people full length, which is all I need.

I've had many results like the ones you've shown, which always happens when I'm not paying attention to ensure that the flashes are fully charged before taking the shot. Also, the 420EX charges much more slowly than the 580EX II.

Just to be sure....is your 580EX set up like this?

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DDCSD wrote in post #5726059
TTL= "Through The Lens" The camera needs to be able to see what the flash is illuminating. The flashes need to be able to "see" each other to communicate.

aha... that makes sense.

Thanks

TMR Design wrote in post #5726056
Wherever the flash is pointed is what it 'sees'.

Indoors, particularly at this range, the bounce of the master should be easily seen by the slave.

It would be better practice to have the slave body (red plastic) be pointed to the master.

What ratios do you have set?

TJ

No, it is reall not all that difficult to get enough light for a portrait, although getting the right mood can be tricky. That is why I thought that using them together would eliminate a reflector.

Thanks for all the responses. Lets see if I can hit them all here.

1. Flashes all had new batteries, and all were charged prior to firing.

2. Flashes worked fine seperatly.

3. Initial ratios were 1:4 (master being only fill and side light at 45 degrees as key light).

4. Final ratios for all above photos were 1:1 with no umbrella, just to grasp at some sense of light... to no avail. I'd guess that (have no meter) final photo would have been about another stop darker with umbrella attached.

5. both strobes were with 5 ft. of subject, and maybe 5 ft. roughly of each other, with 10 ft. white ceiling so should have been plenty of light going around to read each other.

6. Haven't ever tried these strobes on "manual mode" so don't know if they would overcome this or not.

7. Use ETTL all the time for portraits, as bounce and fill with great results, but this is the first occasion that I've ever tried to use these strobes together... although I've used other 580/430 strobes together in the past without issues.

8. I am not SURE that they both fired, but am sure that both pre-flashes did fire. I'll have to work that out.

9. I did not have the sensor of slave pointed at master, due to close proximity, but I'll try that and see if it helps.

Again, these seem to work very well as indvidual units, so I don't THINK that they are malfuntioning, but all my settings look fine, and they just don't seem to work TOGETHER, so I'm sure that it is something simple. I'll try pointing the sensor at Master, and keep yall informed, and if anybody has any other ideas, I'm all ears (or thumbs).

Were you firing the flashes straight on or bouncing? Sorry if you said that already, but I can't find it if you did.

I tried both.

OK, update:

Turns out that the Master was not firing after all, just a pre-flash.

Something to do with the setup. I have not gotten it to fire. It was acting like it was set with the master "off", when it wasn't. It didn't do it consistantly but after changing it back and forth a few times it now will work, so in an effort not to mess it up again, I've decided to leave the flash always set in Master/ratio mode. I figure that as long as I'm not shooting with the 430 set for slave it won't matter. I see that it will still function normally if it is the only flash in the room like this.

Not an ideal solution, but other than accidentially triggering someone else's flash if in the vicinity, which is not going to be a problem usually, are there any other downsides to leaving it alone, as-is?