STICKY:  5D2 owners - what do you use to edit movies?

gooble wrote in post #8012991
I just cannot see my self getting Premiere Pro or Final Cut Pro if I had a Mac right now. Eventually I think I would probably get to one or the other of those but right now it's just not gonna happen.

If you did have a Mac, would you consider Final Cut Express? I use it for my 5Dii video and it's a pretty nice package (although a bit of a learning curve). Plus, for $100 it's tough to beat.

Tony-S wrote in post #8013019
If you did have a Mac, would you consider Final Cut Express? I use it for my 5Dii video and it's a pretty nice package (although a bit of a learning curve). Plus, for $100 it's tough to beat.

Don't know if I'd get a Mac unless it was a Macbook (not pro). How well can you edit movies on those?

Can you sync offboard audio and such in Final Cut Express?

gooble wrote in post #8012949
I've noticed that many 5DII users recommend Neoscene, on the PC side anyway.

Right now I really have no way to do anything with my 5DII movies. They barely playback on my computer and I have no editing software. It also seems that even if I got something as good as Premiere Pro I would still have trouble editing and transcoding my movies.

What if any benefit would Neoscene be to me? Isn't it essentially a transcoder? So if I have clips that don't need editing can I transcode them to say a 720p clip and upload them to Vimeo?

What is your workflow with Neoscene when you need to edit? I've read about using Neoscene to convert the native 5DII movies to something else that will play back smoothly and then editing those proxy files. I'm not sure I quite understand this. Do you arrange the proxy files and edit them like you want with the ability to watch the final cut smoothly then render referencing the original files? If this is the case then are your proxy files disposable (assuming you would never edit again with them) as you still have the original mov files.

One last thing, I read on Cinema5D forums I think, that Neoscene would not convert 5DII movies to 24p. You've gotten it to work?

Thanks. Any help is appreciated.

Hi, I'll do my best to explain...I am no video expert myself.

In essence, Neoscene makes your editing process much, much easier by allowing you to actually see the footage without all of the jerkiness that you experience with the native files.

My workflow:

1. Open Neoscene and point it to .mov files on CF card to convert those files to 24p
   
2. The above creates new .avi files that I store on my PC
   
3. Open Sony Vegas Movie Studio and use the .avi's created in step 1 as my source files to make my movie with.
   
4. Render the project as an .mp4 (read: create the final movie output file) with the correct parameters (resolution, frame rate).

perfarny wrote in post #8013309
Hi, I'll do my best to explain...I am no video expert myself.

In essence, Neoscene makes your editing process much, much easier by allowing you to actually see the footage without all of the jerkiness that you experience with the native files.

My workflow:

1. Open Neoscene and point it to .mov files on CF card to convert those files to 24p
   
2. The above creates new .avi files that I store on my PC
   
3. Open Sony Vegas Movie Studio and use the .avi's created in step 1 as my source files to make my movie with.
   
4. Render the project as an .mp4 (read: create the final movie output file) with the correct parameters (resolution, frame rate).

Now, if I have just a single clip and I just want to upload, I still do the above, mainly because the .avi that Neoscene creates is still huge (not sure about Vimeo's restrictions or if it'll actually accept them) and when I render in .mp4, file size is much more manageable and all of my movies are then small enough to upload to smugmug (my choice of online hoster).

Finally, I have had zero issues converting to 24p with Neoscene...it's advertised as a core benefit on their product page, too, so not sure where you heard it doesn't work...I think their higher end products (neo HD) may do a 'better' job for fast motion subjects (I guess that's where the issue is...again - I'm learning like you are) but I can't tell any issues with my files at this point.

Hope that helps,
Per

EDIT: cost of Neoscene: $99, cost of Sony Movie Studio: $99

Hey, thanks for the help.

So if I understand you correctly you render you final output in Vegas using the clips you ran through Neoscene?

Are you familiar with the proxy method? As I understood it you take the file from Neoscene, run it through the editor with your edits and then before rendering you point the editor to the original mov files (in the case I read they had to have the exact same name and extension so I guess it'd have to be a mov file) then the movie is rendered from the full size original files not the ones run through Neoscene. It is complicated but maybe it gives a better output.

One more thing, can you sync external audio in Vegas to the onboard audio?

gooble wrote in post #8013441
Hey, thanks for the help.

So if I understand you correctly you render you final output in Vegas using the clips you ran through Neoscene?

Yes.

gooble wrote in post #8013441
Are you familiar with the proxy method? As I understood it you take the file from Neoscene, run it through the editor with your edits and then before rendering you point the editor to the original mov files (in the case I read they had to have the exact same name and extension so I guess it'd have to be a mov file) then the movie is rendered from the full size original files not the ones run through Neoscene. It is complicated but maybe it gives a better output.

Not very familiar with it. From what I've heard there is little to no degredation with using the Neoscene files.

gooble wrote in post #8013441
One more thing, can you sync external audio in Vegas to the onboard audio?

Not exactly sure what exactly you're asking, and I have the feeling I don't know the answer..sorry

perfarny wrote in post #8013570
Yes.



Not very familiar with it. From what I've heard there is little to no degredation with using the Neoscene files.



Not exactly sure what exactly you're asking, and I have the feeling I don't know the answer..sorry :(

Eventually, instead of recording audio solely with the 5D, I would like to record in conjuction with an external digital recorder like the Zoom h4n. Not only does it have superior audio, it has adjustable stereo mics and two xlr inputs. It also allows you to record audio without being tethered to the camera. But you have to sync it with the video so you need to use something like the slates they use in movie making before a scene to snap and make a spike in the audio then you somehow sync them up and mute the in-camera audio.

I just wondered if that could be done in Vegas.

With the final cut express are you keep it HD and can you record a time lapse? Right now I'm using iMovie and I can't do either. (I'm using iMovie 08)

Thanks

perfarny wrote in post #8013309
Hi, I'll do my best to explain...I am no video expert myself.

In essence, Neoscene makes your editing process much, much easier by allowing you to actually see the footage without all of the jerkiness that you experience with the native files.

My workflow:

1. Open Neoscene and point it to .mov files on CF card to convert those files to 24p
   
2. The above creates new .avi files that I store on my PC
   
3. Open Sony Vegas Movie Studio and use the .avi's created in step 1 as my source files to make my movie with.
   
4. Render the project as an .mp4 (read: create the final movie output file) with the correct parameters (resolution, frame rate).

Now, if I have just a single clip and I just want to upload, I still do the above, mainly because the .avi that Neoscene creates is still huge (not sure about Vimeo's restrictions or if it'll actually accept them) and when I render in .mp4, file size is much more manageable and all of my movies are then small enough to upload to smugmug (my choice of online hoster).

Finally, I have had zero issues converting to 24p with Neoscene...it's advertised as a core benefit on their product page, too, so not sure where you heard it doesn't work...I think their higher end products (neo HD) may do a 'better' job for fast motion subjects (I guess that's where the issue is...again - I'm learning like you are) but I can't tell any issues with my files at this point.

Hope that helps,
Per

EDIT: cost of Neoscene: $99, cost of Sony Movie Studio: $99

I'm a newbie at this video stuff and recently purchased the latest version of Sony Vegas Movie Studio 9 (Platinum Pro). Vegas already allows you to render (or is it convert? Not sure about the proper terminology) 5dII files to AVI 24P. I've tried it and it seems to work fine. Is there something that neoscene does that Vegas does not?

sharrowm wrote in post #8031397
I'm a newbie at this video stuff and recently purchased the latest version of Sony Vegas Movie Studio 9 (Platinum Pro). Vegas already allows you to render (or is it convert? Not sure about the proper terminology) 5dII files to AVI 24P. I've tried it and it seems to work fine. Is there something that neoscene does that Vegas does not?

i don't think so. If one or the other does a better job or not of the conversion - - there an expert would need to chime in.

When you work with the files in Vegas - do they run smoothly or is the playback jerky? If it's smooth, and Vegas does a good job of outputting 24p from your source files, I don't think you have any need for Neoscene.

perfarny wrote in post #8031421
i don't think so. If one or the other does a better job or not of the conversion - - there an expert would need to chime in.

When you work with the files in Vegas - do they run smoothly or is the playback jerky? If it's smooth, and Vegas does a good job of outputting 24p from your source files, I don't think you have any need for Neoscene.

No, I wouldn't say they are smooth, but not bad. When working with the original MOV files straight off the camera in vegas before I convert (render?) them to 24P, there is no freezing, just a bit jittery. Once it's rendered though, it is nice and smooth. I really have know idea what I am doing and am just experimenting with different workflows. My goal is to be able to burn HD video from the 5dII onto standard DVD and play it back on my stand-alone DVD/bluray player hooked to my bigscreen. Once the files are rendered in Vegas I use Nero 9 to burn HD content onto standard DVD's and it seems to work. But for all I know Nero is downconverting the video to something less than HD. I do know that nero takes a 60gb file from vegas and somehow crams it onto a 4.6gb DVD. Nero claims it's HD, but it does make me wonder what I'm losing in the process.

sharrowm wrote in post #8031397
I'm a newbie at this video stuff and recently purchased the latest version of Sony Vegas Movie Studio 9 (Platinum Pro). Vegas already allows you to render (or is it convert? Not sure about the proper terminology) 5dII files to AVI 24P. I've tried it and it seems to work fine. Is there something that neoscene does that Vegas does not?

I don't mean to say that you're not being honest but are you sure Sony Vegas Movie Studio 9 (Platinum Pro) is converting to 24p? As you say, you're a newbie. I am too for that matter when it comes to video but I've been reading about editing software and I hadn't run across the fact that Sony Vegas Movie Studio 9 (Platinum Pro) did 24p conversion.

Can anyone confirm or deny this? If Sony Vegas Movie Studio 9 (Platinum Pro) works as well as you say and does 24p conversion then I'll order it tomorrow.

gooble wrote in post #8033681
I don't mean to say that you're not being honest but are you sure Sony Vegas Movie Studio 9 (Platinum Pro) is converting to 24p? As you say, you're a newbie. I am too for that matter when it comes to video but I've been reading about editing software and I hadn't run across the fact that Sony Vegas Movie Studio 9 (Platinum Pro) did 24p conversion.

Can anyone confirm or deny this? If Sony Vegas Movie Studio 9 (Platinum Pro) works as well as you say and does 24p conversion then I'll order it tomorrow.

I can assure you I am being honest, but that doesn’t mean I know what I’m talking about. Here is the workflow I have been using successfully:

• I put clips on the time line and edit as desired
  
• I select the “Make Movie” button
  
• I select “Save it to my hard drive (at this point a window opens that allows you to choose the file path, format and template among other things)
  
• I select “Video for Windows” from the “format” dropdown list
  
• I select “HD 1080-24p YUV” from the template dropdown list. Once selected the “description” box says: “Audio: 48,000 Hz, 16 Bit, Stereo, PCM Uncompressed.Video: 23.976 fps, 1920x1080, Progressive.Pixel Aspect Ratio: 1.000, using Sony YUV codec. OpenDML compatible” (I copied and pasted the description directly from the “description” box).
  
• I select “next” and it starts to render

sharrowm wrote in post #8035418
I can assure you I am being honest, but that doesn’t mean I know what I’m talking about. Here is the workflow I have been using successfully:

• I put clips on the time line and edit as desired
  
• I select the “Make Movie” button
  
• I select “Save it to my hard drive (at this point a window opens that allows you to choose the file path, format and template among other things)
  
• I select “Video for Windows” from the “format” dropdown list
  
• I select “HD 1080-24p YUV” from the template dropdown list. Once selected the “description” box says: “Audio: 48,000 Hz, 16 Bit, Stereo, PCM Uncompressed.Video: 23.976 fps, 1920x1080, Progressive.Pixel Aspect Ratio: 1.000, using Sony YUV codec. OpenDML compatible” (I copied and pasted the description directly from the “description” box).
  
• I select “next” and it starts to render

The files this creates are huge! A 1 minute clip is about 8gb. The largest clip I’ve done so far is about 15 minutes so I don’t know how it would handle longer clips. Also, I have no way of knowing if the output is actually 24p. Hopefully someone with more knowledge will add their .02.

BTW: You can download the full version of Sony Vegas and try it for free for 30 days. I would recommend this (if for no other reason) to make sure your system/video card is up to the task.

Heh, I knew you weren't being dishonest, I just didn't know if you knew enough to know for sure; as you said, you're a newbie to video editing.

Anyway, I did download the Movie Studio 9 demo and converted some clips last night. I did end up with very large files: 200MB ended up 4GB. However later I selected the WMV9 I think and output to 720p 24fps which only ended up slightly bigger than the original and still looked really good.

Now I need to find a tutorial and or description of all the functions and settings in there.

I guess I was just skeptical at first about the 24p because I read several 5D movie forums and everyone complains about the 24p conversion process but to me the Vegas Movie Studio didn't seem to make it complicated but I wouldn't be surprised that I just don't know enough about the process yet.

Final Cut Pro

Firotechnics wrote in post #8038640
Final Cut Pro

Is there anything less than $1100 to $1300 that will work?