need advice for off-camera flash - what do i need?

hey guys!

i'm new to this whole off-camera flash stuff. can someone explain to me what i need to make it happen? i have a 580ex II and a 40d. if i want to get the 580ex II off my camera, what do i need? i know there's products like the canon st-e2 and pocket wizards for wireless, but i'm not really familiar with how they work and what i need. what's the best approach to starting to build my gear for off-camera flash? i'm also on a small budget too, so affordability is important, but i don't mind shelling out a little more for good quality stuff that would give me better options down the road.

affordability wise, doesn't the st-e2 do the exact same thing as a pocket wizard for half the price so you'd need two pocket wizards?

and what's this thing with master/slave flashes? if i had another flash, would the 580ex II make that one able to be off camera (let's say a 420 ex or 430 ex)?

if you do off-camera flash, do you normally put the flash unit into an umbrella type thing?

sorry if all these questions sound rudimentary. i'm a completely newbie when it comes to it and i don't know anything!

Canon ETTL flash:
https://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthre​ad.php?t=385912

Radio slaves, with the exception of a unit called Radio Poppers, have a trigger mounted on camera and receivers at each flash. They are manual flash devices and Pocket Wizards are generally considered the best. Skyports and Cybersyncs are also good radio units.

More on radio units available:

https://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthre​ad.php?t=563602

The 40D and 580EX II, both have a PC sync connection, so the easiest and cheapest solution is to get a male to male PC screwlock cord like this from FlashZebra ($15): http://www.flashzebra.​com …k_pc_fivemeter/​0034.shtml

The only problem is you will lose ETTL functions and have to use the flash in manual mode. (1/8, 1/4, 1/2, etc)

If you want to maintain ETTL, get an off camera shoe flash like the 3' OC-E3 or other 3rd party version. It is also possible to extend the length of this cable or buy one already extended. ($35-150)

Another option is to get a st-e2 or another Canon EX flash to create the Canon master/slave setup. (also preserves ETTL).

All other wireless triggers do not allow you to use ETTL.

hmmm, being new to all of this - should i just start with automatic flash? i'm in way over my head already! lol

thanks for the link

Titus213 wrote in post #6285937
Canon ETTL flash:
https://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthre​ad.php?t=385912

Radio slaves, with the exception of a unit called Radio Poppers, have a trigger mounted on camera and receivers at each flash. They are manual flash devices and Pocket Wizards are generally considered the best. Skyports and Cybersyncs are also good radio units.

More on radio units available:

https://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthre​ad.php?t=563602

Why not try a PC sync cord to get your feet wet. Manual flash is not very hard to master when you can review your exposures instantly with a DSLR. It is well suited to a studio type environment where the variables don't change much.

But if you are going to be moving around, taking photos from different positions, of multiple subjects, then ETTL should give you more consistent exposures.

col127 wrote in post #6285995
hmmm, being new to all of this - should i just start with automatic flash? i'm in way over my head already! lol

Manual is pretty easy and can be a lot more consistent than TTL. You can get a cheap set of triggers for $30 to start out with. Gadget Infinity makes Cactus V2S triggers for $30 for a transmitter and receiver. Not the most reliable things in the world, but the price goes up from there.

Start here: http://strobist.blogsp​ot.com/2006/03/lightin​g-101.html

so why get things like pocket wizards? if it costs $150-200 for each one, why not just add extra flashes (420ex) for example?

Be careful with the 420EX - I don't believe it has a manual capability.

col127 wrote in post #6286193
so why get things like pocket wizards? if it costs $150-200 for each one, why not just add extra flashes (420ex) for example?

Pocket Wizard work with most everything. They're incredibly reliable and on a perfect day may fire up to 1600'. They'll work with speed lights or studio strobes. The Multi Max allows groups and time lapse firing. They can remotely trigger and camera and flashes. The transmit and receive in one unit. You can purchase light meters and studio strobes with PW compatible chips in them that will let them fire off of your other pocket wizards.

Additional Canon flashes will only work with your Canon flashes. They're not especially reliable in bright sunlit conditions.

msowsun wrote in post #6285970
The 40D and 580EX II, both have a PC sync connection, so the easiest and cheapest solution is to get a male to male PC screwlock cord like this from FlashZebra ($15): http://www.flashzebra.​com …k_pc_fivemeter/​0034.shtml

The only problem is you will lose ETTL functions and have to use the flash in manual mode. (1/8, 1/4, 1/2, etc)

If you want to maintain ETTL, get an off camera shoe flash like the 3' OC-E3 or other 3rd party version. It is also possible to extend the length of this cable or buy one already extended. ($35-150)

Another option is to get a st-e2 or another Canon EX flash to create the Canon master/slave setup. (also preserves ETTL).

All other wireless triggers do not allow you to use ETTL.

I thought those Radio Poppers can utilise ETTL?

Sorry, you are right.

Radio Poppers are the only ones that do allow ETTL. But they are a different breed. They convert the Canon optical signals from a ST-E2 or 580ex and relay it to the Canon off camera flash. Both units (master and slave) must be Canon brand master/slave compatible.

But, they only allow the use of TTL, which is a major let down in my book. If you could have also used them a just a standard radio trigger, they would have been big money.

Thanks for the confirmation and clarification Mike and V_I.

Village_Idiot wrote in post #6288413
But, they only allow the use of TTL, which is a major let down in my book. If you could have also used them a just a standard radio trigger, they would have been big money.

But of course, you can use the ETTL data stream to simply fire flashes in manual mode, and therefore use Radiopoppers as the communication relay for that!

You simply would not buy RPs if you never intend to use ETTL.