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FORUMS Canon Cameras, Lenses & Accessories Canon EF and EF-S Lenses 
Thread started 26 Dec 2009 (Saturday) 13:51
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Crop body and lens question.

 
cobra671
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Dec 26, 2009 13:51 |  #1

Happy holidays all!!

I didnt' know where else to post this question, so if it's in the wrong forum, please redirect. :oops:

I sort of understand that the FL on EF lenses mounted on crop bodies increases by 1.6, my question is; Does that factor apply to EF-S lenses also?

If this has been asked before, please excuse my ignorance and kindly post a link.

Thanks

edit: Nevermind, I found the link. MODS, please close thread.




  
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DreDaze
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Dec 26, 2009 13:55 |  #2

yes sort of :)(the sort of part will be explained in intense details by others to follow)

but bottom line 18mm on an EF lens is the same as an 18mm on an EF-S lens


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Mark1
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Dec 26, 2009 14:55 |  #3

Yes the factor does still apply. The focal length of the lens is a physical measurement from the optical center of the lens to the sensor plane. What sensor is being used is not part of the equation. EF and EF-S are mount styles. they also have nothing to do with the crop factor. The crop factor is solely a sensor issue. So you can apply it to every lens.

Saying "they increase" is only a easy way to explain it. But technically it is not true. A 50mm lens is still 50mm. All that is happening is you are capturing a smaller section of the latent image inside the camera than a "full frame" sensor would.


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440roadrunner
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Dec 26, 2009 23:27 |  #4
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Imagine that you use the same lens, both on a ff and a crop camera to take a picture of the same scene from the exact spot.

Now imagine you are looking out the front window, and in the front lawn, in the center of the window "frame" is a flower garden. It is a "certain" size.

Now imagine that your "other" partially closes the drapes, cutting off (cropping) some of the scene. NOTICE that even though you see LESS of the outer edges, the flower garden in the center, or anything else REMAINS THE SAME SIZE

This, in a nutshell, is the effect of "crop" bodies. They do NOT change anything except crop of the edges of the frame


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cobra671
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Dec 27, 2009 08:51 |  #5

DreDaze wrote in post #9266184 (external link)
yes sort of :)(the sort of part will be explained in intense details by others to follow)

but bottom line 18mm on an EF lens is the same as an 18mm on an EF-S lens

Mark1 wrote in post #9266397 (external link)
Yes the factor does still apply. The focal length of the lens is a physical measurement from the optical center of the lens to the sensor plane. What sensor is being used is not part of the equation. EF and EF-S are mount styles. they also have nothing to do with the crop factor. The crop factor is solely a sensor issue. So you can apply it to every lens.

Saying "they increase" is only a easy way to explain it. But technically it is not true. A 50mm lens is still 50mm. All that is happening is you are capturing a smaller section of the latent image inside the camera than a "full frame" sensor would.

440roadrunner wrote in post #9268356 (external link)
Imagine that you use the same lens, both on a ff and a crop camera to take a picture of the same scene from the exact spot.

Now imagine you are looking out the front window, and in the front lawn, in the center of the window "frame" is a flower garden. It is a "certain" size.

Now imagine that your "other" partially closes the drapes, cutting off (cropping) some of the scene. NOTICE that even though you see LESS of the outer edges, the flower garden in the center, or anything else REMAINS THE SAME SIZE

This, in a nutshell, is the effect of "crop" bodies. They do NOT change anything except crop of the edges of the frame

Thanks for the responses guys! I think I understand it now. So any lens I mount onto my camera is going to be magnified, so to speak, by 1.6x from the get go. Right?

Again, thank you for the responses.




  
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kitacanon
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Dec 27, 2009 08:57 |  #6

There are "stickies" at the top of this forum that will inform you more than any one poster can reply....


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cobra671
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Dec 27, 2009 09:17 |  #7

kitacanon wrote in post #9269755 (external link)
There are "stickies" at the top of this forum that will inform you more than any one poster can reply....

Yeah, I found it after I posted, hence the "edit:" in the first post. I just didn't want to be rude and ignore the responses I got afterwards. Thanks.




  
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SkipD
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Dec 27, 2009 11:46 |  #8

cobra671 wrote in post #9269741 (external link)
Thanks for the responses guys! I think I understand it now. So any lens I mount onto my camera is going to be magnified, so to speak, by 1.6x from the get go. Right?

It is true that ALL lenses that fit on an APS-C camera, regardless of the lens design (EF vs EF-S for example), will have a different field (angle) of view as compared to that same focal length being used on a different format camera.

The key thing to understand is that, unless a photographer has experience with a 35mm film format camera, the "crop factor" should be virtually ignored as it will have almost no bearing on what that photographer does with lens choices. The only time the "crop factor" might come into play would be when reading a text which is suggesting focal lengths based on the 35mm film format and converting to focal lengths that would provide the same field (angle) of view on the APS-C format (or whatever other format the photographer may be using.


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cobra671
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Dec 27, 2009 13:44 |  #9

Thanks Skip! I guess I just need to keep reading and quit being impatient. :D




  
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SkipD
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Dec 27, 2009 13:57 |  #10

cobra671 wrote in post #9271036 (external link)
Thanks Skip! I guess I just need to keep reading and quit being impatient. :D

A really important thing to realize - and I think it's been said in this thread - is that any lens of the same focal length which fits your camera (whatever the format is) will provide the same field (angle) of view.

In other words, an EF-S zoom lens set to 50mm will have the same field of view as an EF fixed focal length 50mm lens or an EF zoom set to 50mm.

There are a few "gotchas" here, though. One is the fact that the focal length markings on zoom lenses are only approximate because of tolerances. In addition, lens manufacturers tend to round off the focal lengths they mark on their lenses. Thus, a true 48mm lens could easily be marked as a 50mm lens. Finally, focal lengths marked on lenses are true for infinity focus only. The actual focal lengths tend to change as you focus closer.


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xarqi
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Dec 27, 2009 15:23 |  #11

cobra671 wrote in post #9269741 (external link)
Thanks for the responses guys! I think I understand it now. So any lens I mount onto my camera is going to be magnified, so to speak, by 1.6x from the get go. Right?

Wrong. There is no magnification of any sort whatsoever as a result of mounting a lens on a body with a smaller sensor; there is only cropping. The scale of the image formed is unchanged, there is just less of it. You are not getting more of anything, as the sales spin would have it, you are getting less.




  
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cobra671
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Dec 27, 2009 16:26 |  #12

I see, by less, you mean if my kit lens is an 18-55, the reality is 29-88? I feel short changed. :( Just kidding. Man I need something wider then. Tokina perhaps? Hmmmmm, this could get very expensive. :D




  
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Dec 27, 2009 16:38 |  #13

cobra671 wrote in post #9271856 (external link)
I see, by less, you mean if my kit lens is an 18-55, the reality is 29-88?

No.




  
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cobra671
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Dec 27, 2009 17:12 |  #14

Okay, I give up. I will keep reading to get a full understanding. Thank you.




  
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DreDaze
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Dec 27, 2009 17:18 |  #15

cobra671 wrote in post #9272098 (external link)
Okay, I give up. I will keep reading to get a full understanding. Thank you.

the reason it's wrong is that the lens length never changes...the lens will always be an 18-55mm lens regardless of what body it's attached to...

however the fov of the 18-55mm on a crop is equal to a 29-88mm lens on a FF body...people get all hung up on a bunch of words here...


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Crop body and lens question.
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