Over power the sun

Help me understand something. I want to try to over power the sun. Let's say by 1 full stop. If I take a ambient reading of f2.8 ISO 100 Shutter 100. Would setting my power on my strobe to f4, but leaving my camera at f2.8 etc be the right way?

Depends what aperture you want to use.

If you want to use f/4 then set the strobe to f/4 and set the camera to f/4.

If you want to use f/2.8 then you can set the strobe to f/2.8, set the camera to f/2.8 and double the shutter speed to reduce the ambient light to f/2.

Either way you'll be overpowering it by 1 stop.

Hermes wrote in post #8977665
Depends what aperture you want to use.

That would all depend on what the meter is reading for ambient light right?

extrememc wrote in post #8977750
That would all depend on what the meter is reading for ambient light right?

Not really. Whatever the ambient light reading is, you just make sure your strobe is 1EV more.

You can use shutter speed, ISO, ND filters, e.t.c. to get whatever aperture you want.

Underexpose the sun for -1 stop with your camera.. and use the strobe as needed..

Shamir wrote in post #8978203
Underexpose the sun for -1 stop with your camera.. and use the strobe as needed..

if you meter someones face from the strobe then go -1 for the ambient in camera wont that also darken the face of the subject as well as the ambient?

extrememc wrote in post #8977649
Help me understand something. I want to try to over power the sun. Let's say by 1 full stop. If I take a ambient reading of f2.8 ISO 100 Shutter 100. Would setting my power on my strobe to f4, but leaving my camera at f2.8 etc be the right way?

Here is the easy way to think about it. First, remove the strobe from the equation.

If you want the ambient to underexpose by 1 stop, and the ambient reads f/2.8, and I set my camera to f/4, then the ambient would be underexposed. Without any additional lighting, your subject would be underexposed by 1 stop as well.

So, if you now add in a strobe, and get it to meter at f/4, and your camera is set at f/4, then that would mean your subject would be properly lit, but still the areas lit by ambient would be 1 stop underexposed.

The main thing is you want to meter using a single ISO and the fastest shutter synch speed of your camera. The shutter speed and ISO should not change.

The easiest way I have seen to look at it was from Phamster.

He is not classicly trained nor am I so it was easy to understand.

1. Shutter speed controls Ambient
2. Aperature controls flash on subjects
3. ISO controls both

Its easy for me to remember this way, I know there are many variables but these do apply.

What I have been doing is shooting an initial shot in AV mode and seeing what the readings are on the camera. Lets say I get 1/600 @ F4.0 with ISO 100. I then dial up my shutter speed to limit the ambient light getting in and take a shot or two to see if I like it. From there it is just playing with it and seeing if you like whats in the LCD after the shots. Just remember the above. Hope this helps, I am still trying to figure it out myself but getting closer!

Jake

jdhart73 wrote in post #8978790
The easiest way I have seen to look at it was from Phamster.

He is not classicly trained nor am I so it was easy to understand.

1. Shutter speed controls Ambient
2. Aperature controls flash on subjects
3. ISO controls both


Jake

This works for most applications, but to overpower the sun it may not work as on a sunny day if you really want to darken a sky even ISO 100 will not allow you to lower your shutter speed to within max sync speeds so you have to rely on both shuttter speed and aperture to control the ambient. Of course it can still apply using high speed sync, but your flash power is so diminished that you may still have difficulty overpowering the sun.

BrianAZ wrote in post #8978402
Here is the easy way to think about it. First, remove the strobe from the equation.

If you want the ambient to underexpose by 1 stop, and the ambient reads f/2.8, and I set my camera to f/4, then the ambient would be underexposed. Without any additional lighting, your subject would be underexposed by 1 stop as well.

So, if you now add in a strobe, and get it to meter at f/4, and your camera is set at f/4, then that would mean your subject would be properly lit, but still the areas lit by ambient would be 1 stop underexposed.

The main thing is you want to meter using a single ISO and the fastest shutter synch speed of your camera. The shutter speed and ISO should not change.

Thanks for the explanation.

In the same manner dealing with lighting ratios. I can set a rim light +1=f4 over beauty dish f2.8 and get a proper exposed face with alittle rim light. Correct?

Just to add to and clarify what some others are saying.

It's a 3 step process. First you determine what the exposure is for the ambient light. Then determine how much you want to underexpose the ambient relative to your subject exposure. Then you determine what aperture you have to shoot at, or if you have ND filters you determine which filter to use based on the aperture you want to shoot. Of course you can use shutter speed to reduce ambient (to a point) and can use ISO to adjust your taking aperture (also, to a point).

In order for you to underexpose your ambient you have to have enough firepower to do so. In other words, if ambient is reading f/8 and you want to underexpose by 2 stops then that means you have to have flash or strobes that can produce f/16.

You can then shoot at f/16 or as an example, if you wanted to shoot at f/5.6 that would require a 2 stop (.9) ND filter on your lens to reduce the overall amount of light reaching your sensor.

Would the easiest way be my controlling the light?

extrememc wrote in post #8979381
Would the easiest way be my controlling the light?

You can't control the Sun.

You can use diffusion material and scrims but that's your only means of reducing output from the Sun. The only other thing you can do is to work in shade or if you don't have a client that must shoot in the midday sun, pick the early morning or early evening to work and then the Sun isn't directly overhead.

Bob Hasty wrote in post #8978335
if you meter someones face from the strobe then go -1 for the ambient in camera wont that also darken the face of the subject as well as the ambient?

No, if your using a strobe, your having 2 different light source, the Sun, and your strobe.

to overpower the sun, set your shutter speed to your maximun sync speed.. that would be 1/200 to 1/250th depending on your camera.. after that, take a picture and see where ambient light is getting.. if you arent underexposing the picture.. then, add your strobe to a high power and close your aperture to help underexpose.. remember.. Aperture controls your flash exposure.. so.. if you get to f16-f22 to get an underexposed image of the sun, you will need to take your strobe almost on full power, if it has any modifier..