Review: Gitzo 1541T Tripod, Markins Q3T Ballhead w/ RRS B2 LR II Clamp

I'm a huge Gitzo fan (have two of 'em). That said, I think the travel tripod lineup is the weakest part of the product line. I'd never touch a Benro tripod, but I would have little issue with Feisol. By all reports they have been decent in customer service and in reliability. Not as good as Gitzo, but a reputable supplier.

J

JohnJ80 wrote in post #9918884
Well, I simply don't ever use the center columns. When you pay all that money seeking stability for sharpness, why give it up and then extend the camera on an unstable single column? When I can, I remove them from the tripod to save weight.

From experience, I find that in most non-windy days, using the central column isn't an issue. There's no perceivable loss in sharpness. I can't see it. Obviously the situation would be different in windy situations.

J,

It's too late for me to switch again. I went from a Gitzo GT1530 to GT1541T. I have no intentions of switching again at least for the short-term. Looking back now, I probably should have got the Gitzo GT1541. Not only was it cheaper, there were plenty in stock throughout Hong Kong at the time. I won't be back in Hong Kong for a while and there's no way I'll buy a Gitzo tripod in the US when it's cheaper in HK and you can negotiate the price (not sure if you can always negotiate, but I always try conversing in Cantonese with those guys to form a bond).

Of course I can kneel, but it's not always practical. IIRC, I think I'm a bit shorter than you. I'm roughly 5.85 feet tall and I'm already in my mid-20s. Not that I'm suggesting that I'm old, but I'm not getting any younger by the day. Constantly bending my back may not be an option as I get older.

Noobic wrote in post #9918944
im 165cm will the 1541t + q3t works fine for me with a batt gripless cam? Also will the leg protectors affect the grip of the tripod? like sliding around on smooth tiles and stuff or maybe is there any other alternative way to protect it? Lastly is the 1541t sort of water resistant? Thanks.

I think so. I'm slightly taller than you. The shorter you are, the better the GT1541T will be for you.

hyt wrote in post #9920908
This is exactly the problem with short tripods. Some people try to rationalize their way around it by saying "Well, photos are boring from eye level anyway, and using a lower perspective results in more interesting shots." But as you have realized, it's just too often untrue.

I don't think there is a one size fit-all approach. It really depends on the situation, but there are definitely times where a low perspective does deliver a pleasant result, at least to me anyways. If I was a bit shorter, I would probably be all over this tripod.

I'm a big fan of Gitzo products. This is my second Gitzo tripod and it's well-built. I probably wouldn't go with any other brands unless some other company come out with a game changer.

lsquare wrote in post #9922844
From experience, I find that in most non-windy days, using the central column isn't an issue. There's no perceivable loss in sharpness. I can't see it. Obviously the situation would be different in windy situations.

J,

It's too late for me to switch again. I went from a Gitzo GT1530 to GT1541T. I have no intentions of switching again at least for the short-term. Looking back now, I probably should have got the Gitzo GT1541. Not only was it cheaper, there were plenty in stock throughout Hong Kong at the time. I won't be back in Hong Kong for a while and there's no way I'll buy a Gitzo tripod in the US when it's cheaper in HK and you can negotiate the price (not sure if you can always negotiate, but I always try conversing in Cantonese with those guys to form a bond).

Of course I can kneel, but it's not always practical. IIRC, I think I'm a bit shorter than you. I'm roughly 5.85 feet tall and I'm already in my mid-20s. Not that I'm suggesting that I'm old, but I'm not getting any younger by the day. Constantly bending my back may not be an option as I get older.

I'm 6' even and 50 so I can tell you, while I can do the bending, it's not fun. That said, your height is more compatible with the 1540T than is mine.

That's also what I mean when I say that Gitzo has a hole in their lineup with the travelers - they need to be able to go taller WITHOUT using the column. Feisol can and it's a winner position for them unless Gitzo comes up with an alternative.

If you really want to go lightweight, then its the 0 series and then you kneel for sure.

I can tell you that there is a real difference in tripods in Gitzo's line and their ability to dampen vibration. I did some pretty extensive testing that was similar to the testing that Leica magazine did back in 1/06 to figure this out. Basically, if you use the magnification factor of the max focal length that Gitzo specs on each of their tripods, you can use the ratio of that to figure out the ranking of the tripods and their ability to damp vibration. So, if the tripod is rated at 200mm, then it is only able to damp 1/2 the vibration that one that is rated 400mm can. I can also tell you that when you use exposures that are subject to softness from vibration, and when there is vibration present, it absolutely will make a difference of which tripod you select and whether the column is up or not. Any tripod, in the absence of vibration, will provide a sharp image - it's the case of vibration present that matters.

Without getting into it much more, it seems that one of the biggest factors, for a given quality or layup of CF, is the diameter of the tubes in the legs. Also, for what it's worth, with my Gitzo's that I tested, hanging a mass from the hook had no impact. Gitzo tripods (at least my two) are very immune to vertical vibration up from the feet (which is what the mass would help) - so much so that it is pretty much a waste of effort to do it.

Also interesting, but not of much importance with travelers, is that the large heavy aluminum tripods are equaled in performance by the Series 2 and for sure Series 3 that weigh a small fraction according to the Leica article. At least so for rotational vibration (i.e. like from wind) which is the most difficult to control

J.

JohnJ80,

I often hang my camera bag on my 055PROB in an attempt to stop wind affecting it, but I arrange for it to drag on the ground more than hang. That way it does not start swinging as the wind catches it, which would actually make things worse rather than better if not prevented.

What we need is some agreed "standard" for tripod/head testing. I imagine using a laser on the tripod aimed at a target a set distance away would be a good starting point? Maybe a standardized system of loads as well?

Lowner wrote in post #9924391
JohnJ80,

I often hang my camera bag on my 055PROB in an attempt to stop wind affecting it, but I arrange for it to drag on the ground more than hang. That way it does not start swinging as the wind catches it, which would actually make things worse rather than better if not prevented.

What we need is some agreed "standard" for tripod/head testing. I imagine using a laser on the tripod aimed at a target a set distance away would be a good starting point? Maybe a standardized system of loads as well?

That's the standard method for using the mass for stabilization.

if you read the Leica jan 06 article on tripods, they discuss a testing methodology:

http://www.giottos.com​/News-MT-awards.htm

I think this has some flaws in the vertical vibration modeling that they used - namely putting the tripod on a concrete floor on top of two sheets of cardboard. I'm not sure what that looks like in real life and I'd think it would be too bouncy. The pendulum is probably decent for simulating rotational vibration.

I did a similar test to this with a laser and the results were consistent and matched Gitzo's specs (essentially verified the specs). When I tested some other cheapie tripods that I have, the results showed that these tripod were essentially junk - much worse than I thought they would be.

On the issue with the mass - On both of the Gitzo's that I have (1258 and 3541LS), in using this testing when the tripods were setup on a hardwood floor over a basement/floor joist typical US construction, and when I jumped up and down as hard as I could right next to the tripods, no significant deviation was seen from the quiescent case. In other words, the Gitzo's both did a fantastic job in damping that vertical vibration. In point of fact, the 3541LS ships without a hook and I suspect the reason for that is that it is not needed. The 1258 does have a hook, but based on this test there is no reason to use it.

The same cannot be said for other brands without testing. The quality of the CF, the rigidity of the leg locks and the spider are all going to play into this big time. Whether you do or don't need a mass hanging from your Manfrotto is only going to be able to be determined from testing.

There are big issues in hanging a mass from a tripod - your effort to have the mass touching the ground to stop any swinging is a good idea. However, there are potential big issues with things like a resonance or vibration on the string that holds the mass if there is a breeze etc... These vibrations are so small - a 100um vibration amplitude will wipe out resolution and give blur of about 20 pixels or so. That's vibration that you cannot see, hear or feel until you look at your image.

Here is a good article on the whole issue of vibration in tripods and what matters:

http://www.markins.com​/charlie/report.html


J.

ben_r_ wrote in post #9914606
Keep in mind, Gitzo only rates stability of their 2 series up to 300mm, AND basalt is not as stable as CF. Less vibration dampening.

I really wouldn't anticipate much of an issue as my GT0530 isn't rated for use over a 135mm lens and it holds the 70-200mm just fine. I even used it with the EF 400mm 5/6L recently but that was pushing the stability limit for sure. Several of the members at naturescapes use the Basalt series with great success. The biggest thing is having enough height without having to extend the center column.

Any tripod will work in the absence of vibration. that's why the 0530 can work, on occasion, with a much larger lens. they just won't work reliably that way.

that's one of the reasons tripod performance is so difficult to assess. someone can take a tripod that is totally inadequate for the job, take a shot in very still air while it is mounted on concrete (no vibration), the image comes out sharp and the tripod is deemed to be a wonderful thing.

one of these days the manufacturers are going to get together and come up with common standards. The problem, I think so far, is that the majority of the manufacturers with a couple of notable exceptions, are basically scamming their specs. None of that could happen if the testing methods were public and agreed to by a manufacturer's standard group.

J.

I think Johns hit the nail on the head here. As far as the standardized testing goes, IMO I dont think that will ever happy among the companies because that would make 90% of them look really bad...

That's is very true guys. After all is the so called max limit with a 300mm f/2.8 lens or an f/4.

ben_r_ wrote in post #9925945
I think Johns hit the nail on the head here. As far as the standardized testing goes, IMO I dont think that will ever happy among the companies because that would make 90% of them look really bad...

I agree.

Right now, I'd say only Gitzo and probably Manfrotto could be relied upon to have realistic specs (they are owned, I believe, by the same company). Of the high quality knockoffs, Feisol seems to be trying but still have a ways to go. They are worth keeping an eye on. The rest of them? Hopeless. My favorite was Benro showing the picture of their tripods with a girl model sitting on top of them to illustrate their load rating.

J.

JohnJ80 wrote in post #9926248
I agree.

Right now, I'd say only Gitzo and probably Manfrotto could be relied upon to have realistic specs (they are owned, I believe, by the same company). Of the high quality knockoffs, Feisol seems to be trying but still have a ways to go. They are worth keeping an eye on. The rest of them? Hopeless. My favorite was Benro showing the picture of their tripods with a girl model sitting on top of them to illustrate their load rating.

J.

Possibly the ad agency lifted the idea from the Bogen ads of the '70s and '80s. :{)#

yeah, true story. But that says that the rest of them are 30-40 yrs behind. At that rate, we're never going to get this fixed.

J.

JohnJ80 wrote in post #9926248
My favorite was Benro showing the picture of their tripods with a girl model sitting on top of them to illustrate their load rating.

What can you expect from Chinese copymakers?