580 EXII. what is best: Umbrella or softbox?

I am just playing around with family in the house. Not a profession. Maybe might start doing some portraits for friends and those type of things. I have a stofen omni bounce in it right now. I have a 430 exII I am going to get fixed soon. My next purchase will be wireless triggers, so what should I get, an umbrella or a softbox? and what size?

I would start with a shoot through umbrella.

With a bit of care mounting the 430EX on with the umbrella and the 580EII on camera you should be able to use ETTL. Manual for the remote flash, since its a known distance from the subject works as well. Then use the 580EXII on camera for fill.

There is a lighting exercise on my tutorial site that illustrates how I use shoot throughs and reflectors.

Depends on the use and how you want to control the light really. I like both. Umbrellas are nice because they're easier and quicker to set up. Softboxes are nice because they allow better control of the light.
Personally, regardless of which you choose, I'd get at least a 42" umbrella, bigger if you can. Softboxes, I think this set is great...
http://www.bhphotovide​o.com …_Studio_Lightin​g_Kit.html

The westcott package does offer a nice set of modifiers. Especially with the reflector.
I bought, tried and returned the Westcott Apollo softbox. Fir me it has some sever working limitations. Mainly, its a pain to get a Speedlite situated in the unit and more importantly, its nearly impossible to tilt it down at all when mounted on a lightstand.

Many people like it and use it.

'Best' is relative and quite subjective. Many people use umbrellas by choice and get brilliant results. Softboxes and umbrellas each have a distinct personality and can be used in many different ways. For every great shot done with a softbox you can find an equally great shot done with an umbrella.

If I could only have one light modifier it would be a 46" Photek Softlighter. If offers great versatility as a shoot through umbrella, a reflective bounce umbrella, with or without the silver insert, and also as an umbrella softbox, with or without the silver insert.

Softboxes more accurately simulate window lighting. Umbrellas (especially under 45" or so) often appear more unnatural and give a familiar "flashed" look, but they provide greater area coverage and more gradual light falloff, which is beneficial for large group photos.

Umbrellas are generally much cheaper, faster, and more portable. I use them often for all of those reasons.

form wrote in post #9140531
Softboxes more accurately simulate window lighting.

Except that these days no one really pays attention or seems to care about the shape of the catch light with respect to whether it's simulating window light or Sun light.

I agree with you but we're in the age of 'no rules' and 'rules are meant to be broken' and 'I don't care about technique, just concept'.

Not thinking of catchlight so much as relative shape, size, direction and diffuse characteristics of the light source.

The most effectivfe way to simulate window light is to have a BIG modifier relative to the subject and keep it close. A panel does the best job simply because its about the same size as a lot of windows.
The 86" PLM with or without a defusion front panel is another good window simulater, again because of its size. Without defusion, it is like a window with sunny day outside. With its more like we generally think of window light -- north facing with soft light.

One reason I did the Lighting exercise that's on my tutorial site, is to illustrate that similar soft shadow transitions are available via a shot through with a speedlite. i.e. quick and easy.

Rob, I have a couple of softlighters and never thought about taking the backing off to make them a shoot through. (didn't even realize it could be done.)

dmward wrote in post #9140338
The westcott package does offer a nice set of modifiers. Especially with the reflector.
I bought, tried and returned the Westcott Apollo softbox. Fir me it has some sever working limitations. Mainly, its a pain to get a Speedlite situated in the unit and more importantly, its nearly impossible to tilt it down at all when mounted on a lightstand.

Many people like it and use it.

i'd like to know more about the physical limitations you encountered, regarding setting up the flash in the box, and what sort of tilt angle you could manage.

dmward wrote in post #9140831
The most effectivfe way to simulate window light is to have a BIG modifier relative to the subject and keep it close. A panel does the best job simply because its about the same size as a lot of windows.
The 86" PLM with or without a defusion front panel is another good window simulater, again because of its size. Without defusion, it is like a window with sunny day outside. With its more like we generally think of window light -- north facing with soft light.

One reason I did the Lighting exercise that's on my tutorial site, is to illustrate that similar soft shadow transitions are available via a shot through with a speedlite. i.e. quick and easy.

Rob, I have a couple of softlighters and never thought about taking the backing off to make them a shoot through. (didn't even realize it could be done.)

When I want to simulate window light I use a large diffusion panel with a large softbox behind it. As a matter of fact I'm doing a shoot today where I'm simulating window light on a dreary rainy day. I have a window frame made of foam core and a set of venetian blinds to further enhance the prop.

I'll be changing the apparent time of day and lighting by using the a 1/4 CTO on a small softbox used as an accent light to give the face a little more light.