New Canon Rebel T1i

Video will be great when it works more like a camcorder. The Panasonic GH1 holds more promise. But what's with the 20fps, sure isn't limited by the hardware.

davidfig wrote in post #7594743
Video will be great when it works more like a camcorder. The Panasonic GH1 holds more promise. But what's with the 20fps, sure isn't limited by the hardware.

It may be if they're under-clocking the DiGiC 4 chip to keep it at 3.4 fps (and subsequently 20fps video due to chip speed).

This seems likely as 3.4fps just seems like an odd frame rate if it were a firmware limitation (e.g. if it were a firmware limitation, why not make it an even 3.0 or 3.5fps for shooting speed and 29.97fps for video)?

I'm guessing they're either under-clocking (under-voltage) the DiGiC 4 so that they can use smaller/lighter batteries in the Rebel OR, they're using DiGiC 4 chips that didn't bin as well as those needed for the 5D Mk II or 50D.

Such a practice is VERY common in the semiconductor industry. Intel, for example, may have 5-7 different speed-rated chips, all coming off the same fab and even the same silicone wafer.

John_TX wrote in post #7594782
It may be if they're under-clocking the DiGiC 4 chip to keep it at 3.4 fps (and subsequently 20fps video due to chip speed).

This seems likely as 3.4fps just seems like an odd frame rate if it were a firmware limitation (e.g. if it were a firmware limitation, why not make it an even 3.0 or 3.5fps for shooting speed and 29.97fps for video)?

I'm guessing they're either under-clocking (under-voltage) the DiGiC 4 so that they can use smaller/lighter batteries in the Rebel OR, they're using DiGiC 4 chips that didn't bin as well as those needed for the 5D Mk II or 50D.

Such a practice is VERY common in the semiconductor industry. Intel, for example, may have 5-7 different speed-rated chips, all coming off the same fab and even the same silicone wafer.

Although somewhat true, I don't believe that the hardware is the limitation. The limitation is the product lineup. Can't have this camera doing what the 5D can do. So reduce the fps, reduce the movie mode, etc.

davidfig wrote in post #7595164
Although somewhat true, I don't believe that the hardware is the limitation. The limitation is the product lineup. Can't have this camera doing what the 5D can do. So reduce the fps, reduce the movie mode, etc.

Yep, obviously they wouldn't put it's capabilities on the same level as the 5D Mk II. I was discussing more of the hardware options in how to achieve such a result, that's all.

Link:

http://www.usa.canon.c​om …egoryid=139&mod​elid=18385

Lou

Canon's naming conventions drive me nuts.

Well, I'll buy it. Crap...now what to get the g/f. I can't let her use that.

That is a really attractive camera for the likes of me. In regards to the various limits...If indeed it is a matter of firmware/software crippling and not hardware, then maybe some computer stud will figure out the digic 4 like they did with the digic 2 and ?3?. But for my use, 3 plus frames per second is definitely fine. I think that everyone now is waiting to see IQ and ISO samples...since the 50d didn't blow the 40d out of the water, then I still think it is advisable to wait and see.....

Also looks like mono sound and no mic input.

It's both. The hardware (the chip) is inferior to the 50D chip in a way that it is produced and tested to perform reliably at lower frequencies (perhaps) compared to the DiGiC 4 chips that go into 50D and 5D2. The best samples go to 5D2s, the slightly worse ones go into 50Ds, the rest will end up in T1is. This is the same practice as Intel uses for selecting their chips. The reason there are many variants of Core 2 Duo is because of both marketing (all chips cost the same to produce anyway, so it's pretty easy to set and label them differently) and the inherent imperfections in production (some chips simply don't work on as high of frequencies as others). Whoever has ever tried overclocking their CPU or GPU in their computers know exactly what I'm talking about.

Maybe some brave soul can volt-mod the image processor in the T1i to do 6fps Then it would be an absolute KILLER camera for the price.

Pit Agoras wrote in post #7591314
1080p and 20 frames/sec

seems to be a typing error ... 20 = nonsens

I think it really is 20 fps. And you're right. 20 FPS is worthless for movie shooting. This won't be replacing anyone's HD cam probably....

I don't think it's suppose to. I want one though...I think. I've been using LV lately just cause and if the video looks anything like LV does, it does look quite fun. The sample vids from the 5DMkII were quite cool.

I am really surprised that Canon put native ISO 3200, and H1 6400, H2 12800 ISO levels in a Rebel! Among other things, this is one less feature that Canon previously used to distinguish between the xxD & Rebel line.

Another thing I haven't seen mentioned yet is that Canon seems to have made a mistake by developing the 12MP sensor in the 450D/XSi, only to mothball it for a 15MP sensor in the next models.
To my knowledge, that was the first (and so far only) Rebel sensor that hasn't also been shared with the xxD line.

I'm thinking Canon barely (if even) recovered R&D costs on the 12MP sensor before the T1i release.

Look back at all the previous models and how they've all basically shared the same underlying CMOS sensor: They've historically had about 3 models to help off-set the cost of their lower end sensors.
This tells me that Canon really jumped the gun and fell right into the "Megapickles" race.

6.5MP - 10D, D60, Original Digital Rebel
8.2MP - 30D, 20D, 300D
10.1MP - 40D, 400D, 1000D
12.2MP - 450D
15.1MP - 50D, 500D (T1i)

Since the 21MP 5D Mk II has at least another 2 years left in it's product cycle, I can't imagine Canon ramping up the MP count in the next 2 Rebel releases by much (if any). On the other hand, it would not surprise me if we had a 21MP Rebel when the 5D Mk II is retired (since they did it with the original 5D & 450D). Different sensors, but nevertheless.

John_TX wrote in post #7596771
Since the 21MP 5D Mk II has at least another 2 years left in it's product cycle, I can't imagine Canon ramping up the MP count in the next 2 Rebel releases by much (if any). On the other hand, it would not surprise me if we had a 21MP Rebel when the 5D Mk II is retired (since they did it with the original 5D & 450D). Different sensors, but nevertheless.

They would have to have a totally redesigned crop sensor in order to pull off more than 15MP I think. They are going to start losing dynamic range (already started at 15) and all the noise reduction will be digital and make high ISO images look fake. It will be interesting to see where Canon goes with the sensors in the future.

So perhaps the megapixel race will halt for a while, and they will improve quality more than quantity... I really hope so.