Very Long!! Need Opinions.

I really need some opinons. I know the popular views about friends and family pricing, but I'm so far into this situation I just don't know what to do now.

A little background: DH and I are from CA. We moved to VA in 2004. In June of 2007 we took the plunge and signed a contract to purchased a SF home. In March of 2008 it was finally finished and we moved in. Being that all of our family and friends live far away, we have a 4yr old daughter that we wanted to have make friends in our neighborhood and we planned on living here for awhile (esp given the state of the economy), we decided to make a big effort to get to know and make friends with our neighbors. Here in VA people aren't as friendly as they are in CA and we really wanted to try to extend our hand and make some life long friends.

Our neighbors on the right are very nice but are older with no kids. We are friendly and we like them a lot.

When we moved in we found out the neighbors on our left were expecting. We also found out they had lost a baby 3 years prior in a very late term m/c. Even after this baby was born the mom was very sick in the hospital for 6 weeks after the baby was already home with dad. My DH suggested that we offer them a free photo session or something. I stated all of the reasons I was strongly against the idea (word will get out esp in the neighborhood I hope to sell full price to, they'll expect future work free, etc). When we find out the mom is sick in the hospital and the new dad is home caring for the new baby by himself I felt bad and gave in. My husband goes next door to offer our help and tells the new dad his wife (me) would be happy to give them free photography (yes he left it very open ended). Secretly I was hoping it would be forgotted.

Fast forward a month or so later (middle last summer) and they approached me to do new born shots. She then started talking about doing 6 month, 9 month, 12 month, etc shots, about doing year 1, year 2, year 3 books. I was a little taken back. I really didn't want to offend so I kind of let it go and didn't say anything (I know huge mistake...I should of nipped it right there.) Her husband does printing and has access to print prices so my usual line of '50% of my prices is my cost' wouldn't work because he could and would find out that it's more like 90% (I know that doesn't include my time....). So I just charged them a few bucks over my cost with specific instructions not to discuss my pricing or costs with anyone. I figured they are neighbors and friends.

Well I've done the newborn and 9 month shoot. Around Christmas time the mom agreed to watch my DD for a few hours on a Sunday morning while DH and I ran to the store to buy presents for my DD. They got tickets to a football game and called me 9pm on Sat (the night before) and bailed on me. I was pissed and kind of blew her off for a week or so. But ultimately decided to let it go. On top of that I found out the dad used his wonderful (said sarcastically) PS'ing skills and cropped out my logo on some proofs, printed a canvas and prints from it even though they have ordered prints and cards from me for CHEAP!! I also found out the mom spilled the beans to another friend of hers in the neighborhood who has a huge mouth after I asked her several times not too discuss my prices.

Are you hired, or invited? If your invited as a friend, arrive with a present in tow, and leave your camera at home. Have a "Family day" if you will. If they need a photo, ask for their camera, take the photo, and politely hand it back- just as any friend would do.

Thanks KAD. I like that suggestion although the party is at their home which is next door to ours. Hence my camera is just right next door. Although I could just play dumb and not bring my camera. Knowing the mom she will ask me to go get my camera. ACK.

You are clearly being taken advantage of. You could just tell her that your camera gear is for business purposes only and not to be used to personal affairs. IF you want me to get it, the price is xxx.

Or you can be flat out honest and tell her that, I prefer not to bring my camera because I was previous taken advantage of and I do not want anything to ruin our friendship and leave it at that. Just be civil about it.

What's a DH and DD?

Advice: Don't listen to the DH again.

In this case, I'm a firm believer in the little white lie. Tell her that you can't believe it, your camera just broke and you have it out for repair (blame the DH, he owes you that at least). You're so mad becuase you really wanted to take some pics at the party (you need to play it up).

I've been there as well (not photo-related) so just file this under lesson learned.

Couldn't your camera be in for a service on the day of the party ?

I read it all, and feel your pain. Giving out free images does make it hard for you to start charging. If i was you, I would go to the party, but as a guest, and don't bring your camera.

I've been doing this photo stuff a long time. My neighbors are my portfolio builders and business builders and I've always done shots of them, mostly their kids, for free, even giving them prints... cost out of my pocket. This has been nothing but a positive for me. It has helped to build positive relationships with my neighbors and they have gotten me lots of business through the images I've given them. Other family and friends they know, and I don't, see the images and ask about them. A lot of those secondary friends/family become full paying clients... and then word spreads from them to the next circle out, etc. Let's face it, my family can only put up with so much posing for me practicing so the resources of having many willing 'models' running around the neighborhood is a great benefit. I've lived in my house over 12 years now and most my neighbors have been there the same. None of them 'expect' to get free photography, or ask for it, but are grateful when they get it. And when they have a need for photography, like senior portrait, etc. they book my like a regular client and pay for the service and the prints. It's just something that is understood.

I'd say don't lie - it always leads to problems. I'd simply say 'My usual price for doing this is 'x'. since you are a neighbour I'll offer you it for 'y' (where y is about 30% lower than 'x' and a price you are happy with). Explain you will obtain the prints yourself and make a profit on those prints. Also insist on 50% in advance.

If she expresses surprise at the suggestion of a fee say 'Well you know we offered you a free session after we heard about your sad loss, but obviously I need to make a living from my photography. If you don't want to pay for photos, I'll totally understand and actually it will be nice to attend the party without me having to concentrate on photography.'

You are then not being devious, you are being fair, by offering a discount you have acknowledged their status as a neighbour and have drawn a clear line under the free photography of the past. If you want them to babysit - you pay, if they want photos, they pay. I'd doubly underline the point by getting them to sign a contract agreeing not to make unauthorised copies of the photos if they do decide to hire you.

Issues like this can only be resolved with direct communication. Don't bring your camera to the party. If they ask you to take a picture, ask them for their camera. If they suggest you get yours, tell them you want to enjoy the party instead of working.

You can either stew on this problem for weeks like you are doing now, or handle it directly and be done with it.

-Scott

I agree with #2 and 10 and that is probably what I would have done. I think most photographers encounter similar situations at some point. If you want to go and don't want to be shooting, leave your camera at home.

jenirose3 wrote in post #7493689
Thanks KAD. I like that suggestion although the party is at their home which is next door to ours. Hence my camera is just right next door. Although I could just play dumb and not bring my camera. Knowing the mom she will ask me to go get my camera. ACK.

If they ask for you to get your camera, you can tell them you can only stay for a short amount of time (leave your DH with the kids at the party, and take some needed personal time). Or you can go with the suggested "under contract- sure!"

I have a feeling that there will be enough going on with the parents that day that they won't want to hold up the festivities to iron out a contract before the event.

Wow - you got into a tough situation. I can definitely empathisize with you when you say that you're frustrated vis-a-vis the apparent abuse. I can also somewhat relate in that I did a photo session for a relative by mariage. I was going to give her a "sweetheart" deal because after all she is family. When I show up for the photoshoot, she springs another two sets of couples upons me and says that they want photos as well. That at first made me quite upset, because I felt that I was being taken advantage of. What I did to remedy the situation is that I charged full price to all the friends and gave 50% to my sister in-law. The annoyance that many photographers are facing is that people don't value the cost of the print and your time as they do for other services. They figure, "oh you're just taking a few pictures - no big deal". Be really careful when you hear people starting to minimize what they are asking you to do "Oh take some silly pictures at the party ... nothing big." That's translation for "it's not a big deal, just take some photos, but we're not paying you for them because hey, it's not a big deal." I have even been guilty of that (holding my head in shame) when I visit the mechanic. I don't have a lot of money, so I try to get the mechanic to do as much as he can with my "oil change/maintenance package". If checking the tires is going to cost me $50.00 on it's own, but it's included in a $50.00 oil change package, then I will get the mechanic to try and include it. Unfortunately, you see some of this going on in the realm of photography. I think it is quite rational for a client to try and get a good deal however. But taking advantage is another story and I think that is what could be going on here. I would like to politely and respectfully disagree with my British friend Phil in that a white lie is not always a bad thing. Just make sure that there is no way for them to find out. I think that saying your camera is in the shop this week is not necessarily a bad thing. But remember, I don't know all the dynamics of this friendship as you do.

I hope this helps. I have some experience in this department, so if you want some more advice, please don't hesitate to PM me.

Good luck,

S

sspellman wrote in post #7494206
Issues like this can only be resolved with direct communication. Don't bring your camera to the party. If they ask you to take a picture, ask them for their camera. If they suggest you get yours, tell them you want to enjoy the party instead of working.

You can either stew on this problem for weeks like you are doing now, or handle it directly and be done with it.

-Scott

This really is profound advice.
I've run into this issue with several family members and like this PP suggested, I've left the camera at home on purpose. When my cousin had her babyshower it was assumed that I would bring my camera. I wasn't feeling good and wasn't in the mood, so I didn't bring it. (oh the drama, oh the nerve!)
In the future, I would suggest giving a gift certificate as a formality to those who are receiving your generous gifts/services.
I know, it sounds silly and a waste of paper but it really does serve its purpose. When I'm gifting someone with my services, I want them to realize that this is still my business and NOT entirely free.
So in the future, if your husband goofs up and offers someone a free session, drop a gift certificate in the mail that entitles them to a free photo session and 1 free 8x10, or whatever it is your giving. Then proceed as though they are a normal paying customer. If they are interested in working with you again, they can inquire about your services and if you are being "generous" you can offer them a nice 10% discount.
If your photography is your business, you need to treat it as such.

I hear the 'bring a gift for the birthday child and leave the camera at home.' If you REALLY don't want to take any pics, leave the camera at home. If you feel like making someone else's day, bring it and shoot! Throw the output on a CD and give it to your neighbor.

Honestly, I've been a horses' behind about things like this in the past. At the end of the day, we let ourselves and others down by attempting to 'make a point,' or trying to be 'right.'

Would you rather be right, or happy? Go. Shoot. Promise a CD when you feel like delivering one.

dave