Einstein - Pre Orders !!!

mickeyjuice wrote in post #11190333
Thinking about it before doing it is sensible. It's the ones who just go "There's nothing anywhere close to ABs so I'm getting them" WITHOUT thinking that I'm railing against.

The D'Lites are in the ballpark, but if they don't do what you need, they don't do it. Most, however, don't even know they exist because they do zero research, then desperately defend their purchases.

Yah D-Lites are in the ballpark.... But I honestly think the AB800 & AB1600 is a better strobe for the money.... am I wrong to think this? from my knowledge I came to this conclusion... I could be wrong, dunno?

I agree... buying without researching and then defending your purchase with no reasoning is dumb. I would like to own something other then Alienbees for lighting but its just out of my reach and for the money I spent I couldn't have gotten anything better when considering the strobes themselves and the type and quality of modifiers. The biggest thing that in the end that pushed me over was the Vagabond that makes the whole system "portable" enough to use on location again for a very reasonable amount of $$$ for portable power IMHO.

Im contemplating not getting more AB's and modifiers but when I look at what else is out there its either again too expensive or the AB product actually is better.

Personally, I think PCB has every backwards and wrong when it comes to dealing with business. He mixes his personal feelings and life with business way too much. But I wont deny that his company does have some pretty decent products for the money with some failures like the Einstein.

I really do dig the Eli Quadra Setup.

Florida_Photography wrote in post #11190156
Thought I would chime in to let people know how much of a backorder they have going on right now for the Einstein. I called in and asked about my order (placed 10 days ago) and they told me they expect to ship my 3 units by late November. The mount fix should be coming out around the same time in early December. I also have a 64" silver PLM on backorder which they expect to be shipped at late November, and a Vagabond II which should be shipped mid-December

I'm going to just go ahead an ignore a lot of the complaints issued on this thread because in all honesty I don't really care for the drama brought on by forum topics like this. I'll get the unit, test it out myself, and if it isn't up to par I'll just ship it right back. Internet message boards are breeding grounds for fanboys and haters alike. I would much rather depend on reviews from trusted and respected photographers than anonymous forum users.

congrats on your new order, i hope you don't wait too long, i pre ordered mine in January

and haven't recieved version 1,2 or three, so good luck on your purchase

JayStar86 wrote in post #11190295
^^^ See while I agree with you guys wholeheartedly about "buying into a system"... I thought about it long and hard before I bought my alienbees stuff a couple months ago and I knew about all the issues surrounding Paul C Buff and Alienbees.

So why I did I still go ahead and buy two AB800's, Vagabond II, 47 Octa, Med SB and a couple grids..... there products are still the best bang for your buck out there in lighting world atleast from what I have seen out there.

As much I know I would rather be buying into a different system while Im on the verge of buying another AB400 and a couple modifiers from PCB... its just when I look at the cost of their products for the money I am looking to spend gives me the best for my buck.

I cannot afford Elinchrom or Profoto.... so for the kind of money one spends on Alienbees is there anything better for the money I ask?

I asked that same question over and over and I couldn't find anything. So I went ahead and still bought PCB products despite the companies problems and issues. And Im sure there are hundreds of others out there just like me with the same reasoning.

The point of this post is to give you a perspective of why someone would still buy PCB products despite the companies shortcomings. I personally agree with many that PCB and Alienbees is on the path of self destruction.

I can only hope that after the old man goes who ever runs the company will do a better job.

If I had the dough I would buy Eli lighting in a heartbeat.

JayStar86 wrote in post #11190360
Yah D-Lites are in the ballpark.... But I honestly think the AB800 & AB1600 is a better strobe for the money.... am I wrong to think this? from my knowledge I came to this conclusion... I could be wrong, dunno?

I agree... buying without researching and then defending your purchase with no reasoning is dumb. I would like to own something other then Alienbees for lighting but its just out of my reach and for the money I spent I couldn't have gotten anything better when considering the strobes themselves and the type and quality of modifiers. The biggest thing that in the end that pushed me over was the Vagabond that makes the whole system "portable" enough to use on location again for a very reasonable amount of $$$ for portable power IMHO.

Im contemplating not getting more AB's and modifiers but when I look at what else is out there its either again too expensive or the AB product actually is better.

Personally, I think PCB has every backwards and wrong when it comes to dealing with business. He mixes his personal feelings and life with business way too much. But I wont deny that his company does have some pretty decent products for the money with some failures like the Einstein.

I really do dig the Eli Quadra Setup.

i had similar opinions as you do, and after buying multiple AB's (5) i found the colour balance issue

when using multiple strobes at different settings gave me too much inconsistency

for the record i had 3 800' and 2 400's, that was when i sold all of it for elinchrom

this is not a AB hater post, i just want you to know why some people switch brands

FJ LOVE wrote in post #11190530
i had similar opinions as you do, and after buying multiple AB's (5) i found the colour balance issue

when using multiple strobes at different settings gave me too much inconsistency

for the record i had 3 800' and 2 400's, that was when i sold all of it for elinchrom

this is not a AB hater post, i just want you to know why some people switch brands

Oh believe me I know why people leave AB strobes..... Read all about it and hear plenty a stories. Robert is a great resource on here.... read some interesting insight from him as well.


Im curious before I buy more AB stuff about hearing any of your or others opinions on whether the D-lite4 or D-lite2's are worth dropping my AB800's and PCB stuff for???

Would the vagabondII be able to power two D-Lite4's and one D-Lite2 ?

The D-Lites themselves aren't that much more.... its the cost of portable power and modifiers that concerns me with the D-Lites.

When I owned the Vagabond II it could not power two D-Lite 4's but somewhere down the road I'm told the Vagabond inverter was changed and that there were reports of people using two D-Lite 4's successfully.

I don't think I've ever seen anyone using or commenting on more than two D-Lite 4's. Adding that extra D-Lite 2 may or may not work.

Do you know if most of those who have ordered would rather have a working albeit flawed unit now and have it replaced at no cost later. Or would they rather wait the aggregated time between the first Einstein/PLM/Vagabond Mini/Etc. shipping and the V3 shipping before getting any units at all?

Because what you are saying only rings true if most would rather wait. If not, the PCB is going what his customers want. Of course, the optimum solution would be to ship flawless products from the get go, but if PCB lacks the capacity to do so then he has to choose the lesser bad that better suits his customers.

And, just to be clear, the only PCB product I own is a Chinese knock-off of the PLM from eBay. I just found the rhetoric to be a little one-sided.

tetrode wrote in post #11189601
A bit OT, so apologies in advance.

Great minds do, sometimes, think alike, Mic. That adamdewilde post you quote prompted me to send a PM a few hours ago to one of our well-known "haters" expressing the exact same thought: If PCB TRULY cared about his customers in the manner Adam apparently believes he does he wouldn't be shipping them questionably designed, untested, often-non-functioning products that don't work reliably (if at all) out of the box and that have to be updated repeatedly. This is the point that seems to elude the true believers.

Did you ever see Invasion of the Body Snatchers?

Dave F.

TMR Design wrote in post #11190729
When I owned the Vagabond II it could not power two D-Lite 4's but somewhere down the road I'm told the Vagabond inverter was changed and that there were reports of people using two D-Lite 4's successfully.

I don't think I've ever seen anyone using or commenting on more than two D-Lite 4's. Adding that extra D-Lite 2 may or may not work.

Aw man, I was hoping for better.

Is there any other solution (not radically expensive) out there that can power two D-lites4 + one D-Lite2.

If I can figure out how to power those three strobes with portable power... Im all for jumping ship away from Alienbees to bottom of the food chain Eli stuff... this way any and all other accessories including modifiers and triggers will always work.

Even being able to power one D-Lite4 and one D-Lite2 would be good enough for me.... you think the Vagabond II can swing that ?

JayStar86 wrote in post #11191947
Is there any other solution (not radically expensive) out there that can power two D-lites4 + one D-Lite2.

Tronix Explorer?

mickeyjuice wrote in post #11192041
Tronix Explorer?

will look into that. thx.

For anyone wondering I did some research and it looks like the latest Vagabond II can effectively power the following Elinchrom setups for sure:

Two D-Lite-IT 4's
Two 500 bxri's
Three Style RX 300's ....

so it looks like the Vagabond can succesfully power Eli strobes up to about 1000 watts.

Here is the proof and video's:

http://www.youtube.com​/watch?v=g2Pad3dTO5I

http://www.youtube.com​/watch?v=NbwoObpr6dw

http://www.youtube.com …next=1&videos=K​0dj5-DLcCw


^^^^ With this new knowledge.... I might just sell my PCB strobes and switch over... but first I need to look at the cost of Eli modifiers that I want, lol.

Hi Jay,

Be careful making assumptions. The first thing to realize is that the RX strobes are not bi-voltage so they will definitely work and you can power up to 3 or 4 600RX's without any problem.

The issue is and has been with the bi-voltage strobes such as the D-Lite's and BXRi's.

Those videos have been around for a while and as I said in my last post, there are people using two bi-voltage strobes with a Vagabond II but we're not seeing anyone going beyond that and I've seen no proof or indication that the Vagabond II can handle the added draw.

If powering that third strobe is crucial then you're either going to have to be a guinea pig (at your own risk and not covered under warranty) to find out or add another battery to power the extra strobe.

The other thing to consider is that even though the Vagabond II can power the bi-voltage strobes, it doesn't mean it's handling the bi-voltage power supply correctly and that's the real issue.

I've never seen confirmation from PCB or an engineer to indicate that the inverter in the Vagabond is handling the power correctly and we just don't know. Without that knowledge I wouldn't be so quick to power bi-voltage strobes with an inverter that isn't designed for that purpose.

The Innovatronix Explorer XT SE was deigned specifically for the bi-voltage power supply but that doesn't mean it can power multiple strobes. As a matter of fact, powering more than about 400 or 500 Watt seconds with the XT SE doesn't work, BUT the inverter is correctly handling the power.

It would be great if this were more straight forward but there are considerations when you're gearing up for location work.

Of course you can also step up to a Ranger or Ranger Quadra but even those systems will only accept two heads at once and if you need a third head you must add a second pack.

I know, there are no inexpensive solutions that are really great and as much as the Vagabond II actually looks like the clear choice, we have no indication from anyone that its a safe thing to do.

TMR Design wrote in post #11192385
Hi Jay,

Be careful making assumptions. The first thing to realize is that the RX strobes are not bi-voltage so they will definitely work and you can power up to 3 or 4 600RX's without any problem.

The issue is and has been with the bi-voltage strobes such as the D-Lite's and BXRi's.

Those videos have been around for a while and as I said in my last post, there are people using two bi-voltage strobes with a Vagabond II but we're not seeing anyone going beyond that and I've seen no proof or indication that the Vagabond II can handle the added draw.

If powering that third strobe is crucial then you're either going to have to be a guinea pig (at your own risk and not covered under warranty) to find out or add another battery to power the extra strobe.

The other thing to consider is that even though the Vagabond II can power the bi-voltage strobes, it doesn't mean it's handling the bi-voltage power supply correctly and that's the real issue.

I've never seen confirmation from PCB or an engineer to indicate that the inverter in the Vagabond is handling the power correctly and we just don't know. Without that knowledge I wouldn't be so quick to power bi-voltage strobes with an inverter that isn't designed for that purpose.

The Innovatronix Explorer XT SE was deigned specifically for the bi-voltage power supply but that doesn't mean it can power multiple strobes. As a matter of fact, powering more than about 400 or 500 Watt seconds with the XT SE doesn't work, BUT the inverter is correctly handling the power.

It would be great if this were more straight forward but there are considerations when you're gearing up for location work.

Of course you can also step up to a Ranger or Ranger Quadra but even those systems will only accept two heads at once and if you need a third head you must add a second pack.

I know, there are no inexpensive solutions that are really great and as much as the Vagabond II actually looks like the clear choice, we have no indication from anyone that its a safe thing to do.

Despite seeing the video's I knew there was a technical reason...... thanks for sharing that, Robert.

After looking into the cost of Eli modifiers... I will be staying with Alienbees.... when I can properly afford Eli modifiers and lights I will make the switch.

For now I need a third light that isn't so powerful as my AB800's..... in-fact maybe two... so i think im going to pick up two AB400's to compliment my two AB800's I have now... maybe even upgrade one AB800 to an AB1600 for outdoor shooting.

Again thanks, Robert!

JayStar86 wrote in post #11196317
After looking into the cost of Eli modifiers... I will be staying with Alienbees.... when I can properly afford Eli modifiers and lights I will make the switch.

$200-$300 isn't that expensive in the overall scheme of things, I wouldn't have thought. Especially not when you consider what you're getting.

JayStar86 wrote in post #11196317
After looking into the cost of Eli modifiers... I will be staying with Alienbees.... when I can properly afford Eli modifiers and lights I will make the switch.

i have 5 elinchrom lights and only 1 eli modifier, you can get an eli speedring for just about any modifier you desire

Jerry Kacey even has an adapter for alien bees to elinchrom, so if your worried about the cost of mods

i think there is alternatives you need to think about before you assume you need eli modifiers

mickeyjuice wrote in post #11196409
$200-$300 isn't that expensive in the overall scheme of things, I wouldn't have thought. Especially not when you consider what you're getting.

^^^ I agree, but, when you add up the cost of two or three modifiers it adds up!

FJ LOVE wrote in post #11196465
i have 5 elinchrom lights and only 1 eli modifier, you can get an eli speedring for just about any modifier you desire

Jerry Kacey even has an adapter for alien bees to elinchrom, so if your worried about the cost of mods

i think there is alternatives you need to think about before you assume you need eli modifiers

That is something I could look into I guess.... is other modifiers with Eli speedrings.... good suggestion.