SMALLEST affordable mic for 5D mkII

Please see post 10 .....


David

I use the Sennheiser 400 as well and I'm happy with it.

haquocdung wrote in post #8959900
If you already spend 3k for a good camera, why do you want to use a cheap mic?

i think thats why - atleast my case....

ChasWG wrote in post #8924531
Cheap mics make for crappy audio.

Would you use a $75 lens on the front of you new 7D? Probably not. So why use a crappy $75 mic? When you watch TV, a music video or any video for that matter, most people will accept marginal video. But once the sound is also crappy you'll turn away instantly. We just don't put up with crappy sound. In proffesional video creation a lot of attention is paid to the camera department. Less attention is paid to the sound department. But if something goes wrong with a shot or two, another one can be made or used in the edit to cover the mistake. Think of any talking head video, there are always cut aways to different shots, but the sound stays constant. Sound can also be editted, but to a lesser degree. A constant flow of someones interview is the driving factor in many of the shows I work on and so there is no room for mistakes. Crappy audio is not allowed in my world, so I don't use cheap mics.

My point is, spend a bit more on a mic and you'll be much happier. Look at the Rode NTG-2. It is available for right around $269. And then you need to look at a proper mic mount. The biggest complant from most people using these DSLR with video recording is the handling noise from the jog wheel or and other function you are messing with. That's because these cheap mics have solid bases on them and are attached directly to the camera body. The mic needs to be isolated from the body by a rubber mount. A shock suspension if you will.

Look at this site and call them. I love working with these people. Friendly, honest and they listen to you and give you what you want.
www.trewaudio.com
Just tell them what you are trying to do.

link to NGT-2 http://www.trewaudio.c​om …product.php?pro​ductid=715
link to shock mount http://www.trewaudio.c​om …product.php?pro​ductid=323
link to Sennhieser MKE400 http://www.trewaudio.c​om …cts/sennheiser_​mke400.htm

I appreciate your post. When my 1DMIV arrives, I am going to get one of the mics you talked about. Which one is 'better' (I assume both are awesome, but which is 'better' ).

Hogster86 wrote in post #8959475
Hi Rog

Thanks for your reply! It certainly sounds like the MKE400 is what I'm looking for ... regarding the hiss, do you have any videos online that have audio which was taken with the MKE400 that I could listen to? Although I guess that's not representative of how the mic would sound on a 7D but I imagine it would be similar ...

I've signed up on that DVInfo site twice now and I've never had my account 'accepted' by a moderator ... so I've never been able to post anything there!

Thanks again for your help

David

Hello David,

Sorry, I've been away from the forum for a while.

And again, sorry, I don't have an example of the sound of the MKE400 or accompanying hiss when the primary sound is missing.

This whole AGC(auto gain control) hiss thing of the 7D and 5DII reminds me of recording back in the days of tape over 20 years ago.

Suffice to say you won't want the hiss sound of the dead spots on any recording you are doing for $$$.

The good news is that technology exists for better sound...has for 10 - 15 years...my XH A1 has it.

Whether or not that gets incorporated into a DSLR...???

Of course, you can edit out the hiss like we did 20 years ago or so.

1080iAddict wrote in post #8978802
I appreciate your post. When my 1DMIV arrives, I am going to get one of the mics you talked about. Which one is 'better' (I assume both are awesome, but which is 'better' ).

Rode NTG-2 is better for sound.

However, with my 5DMKII, I always use my Sennheiser MKE400.

Why? Convenience. The Sennheiser MKE400 has a very good sound and is perfectly suited in size to the 5DII and most likely, the 7D.

1080iAddict wrote in post #8978802
I appreciate your post. When my 1DMIV arrives, I am going to get one of the mics you talked about. Which one is 'better' (I assume both are awesome, but which is 'better' ).

Sorry for the late reply, but I would give the nod to the rode NGT-2 over the Sennhieser. Sennhieser makes some wonderful mics (none of them are in the class we are talking here, mucho expensive). I use a Sennhieser MKH-416T on an almost daily basis. I also use a Schoeps CMC6/41 if I am in quieter, more "dead" environment. Both are fairly expensive mics, in the $1400 to $1800 price range. But I have often wanted to buy the Rode NTG-1 or 2 as a backup mic for those situations where I don't want to place a more expensive mic in harms way. The NTG-1 or 2 are accepable broadcast quality mics. Will they have the same range as the Schoeps? No. Will they have the same reach as the MKH-416? No. Will they perform properly and give you good sound? Yes!

The whole thing about sound is, start with a good mic. Then comes the mic pre-amps. In the case of the MkII or 7D, well that's where the whole deal falls down a bit. AGC is the bane of my existance in the sound world. It is mostly seen on the smaller, pro-sumer cameras I often work with. (remeber the whole thing about lsser quality video, but the sound stays the same?) Those cameras (Panasonic HPX-200, Sony Z1-U) I am always turning off the AGC, otherwise the sound is the same as your 7D, lots of hiss in the dead spots.
This is why people who are really serious about using these cameras will also be using a secondary record device. Something with proper mic inputs and pre-amps.

But then again, I'm a sound snob. Take it for what it's worth, but sound is how I make a living and put food on the table and buy Canon stuff with. So I can't be too wrong...

Chas - What is your view on the Magic Lantern firmware? Does having control over the gain make onboard audio recording more feasible with the 5DII / 7D (whenever the firmware for the latter is released)? Sorry to sound like a cheapskate!


David

the ML firmware is a good tool for on-board recording w/ a preamp. everyone should try it out, it does nothing to your canon's firmware bc it's temporary, and it goes back to normal as soon as you turn it off. therefore, by applying the ML firmware, you're not voiding your warranty.

There is nothing tricky about controlling your gain. you want it low to keep the signal high and low noise. however, lowering your gain will lower the sound. this is the reason why you need some sort of preamp.

Hogster86 wrote in post #8990002
Chas - What is your view on the Magic Lantern firmware? Does having control over the gain make onboard audio recording more feasible with the 5DII / 7D (whenever the firmware for the latter is released)? Sorry to sound like a cheapskate!

David

Any control you can get over the silly AGC is for the better. Your recordings should be much better with the lantern firmware. I think between having a decent mic and control of record levels, you should be pretty happy!

My suggestion (I've done pro audio and video for decades) is to buy a Zoom H2 recorder:

http://www.samash.com …rehouse%20Resea​led_571104

and record sound on that. You can sync it up later in post when you edit. This way, the quality is quite good and you are not tethered to the camera with a cable.

The smallest mic would probably be the one built into the 5D.

I use the Rode Stereo Video mic. The sound it produces is broadcast-quality.

ChasWG wrote in post #8925673
Well now, you didn't ask the question did you? So why not just stick to the internal mic and not spend any money on a stupid mic. And while you're at it, just keep taking snap shots with your 50 f1.8 as well. I'm sure you'll just love all those wonderful pictures you take and video you shoot of Christmas at mom's house. Those'll be real winners!

As for people who do care about such things as sound and getting it right, take a look at those links. Probably the best and least expensive external mic options out there.

elitists aren't welcome sometimes
if you read the original post, he was asking for a SUB 200 iirc mic
not a more than 200.00 mic
some people do it as a hobby

I've started with a different Rode mic - the VideoMic:
http://www.bhphotovide​o.com …eoMic_Camera_Mo​unted.html

It's a little larger than the Rode Stereo Video Mic, and a bit less expensive. Mono instead of stereo and a shotgun instead of omni. I haven't done a bunch with it yet, but from the simple tests I've done so far it is worlds better than the camera's mic.

Regards,
Jim

Not to get in the middle of this constructive conversation but the sound professionals http://www.soundprofes​sionals.com …d/category.cgi?​category=0 have a variety of mini mics. I have used the omnidirectional mini to record bird calls when I didn't want to carry my larger recording equipment and they work very well.
Today, I matched up my new 7D with my omni Sennheiser and it worked extremely well. Can't find my mini's to check them out but I would expect good results.
Now I have to find a way to attach the mic to the tripod.