Approve the Cookies
This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and our Privacy Policy.
OK
Forums  •   • New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear
Guest
Forums  •   • New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear
Register to forums    Log in

 
FORUMS Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon Lenses 
Thread started 29 Aug 2009 (Saturday) 17:30
Search threadPrev/next
sponsored links (only for non-logged)

Lenses with large apertures...

 
kitacanon
Goldmember
4,706 posts
Gallery: 1 photo
Likes: 36
Joined Sep 2006
Location: West Palm Beach
     
Aug 29, 2009 18:54 |  #16

Forgot to mention the interesting conflict/confusion about focusing...

Focusing is more CRITICAL at wider apertures because there is so little room for error...that room/range of error is called Depth of Focus or Depth of Field (DoF) which refers to the RELATIVE amount in focus within a range in front of and behind the POINT of focus, a range that is based on a print/enlargement of about an 8x10 on a 35mm camera...

The wider the aperture (F2 vs F8 ), and the closer you are to the subject at the same aperture, the less the DoF....the smaller aperture/greater distance, the more DoF....

[But DoF is ONLY an APPEARANCE of "in focus" because as you enlarge the image (as you are getting closer) you reduce the range of the DoF....only the POINT of focus will remain in focus....conversely, the SMALLER the image relative to an 8x10, (it looks as if you are farther away from the subject) the LARGER the range of focus of the DoF.... On a rebel/xxD the same rule holds but the base/standard for measuring the DoF is approximately 10x12 because the smaller the sensor/film frame the more is "in focus"]

Back to the focusing problem...if the aperture is made smaller the DoF increases and any focusing "error" of locking on to the point of focus perfectly is less noticed...but at the wider aperture the point of focus is more easily discerned, so errors are also more easily discerned, but if it is "spot on" the image will seem sharper because the focused point is more isolated from the foreground/background that is out of focus...on the other hand, some photographers will use a smaller aperture to get EVERYTHING in focus...

It is why many images are sharper when taken with a zoom set at 100mm/5.6 than at 100mm/2.8...

The challenge in low light situations to getting the point of focus accurately is giving the lens/body mechanism enough leeway (DoF) to get it right but not so much DoF that you get no isolation (if that's what you want)...

So with instances of error in using wide apertures, the problem is two-fold: either the focus mechanism is too wide to lock on the point of focus, (e.g. the focus box is as large as the whole face but you only want the eyes in focus) or the photographer isn't up to the task of aiming the camera correctly to allow the AF to get the job done...yes sometimes it is the archer and not the arrow....AF is not entirely automatic...

And finally...wider aperture allows you to use a faster shutter speed to reduce camera shake, a big buggaboo in image quality....but the smaller DoF also reduces the likelihood of perfect focus, also detrimental to IQ

...what do I do?...alway, well almost always, stop down 1 click from wide open...it's a compromise that has worked for me...

Hope this hasn't given you a headache...


My Canon kit 450D/s90; Canon lenses 18-55 IS, 70-210/3.5-4.5....Nikon kit: D610; 28-105/3.5-4.5, 75-300/4.5-5.6 AF, 50/1.8D Nikkors, Tamron 80-210; MF Nikkors: 50/2K, 50/1.4 AI-S, 50/1.8 SeriesE, 60/2.8 Micro Nikkor (AF locked), 85mm/1.8K-AI, 105/2.5 AIS/P.C, 135/2.8K/Q.C, 180/2.8 ED, 200/4Q/AIS, 300/4.5H-AI, ++ Tamron 70-210/3.8-4, Vivitar/Kiron 28/2, ser.1 70-210/3.5, ser.1 28-90; Vivitar/Komine and Samyang 28/2.8; 35mm Nikon F/FM/FE2, Rebel 2K...HTC RE UWA camera

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
kidfiji
Member
Avatar
210 posts
Joined Apr 2009
Location: Milpitas, CA
     
Aug 29, 2009 19:02 |  #17

Jack McEntire wrote in post #8546196 (external link)
Thanks again for the fast replies, I think I understand it a lot better now! :)

I'm wondering though, why are lenses with shorter focal lengths often cheaper than those with longer ones? For example, the [SIZE=2]Sigma 50mm f2.8 is a lot cheaper than the [SIZE=2]Sigma 105mm f2.8. Why is this, and what advantages/disadvantag​es do these lenses have in comparison to each other? I'm thinking of buying one of the two and I'm feeling a bit stuck, so any advice would be much appreciated! :)

Longer focal lengths generally require more glass. More glass = higher cost.


Gripped 50D

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
kitacanon
Goldmember
4,706 posts
Gallery: 1 photo
Likes: 36
Joined Sep 2006
Location: West Palm Beach
     
Aug 29, 2009 19:03 |  #18

there are 3 lenses that are the easiest to make...35mmF2.8, 50/F2 and 135mmF2.8 ...okay 200mm F4 too...virually all others are more complex...as it is to make the above lenses wider


My Canon kit 450D/s90; Canon lenses 18-55 IS, 70-210/3.5-4.5....Nikon kit: D610; 28-105/3.5-4.5, 75-300/4.5-5.6 AF, 50/1.8D Nikkors, Tamron 80-210; MF Nikkors: 50/2K, 50/1.4 AI-S, 50/1.8 SeriesE, 60/2.8 Micro Nikkor (AF locked), 85mm/1.8K-AI, 105/2.5 AIS/P.C, 135/2.8K/Q.C, 180/2.8 ED, 200/4Q/AIS, 300/4.5H-AI, ++ Tamron 70-210/3.8-4, Vivitar/Kiron 28/2, ser.1 70-210/3.5, ser.1 28-90; Vivitar/Komine and Samyang 28/2.8; 35mm Nikon F/FM/FE2, Rebel 2K...HTC RE UWA camera

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
toxic
Goldmember
3,498 posts
Likes: 2
Joined Nov 2008
Location: California
     
Aug 29, 2009 19:09 |  #19

Jack McEntire wrote in post #8545968 (external link)
Is that so? :confused: I was thinking that that must be the case... I can't see why those lenses command such ridiculous prices, what real advantages do they have?

yes, DoF shrinks with smaller f-stops. That doesn't mean it shrinks to 1 inch. DoF is influenced by f-stops, subject-camera distance, focal length, and a bunch of other factors you can worry about later. Shooting at 200mm and f/2 doesn't automatically mean the DoF is very small since you still have to consider the distance to the subject.

The advantage is background separation and the extra shutter speed to freeze motion.

Jack McEntire wrote in post #8546196 (external link)
I'm wondering though, why are lenses with shorter focal lengths often cheaper than those with longer ones? For example, the [SIZE=2]Sigma 50mm f2.8 is a lot cheaper than the [SIZE=2]Sigma 105mm f2.8. Why is this, and what advantages/disadvantag​es do these lenses have in comparison to each other? I'm thinking of buying one of the two and I'm feeling a bit stuck, so any advice would be much appreciated! :)

Shorter focal lengths are not cheaper than longer ones. However, for reasons that I'm not quite clear on, 50mm is the cheapest lens to produce (for 35mm film, at least). As you get wider or longer, the cost increases, especially wider, since wider lenses are more vulnerable to optical aberrations.

...and then there's construction (build quality) and the age of the design to consider.




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
gasrocks
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
13,432 posts
Likes: 2
Joined Mar 2005
Location: Portage, Wisconsin USA
     
Aug 29, 2009 20:45 |  #20

How about this way of looking at cost - A 50mm F/2 lens has a roughly 25mm in diameter front elelment. A 500mm f/2 lens woudl have a 250mm in diameter front element. Glass does cost money.


GEAR LIST
_______________

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links (only for non-logged)

2,315 views & 0 likes for this thread, 11 members have posted to it and it is followed by 2 members.
Lenses with large apertures...
FORUMS Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon Lenses 
AAA
x 1600
y 1600

Jump to forum...   •  Rules   •  Forums   •  New posts   •  RTAT   •  'Best of'   •  Gallery   •  Gear   •  Reviews   •  Member list   •  Polls   •  Image rules   •  Search   •  Password reset   •  Home

Not a member yet?
Register to forums
Registered members may log in to forums and access all the features: full search, image upload, follow forums, own gear list and ratings, likes, more forums, private messaging, thread follow, notifications, own gallery, all settings, view hosted photos, own reviews, see more and do more... and all is free. Don't be a stranger - register now and start posting!


COOKIES DISCLAIMER: This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and to our privacy policy.
Privacy policy and cookie usage info.


POWERED BY AMASS forum software 2.58forum software
version 2.58 /
code and design
by Pekka Saarinen ©
for photography-on-the.net

Latest registered member is Mihai Bucur
1015 guests, 168 members online
Simultaneous users record so far is 15,144, that happened on Nov 22, 2018

Photography-on-the.net Digital Photography Forums is the website for photographers and all who love great photos, camera and post processing techniques, gear talk, discussion and sharing. Professionals, hobbyists, newbies and those who don't even own a camera -- all are welcome regardless of skill, favourite brand, gear, gender or age. Registering and usage is free.