help for a lighting newbie please?

Hi all,

I'm venturing into some off camera lighting. I have been mostly working with natural light and am looking for more flexibility. I have a 5D and a 430EX. I'm planning to order an AB800 and a big softbox (I mostly shoot babies and children... looking for a very simple indoor setup).
My question is.. what else do I need? I've been reading and reading and only becoming more and more confused.

I'm assuming I need a receiver and a transmitter? Yes? Do I order these from AB? Somewhere else? Which ones? Anything else?

Could someone please tell me the simplest, cheapest solution??

Forgive my ignorance. I'm a hands-on learner... I just want to get these ordered so I can start playing.
Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks very much in advance!!

Hi,

I know lighting can be a bit of a minefield at the best of times...there are just so many gadgets out there!

If you were just going to use the speedlight with your 5D then the Canon ST-E2 Infra red trigger is a great option and works nicely with the camera's ETTL readings. If you plan on wanting to trigger a separate manual flash source, such as the AB800 there are a whole load of options that i'm sure others will be better qualified to recommend than I.

Hopefully someone else can recommend a few trigger options for you. This looks like the obvious starting place though...

http://www.alienbees.c​om/cybersync.html#cst

Best of luck

The Canon ST-E2 is a waste, if you are gonna spend that much, might as well get a 580EX or 580 EX II and have more flexibility.

themadman wrote in post #9373748
The Canon ST-E2 is a waste, if you are gonna spend that much, might as well get a 580EX or 580 EX II and have more flexibility.

I've had a ST-E2 for 5 years now and found it to be a fantastic bit of kit that's been 100% reliable inside and pretty good outside (of course it's poor in sunlight conditions).

One thing that's always bugged me is having to have the flashed positioned more or less in front of the ST-E2 when outside in order to fire reliably. But it's fine inside to put them where ever you need them, even out of sight as the IR bounces off the walls easily and fires them.

I still can't believe how expensive it is to get ETTL speedlights to fire off camera. I mean it's around £250-£400 to get a simple transmitter / receiver set up, which is crazy. I think all high-end DSLR's should have radio transmitters built in to them to fire proprietary speedlights with ETTL, at least.

Back to looking for a site to hammer the credit card on again...grrrrr


PS the ST-E2 also is an amazing help when used solely as a focussing aid in really low light with the 5DMK2.

Mamato, I would wholeheartedly recommend buying another 430 (or 580 if budget allows) and an STE2. In a discussion on the STE2 last year, I posted images that I shot at 40feet using the STE2 in bright noonday sun. It works.

A couple of things to remember.
1. You do NOT need lots of power. You will be shooting relatively close and most likely not in a blacked out room. The 5d will get great (read saleable) images at 200-400 ISO if needed.
2. Two (or three) shoe-flashes (verses strobes) are much easier to transport and setup.
3. They run off AA batteries rather than large battery packs or A/C power.
4. The smaller lights will not be as frightening to children and certainly not as likely to do serious harm to them if one falls over or more likely get knocked over by a rambunctious child
5. And finally, you have the advantage of full ETTL exposure which saves setup time. Of course this assumes that you previously set the lighting ratios for your main, fill and backlight units. But once set, you can unpack and set up you lights in very short order. This is very important if you are doing location shooting. Parents don't want you taking an hour to set up and meter all your lights, background etc.

The above information is based on over 40 years of experience, lots of trial and error and learning a lot the hard way.

hmmmm... thanks for the replies, but... still confused

lifethroughalens wrote in post #9373827
...
One thing that's always bugged me is having to have the flashed positioned more or less in front of the ST-E2 when outside in order to fire reliably.

I know your pain. When I first got my STE2 I played with it and tested it till I thought I had it mastered. One weekend I was shooting a wedding, had the flash on a stand, up high and was firing away with my 70-200. Things were going great till I switched to my 17-40 and moved in for some closer shots. I didn't notice that I had walked past my stand and was now in front of the flash and unfortunately didn't notice till I uploaded the images that it had not fired on any of the shots with that lens. Needless to say, 'nuther lesson learned at the school of hard knocks. Trust me, I never did that again.

Vickie, where's the confusion? I'm sure someone on here can help you to understand.

Sorry, Hinson...I posted that last post before reading yours. I appreciate your response. More to ponder, for sure.

You have some good points... although I don't really have this in mind for transporting and setting up. My idea was to make a little home "studio" for when the weather is too cold for outdoor sessions, and just to add a little variety. Seems as though a lot of the studio work I've seen and admired has been using these AB's, which is why I thought it might be a good place to start.

Obviously there are lots of opinions, and I'm open to hearing more if anyone else is willing!!
Thanks everyone

Hinson wrote in post #9373981
I know your pain. When I first got my STE2 I played with it and tested it till I thought I had it mastered. One weekend I was shooting a wedding, had the flash on a stand, up high and was firing away with my 70-200. Things were going great till I switched to my 17-40 and moved in for some closer shots. I didn't notice that I had walked past my stand and was now in front of the flash and unfortunately didn't notice till I uploaded the images that it had not fired on any of the shots with that lens. Needless to say, 'nuther lesson learned at the school of hard knocks. Trust me, I never did that again.

@ Hinson - That made me smile, i've been in that situation many times too I have subconsciously altered my shooting style to take this into account, I think. I shot the one with the green and blue cars wider than i'd of liked and had to crop in, just to get the ST-E2 to fire the flashes!

@ Mamato - These two shots were done on a 28-70 f2.8 and a 17-40mm f4 with 2 580EX speedlights using Lastolite Ezybox diffusers and an ST-E2. I have used a similar set up for inside impromptu studio shots and there is plenty enough power there to get really creative as long as your not trying to light the whole room! It's just to show that the speedlights do have a fair amount of power and are so easy to use, but maybe you still want to go bigger and a bit more permanent?

How about a simple home studio two head kit like this?
http://www.adorama.com​/PAINT119.html

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lifethroughalens wrote in post #9374365
How about a simple home studio two head kit like this?
http://www.warehouseex​press.com …-head-studio-kit/p1029931

Yes, a setup like that would be more than sufficient but unless I was setting up a full pro-sized studio, I'd still opt for the speedlights. After lugging 3 Paul Buff WhiteLightening 1600s (and the larger stands needed to hold them) around for a number of years thinking that I needed enough power to light up a football stadium when shooting portraits I said enough is enough. I sold the 1600s and have never looked back. I'm all about ease and convenience now. (as long as it doesn't lessen the quality). Speedlights and small light stands do the job, look just as professional (looks shouldn't matter but they do) work just as good and now days, you can get all types of light modifiers for them. The only thing I miss is the modeling lights and they even have a pseudo modeling light built in to the current models.

Hinson wrote in post #9374509
Yes, a setup like that would be more than sufficient but unless I was setting up a full pro-sized studio, I'd still opt for the speedlights. After lugging 3 Paul Buff WhiteLightening 1600s (and the larger stands needed to hold them) around for a number of years thinking that I needed enough power to light up a football stadium when shooting portraits I said enough is enough. I sold the 1600s and have never looked back. I'm all about ease and convenience now. (as long as it doesn't lessen the quality). Speedlights and small light stands do the job, look just as professional (looks shouldn't matter but they do) work just as good and now days, you can get all types of light modifiers for them. The only thing I miss is the modeling lights and they even have a pseudo modeling light built in to the current models.

I totally agree with you. I changed my suggestion to a much cheaper solution available to her location - the Interfits twin head set up. But you're right, unless you're going for a semi-pro studio set up they are an overkill.

I use my 580's for 90% of my shoots and they are so easy to set up and use. I also use some modelling lights- 2 x 500W softbox lamps with diffusers for bigger jobs and hire in a twin head set when required / practically possible. I work outside quite a bit away from power sources and I need to be able to move quickly and set ip quickly so the speedlights are spot on.

Hinson's first suggestion is probably the most practical - get a second speedlight (second hand 580 EX MK1 are a good price) and the ST-E2. Good luck getting your head round it all, the best advice I was ever given was just to take lots of pictures with what you've got...master that, understand it, then go up one step instead of jumping in at the deep end right away.

If only i'd taken that advice when I bought a telescope, what a waste of money that big sucker turned out to be!