Live view and shutter life

Exactly! You know how many pictures you've taken but people are wanting to check the 'odo' before they buy used or get a refurb. Who knows if it is accurate anyways and a camera with 80000 shutter actuations may last longer than one with 20000. You just don't know and can't predict when it will fail.

hpulley wrote in post #9177979
...a camera with 80000 shutter actuations may last longer than one with 20000. You just don't know and can't predict when it will fail.

Actually I think that this is the reason. Canon claims some number of actuations. I know it's a MTBF number but there sure seem to be a lot of posts of failed shutters will very few actuations.

Dooms_day wrote in post #9177564
For some reason the download will not work, it gets to about 12% and then freezes... are there any mirrors for this download?

I just checked the download, and I'm not seeing any issues.

gjl711 wrote in post #9178050
Actually I think that this is the reason. Canon claims some number of actuations. I know it's a MTBF number but there sure seem to be a lot of posts of failed shutters will very few actuations.

I believe the reason is that John Q. Public doesn't understand that it's a MTBF number, or even the concept of MTBF. LiveView not incrementing the number also confuses the matter, unless it somehow works differently.

What *I* don't understand is why Canon treats third-party developers so poorly, but I'm biased.

As for why you see a lot of posts about failed shutters with very few actuations, one explanation might be human nature - people who are happy with a product don't tend to talk (post) about it unless asked, whereas people who are pissed off are going to tell as many people as possible.

Ironically (perhaps in the not-quite-textbook usage of the word), the shutter on my own 40D died two months ago in the 14K range. I'm almost afraid to send it in.

David

Dooms_day wrote in post #9164830
You know how when you use live view it opens up the shutter? well doesnt that count as a click because i open and close that with 1/3 of my pics, so i really think this could deminish the shutter life. ESPECIALLY when you use live view, and use real focusing where it flips up the mirror, and then opens the shutter again for more live view.

Post your thoughts.

People who use Live View in that manner are shooting much less anyway.

It is not an MTBF. Canon has never, ever referred to it as a MTBF. Canon has referred to it as a design test criterion, which is not a MTBF.

I think people should stop caring about shutter actuations and just use their damn cameras

^ agree. A new shutter doesn't cost much and I bet most of us will never use the camera enough to live through multiple shutter lives anyways.

mikekelley wrote in post #9179157
I think people should stop caring about shutter actuations and just use their damn cameras

whoa there, hold your horses.

If I don't pixel peep, worry about how many actuations my shutter has or do 1,749 test shots with the lens cap on to test my sensor noise.... what am I going to talk about on this forum?

FarmerDave8N wrote in post #9178842
...
What *I* don't understand is why Canon treats third-party developers so poorly, but I'm biased. ...

Thats not hard to understand. As a manufacturer of lenses, why would I want to do anything to help a compeditor steal my business. I'm amazed that they don't do more just to mes with them and increase their cost of doing business.

Canon doesn't treat 3rd party developers any way at all. Canon ignores them and does their own thing, as do all other camera manufacturers, unless and until Canon engages in a mutually advantageous licensing agreement (as they had for a while with Kodak).

I have replaced many parts in my Camera .. and Shutters are not that bad actually.

I think they "hide" the info because it really does not mean anything.. I am sure if the Shutter fails in some camera's in the 5-14k range and some last to over 200k So it really doesent matter. Does shutter Speed have an effect in the shutter life, one will never know. Holding the shutter open for live view does that make it last longer or shorter?

The shutter lasts quite a long time so please dont read into anything too much is all I am saying.

If any one wants me to do a shutter replacement just pm me

shutter actuations, give or take some. A camera will fail at some point. A high actuation camera could still fail later than a low one.

On the same token, taking many sequential pics under live view would reduce the number of times the mirror drops and lifts, which would also reduce the wear and tear compared to a normal actuation. Also, some cameras have a "silent" shooting mode, where it slows down the whole release action. That would likely reduce wear too. So you give and take some here and there. My 20D probably had over 100k actuations and still worked like it was fresh out of the box when I sold it. My 1D3 shutter died at 15k.

I wouldn't worry too much about actuations, personally.

I've got a feeling that Live View necessitated that the shutter be driven by two separate motors, as they are now, instead of one motor.

RDKirk wrote in post #9179134
People who use Live View in that manner are shooting much less anyway.

That's actually a somewhat common practice with astrophotography as a way to "fake" MLU.

RDKirk wrote in post #9179137
It is not an MTBF. Canon has never, ever referred to it as a MTBF. Canon has referred to it as a design test criterion, which is not a MTBF.

I've actually never seen either phrase used by Canon, only "rated at" - but then again, I've not looked that hard. However, it's a lot easier to explain their reticence by calling it a MTBF, because some people actually have a grasp on what that means, and how it relates to real life - as opposed to "design test criterion."

IVIax wrote in post #9179174
whoa there, hold your horses.

If I don't pixel peep, worry about how many actuations my shutter has or do 1,749 test shots with the lens cap on to test my sensor noise.... what am I going to talk about on this forum?

LOL! There's the (soon to be) raging 9D/60D/505D/550D debate - as I understand it, the 505D has a buttons keeping everything closed, and the 550D is a little roomier in the seat.

gjl711 wrote in post #9179269
Thats not hard to understand. As a manufacturer of lenses,

Sorry, I should have been more specific - I don't understand why Canon treats 3rd-party *software* developers so poorly. One would think that you'd want to encourage developers to create software for your hardware, but what do I know - I give software away.

gjl711 wrote in post #9164867
Yes, the shutter opens so I would count that as a shutter actuation.

When you actually take the picture, it counts as a shot. When you activate live view only the first curtain opens and it does not count as a shot until you actually take the picture. No different than when not using live view.

gjl711 wrote in post #9165320
I would guess that Canon does not reset the shutter count. There are other mechanical components besides the shutter that would benefit from knowing how many actuations there are. maybe someone who has a 40,50,450,500 or 1000 and has had a shutter replaced can weigh in.

Canon resets the shot count on the shutter when it is replaced. There is also a total shot count on most models that does not get reset when the shutter is replaced.