Dear PTON ... Lens filters have driven me crazy.

Hey guys.

The market offers too many damn filters to chose from!! And I have completely gone filter crazy. Here's what I own...

Canon Rebel XTi
18-55mm (58mm) kit lens
28-135mm IS (72mm)
50mm 1.4 (58mm)

I need to plan around a trip I'm taking in 2 1.2 weeks near Yosemite. I plan on capturing some sweet shots of waterfalls, etc etc. The lighting may be harsh in places, and there likely will be snow.

FULL DESCRIPTION

It was described to me that a ND 2 stop and/or a CPL would be helpful. So I went shopping online today. Wow, I had no idea how tough this would be.

I have three questions...

1) I have cheapo Tiffen UV filters presently on my 28-135mm (72mm) and 50mm (58mm). Will I see a big enough difference in upgrading to B+W UV filters? In other words, would it be worth the UV B+W 100 dollar upgrade for both lenses?

2) What stop ND filters do you recommend for waterfall silky smooth captures? Will 0.6 (2 stops) be enough do you think? (how often do you use your 0.9 filters?) If you had to chose one over the other (ND vs CPL)... which would it be? Combo suggestions?

3) Does anyone have experience with 58mm to 72mm Step-Up Rings (filter adapters)? Does it distort the image at all? Any things I need to be aware of? I'm buying 72mm filters in mind that I can use this on my 58m. Is this a bad idea?

===============

Here's what I picked out (not purchased yet), but I need to kill either the CPL or the ND filter. But if the UV filters aren't going to matter then I will gladly kill those from my list to get both ND and CPL.

See...
1. B+W 72mm MRC UV 010 Filter NEW F-PRO Multi-Coated Alloy
2. B+W 58mm MRC UV 010 Filter NEW F-PRO Multi-Coated Alloy
3. SLIM B+W 72mm Circular Polarizer C-POL Filter NEW
4. B+W 58mm to 72mm Step-Up Ring (Lens to Filter) #1E New
5. Hoya 72mm Neutral Density - ND - 4x Glass Filter NEW

Total: 170.34

I need to lose something from this list to bring it under 120.

I'm feeling overwhelmed here.

Please help.

Higher quality filters pass more of the light to the film/sensor. What does not go thru is left as 'reflection'...which materializes as lost contrast or flare (very bright objects reflected to different parts of the scene where they aren't originally)

Some say, "I have a cheap lens, so why should I get a good filter?" The answer is that if a cheap lens is 85% of an excellent lens, and a cheap filter lets thru only 93% of the light, wouldn't the combination allow the sensor to capture only 79% (0.93 * 0.80) of what an excellent lens would (with an excellent filter)?!

You could always lose the ND filter...a polarizer loses up to 2EV of light.

The CPL doesn't have to be slim, and the ND is a bit redundant as well.

This should convince you what to do with that Tiffen filter you have...
http://www.kenandchris​tine.com/gallery/10543​87_ucZqa

If you must have one of the two, then that filter should be the CPL...easily the most versatile filter that you can own. Don't spend the money on a 0.6 (2-stop) ND filter...the CPL will do double-duty in this regard. If you must have an ND filter, I'd go with a 0.9 (3-stop) or a 1.8 (6-stop), and quite possibly both to keep you covered for different conditions.. Odds are that you'll need more than one anyway since its hard to predict what type of light that you'll be shooting in. To get the silky water effect on waterfalls, you'll need to get down to a shutter speed of 1/2-second to 1-second...any longer that that, and the water takes on a cotton candy effect and starts to look like cotton balls...not realistic and it detracts from the image (unless that's the look you're after). If you're trying to smooth out water on a lake or other body of water, then you'll need much more light reduction, hence a stronger ND filter.

Personally, I'm not a fan of using step rings, especially with CPL's...I just have a CPL in various sizes to fit my lenses (77mm for my L's, and 67mm, 55mm, 49mm for my older MF lenses). Plus, the step rings can make it difficult to use your lens hoods and could be difficult trying to separate it from the step ring as well if you happened to overtighten them.

Wilt wrote in post #7669733
This should convince you what to do with that Tiffen filter you have...
http://www.kenandchris​tine.com/gallery/10543​87_ucZqa

Thanks for posting. This is exactly what I needed to know.
It made my decision pretty easy.


Argyle and Vascilli, thank you very much for your input. You have helped me greatly.

Here's what I placed on order:

1. B & W 58mm UV (Ultra Violet) Haze Multi Coated (2C) Glass Filter #010
2. B & W 72mm UV (Ultra Violet) Haze Multi Coated (2C) Glass Filter #010
3. HOYA 72mm Circular Polarizing Filter (Standard)
4. Step-Up Adapter Ring 58mm Lens to 72mm Filter Size


I decided to go with the step up adapter, just in case I need to swap the CPL onto my 58mm. I figure for 6 bucks, I can't lose. Given that I can't afford the 2nd CPL for 58mm right now.

Anyhow, I think I'm set.

Thanks a million for taking the time to help me out.

Signed,
Another satisfied customer

check out hvstar.net they have awsome prices!

Roger that.

Also, be careful with the Hoya CPL...many users on this forum have reported that their Hoya CPL has fallen apart unexpectedly due to a design flaw with the retaining ring. It doesn't happen on all of the Hoya CPL's, and TBH I can't recall the specific model number. It'd be best to search the forum threads before plunking down some money.

The Singh-Ray Vari-N-Duo is *the* waterfall filter - variable 2-8 stop ND effect (for a waterfall in broad daylight you *will* need 8 stops or more, whereas 2 stops may suffice for an early morning or evening shot in a forest), combined with a polariser. But it's pricey...

Vascilli wrote in post #7669711
The CPL doesn't have to be slim, and the ND is a bit redundant as well.

Disagree. The ND will be very valuable if you want to shoot waterfalls in daylight and still have the smooth water movement effect.

Grimlock wrote in post #7670473
Thanks for posting. This is exactly what I needed to know.
It made my decision pretty easy.


Argyle and Vascilli, thank you very much for your input. You have helped me greatly.

Here's what I placed on order:

1. B & W 58mm UV (Ultra Violet) Haze Multi Coated (2C) Glass Filter #010
2. B & W 72mm UV (Ultra Violet) Haze Multi Coated (2C) Glass Filter #010
3. HOYA 72mm Circular Polarizing Filter (Standard)
4. Step-Up Adapter Ring 58mm Lens to 72mm Filter Size


I decided to go with the step up adapter, just in case I need to swap the CPL onto my 58mm. I figure for 6 bucks, I can't lose. Given that I can't afford the 2nd CPL for 58mm right now.

Anyhow, I think I'm set.

Thanks a million for taking the time to help me out.

Signed,
Another satisfied customer

Personally, I would have skipped the two UV filters and bought the ND filter. You will most likely have the polarizer filter on most of the time, so the UV filters will just be taking up room in your bag. If you use your lens hoods, the need for the UV is very limited. Only time I use the UV filter is when there is either blowing sand or I am near the sea. Any other conditions, the UV is off my lens.

Shadowblade wrote in post #7670629
The Singh-Ray Vari-N-Duo is *the* waterfall filter - variable 2-8 stop ND effect (for a waterfall in broad daylight you *will* need 8 stops or more, whereas 2 stops may suffice for an early morning or evening shot in a forest), combined with a polariser. But it's pricey...

Its only available in 77mm filter size, none of which the OP has at the moment. As far as being "pricey", at first glance it would appear so. However, when considering the combined cost of high quality 77mm filters (CPL, multiple ND's), the cost of the S-R Vari-N-Duo doesn't seem that bad. The biggest advantage to the variable filter, as I see it, is that it gives the shooter the ability to compose and focus before setting the ND filter to the desired strength without the chance of accidentally changing the focus. With some ND's, depending on the stop value, you'd have to compose/focus, then thread the filter onto the lens (being sure not to change the focus in the process). Not sure if this claim is valid or not, but some shooters on FM have reported that the Vari-N-Duo is only capable of getting to 5 or 6 stops of light reduction, and not the marketed 8 stops.

Didn't see the lens lineup... anyway, you can always use a step-down ring.

As for the light reduction, mine's getting me to around 8 1/2 stops. Only problem is the vignetting on the 24-105mm lens (otherwise a great travel lens) at focal lengths less than around 45mm.

The OP doesn't have the funding (without involving a divorce) for the Singh-Ray either.

:P