I just have to ventilate my emotions about Favours.

Ok, so.. I am not a pro. Far from it, but i like to shoot and do it for fun.

I have shot in few events before and the photos have turned out in reasonably quality, nothing PRO but still, ok pics.

Few days back, my friend, who runs a small poker business with a bunch of my other friends, asks me if i could come to one of their events and take some shots for PR purposes. It was like some black tie casino style event for some 150 business people and they wanted to get some shots from there.
I hesitated few seconds, and then said OK, i can do it. Then i thought about it a bit, and started to realize that it¨s not really a very nice and casual event to shoot, and it might take about 3 hours + editing time.
So, today i told me friend that i can do it, but i need to get 20Eur / hour, and editing time is free. So basically i was asking 60 for an entire shoot, with editing, no prints included of course.

Guess what.. he said "No thanks". And i replied, Ok then. And the deal is off..

Now, i just wanted to say that its insane that people just assume that because you like to take shots you will work for their company absolutely free of any charge. every other guy there is getting payd, some are dealing cards others doing other stuff, and then there would be me with 3000EUR worth of gear aroung my neck, getting nothing.
I wasnt even asking much, the going market price is somewhere between 300-1000+ for event photography of any kind.

I just wanted to get something out of my effort and time, to ensure that after spending 4 hours editing the images i wont feel like a complete fool for doing it all absolutely free.
Now i am happy that i was able to open my mouth and the deal is off.

Any comments

Yeah I know exactly where your coming from, I just had a friend text me asking whether I'd editing some product shots's he's taken. I know for a fact that it's 300 items of jewellery and 3 pics of each ... that 900 photo's, so I text back yeah sure, what you gunna pay me in a jokey way and he text back - never mind!

It would have taken me hours, i'm in School and working every weekend and some evenings so I didn't really have the time, but short on cash ATM so would have!

His loss. (Applies to both of us haha) just think of the more time you'll have to have a beer and relax!

Ryan W wrote in post #6380231
Yeah I know exactly where your coming from, I just had a friend text me asking whether I'd editing some product shots's he's taken. I know for a fact that it's 300 items of jewellery and 3 pics of each ... that 900 photo's, so I text back yeah sure, what you gunna pay me in a jokey way and he text back - never mind!

It would have taken me hours, i'm in School and working every weekend and some evenings so I didn't really have the time, but short on cash ATM so would have!

His loss. (Applies to both of us haha) just think of the more time you'll have to have a beer and relax!

Yeah, i totally agree ( especially on the last point )

I am guessing that this is a very common problem with atleast amateur photographers, people just think that every shoot and every hour of editing is fun for us. not quite the case. And even if it were, it shouldnt be free if the end product is valuable. Atleast not when its for someones business promotion use..

I know exactly how you feel!

Good job asking for some compensation.

thats the problem with taking pics for friends... sooner or later you are gonna want to charge for some event that doesnt sound fun to shoot and they already see you as their "free photographer" friend.

good for you. it should be up to the 'tog to offer stuff for free to mates at your own discretion, and if someone asks for it outside that they must be prepared to get told it will cost them - and just because something was free one time doesnt mean it will be again

if i get a free sample at the supermarket of some product i cant just walk in there next week and grab one off the shelf for nothing

its the same in other industries too... ive got a friend who decorates cakes, and theres always one who thinks because she knows her that she will do it for nothing - even tho the ingredients cost money! yet that same friend is happy to offer certain cakes as gifts - which is totally her right to do without anyone drawing assumptions from it

Thanks for the feedback and understanding, it's funny how these threads tend to always get into the fact that no one should ever shoot anything for free for anyone. I don't really agree on that, i think there are many kinds of events and it has to be your right to say what you feel is work and what isn't.
And i have done only 1 poker game shoot, and that lasted like 8 hours, i got payed by getting something to eat during the shoot. Well, it was a fun experience and all, and it was asked as a favor, but now i just feel like if i did it again, after my friends know what they are getting, it would be a bit foolish to do it for free. Even though i do like the opportunities and getting experiences is nice.

You want it really bad. Work in some aspect of IT, and all of a sudden you are the friendly free computer repair person. Its even worse than owning a pick up truck.

^^ +1

@johnz -- When I read your description, I thought your friend was just asking for too much. That event would have been a huge amount of work and, if some part of the kit had failed, you might not even have all the shots they'd expect.

hortonsl62 wrote in post #6383862
^^ +1

@johnz -- When I read your description, I thought your friend was just asking for too much. That event would have been a huge amount of work and, if some part of the kit had failed, you might not even have all the shots they'd expect.

Yeah, you're right. The thing is however, that they know me and they know that i am not a pro and that 100% success is not guaranteed. If they would absolutely need the pics, and would value them, i guess they would get a real photographer with spare bodies and assistants.
However, they asked me and not a pro- So i guess the thought was to get the best possible images without paying anyone anything.

I think if something had gone wrong, they might have been a bit upset.

hortonsl62 wrote in post #6383934
I think if something had gone wrong, they might have been a bit upset.

Yeah, most likely so, but i have always told them that i can't guarantee a 100% success, if something fails they get their money back. Quite simple really, but of course if i would ask REAL prices and not only something to compensate my time than i think they could expect more.
But i guess you are looking at this from the PRO point of view, where hobbyists should never charge anything under any circumstances.

dontblink wrote in post #6383800
You want it really bad. Work in some aspect of IT, and all of a sudden you are the friendly free computer repair person. Its even worse than owning a pick up truck.

And I'll raise you a "real" camera with a big lens. Got all three. Get asked for favors all the time.

When I take money it always "Well we found somebody else" or "My mom didn't know I talked to another person"

Eh... a friend asked you to do him a favor... one you've done for him in the past without asking for compensation because, as you said, you like to do it. You have a right to turn him down for sure, but I really don't see how he did anything wrong by asking. It's not like the nerve of some complete stranger -- friends do favors for friends. I can't see the "insanity" in it.

The insanity isn't in asking. The insanity is in turning down a very very modest rate. The guy says "hey can you do this for me?" and photog says "sure but it's a lot of work based on my previous experience, that I did for you for free, so I need to at least get 60 bucks for the 6 or so hours I'll have in it." and the guy says "no thanks" as if 10 bucks an hour is unreasonable.

I got pretty much the same treatment from "family" that I didn't really even know was family until we met and pieced it all together - they didn't know we were family either until we put the two and two together to get four. In fact we had never even met before. They wanted me to shoot for basically nothing, just because it would be a nice location, and "because we're family!" Even sadder still is I had already offered them a family/friend based new-to-it rate, but they wanted me even cheaper. No thanks.

I'll give someone a sweet deal if it's something I've never done before. But if it's a case of been there, done that - standard rates apply.