MJPhotos24 wrote in post #9894854
When did giving kickbacks become the norm? I can just imagine the first one, some bad photographer back in the day couldn't get a job to save his life so he thought this up! As a coach I understand it, good simple and already integrated fund raiser, still not a fan!
Leagues I shoot do not have this luckily, they mentioned it one year and I told them they can have it but parents are paying extra because I'd have to raise my prices - we do have a bottom line and cost of doing business to think of after all! Immediately they got rid of that idea because they didn't want the cost going onto the parents. It's common in several places but hasn't hit back home yet, hopefully never will but that's just not realistic thinking. If the leagues don't have it established I would NOT bring it up, offer free sponsor plaques instead for each team along with free 5x7 to the coaches in the photo, a lot less but still some incentive. If they do bring it up make sure they understand it's a 15% (or whatever percentage) markup in cost because you have a cost of doing business and bottom line as already mentioned.
I took a different approach. I built my pricing based on my business model then marked things up to support 15% return and use the kickback option as a marketing tool. If a league approaches me and does not ask about it, I make an extra 15% and if they do, I am covered out of the gate and only have to increase pricing if they want more. Since I do everything myself and don't have to pay assistants or others to help it lets me keep my costs pretty low anyway.
MJPhotos24 wrote in post #9894854Keeping the kids straight is easy if you have the IIn/III/IV - they absolutely love saying their name into the mic for some reason. At least the little kids do, you'll get the full name answer a lot. An assistant would be best to speed things up though as she/he can get the envelope and say the name in after you take his/her photo. With pen and paper you get one kid out of order and you're what's known as SCREWED! I used to write the photo number on the envelope but even that was annoying.
I love that feature but honestly find it still takes a lot of extra time to pull the names via audio files. In the past 18 months I have had only one instance where the order got messed up. It only effected one team since you easily see when things are out of sync and since everyone heard me stress the importance of keeping the names in order to the coach, he is the one who caught the heat from the parents. He felt so bad about it he offered to pay for the reprints that were needed. When the coach knows they are responsible for the accuracy, they really do a good job of getting things right and it eliminates me having to do any list making. For me, going this route has been the biggest overall timesaver I have implemented.
The list is also very important after the shoot for organizing and loading info to the print lab. I can quickly put the order envelopes in the same order as the photo file names. When I load their orders in order by the file names, the way my lab prints things, the prints come back to me already in the proper order so sorting and packaging is a snap. It also gives me a quick reference for doing any additional orders or reprints when needed.
The only thing I have to write by hand is a file name on the coach generated list and on the order envelope.
MJPhotos24 wrote in post #9894854Packages sell a lot better than ala carte for me. When first taking over I had to match another company and so far packages blow away all other items. Offer a bunch but packages, memory mates alone (there is a package for it), and magnets are the hot items.
Interesting how things are different in different parts of the country. The thing I found around here is that the people who bought packages still buy the same things ala carte and end up paying more because there is no volume discount and I increased total orders and sales because I picked up a lot of small orders that in the past did not happen. It decreases as they get older, but for the younger kids I average almost 90% of the kids parents buy something. (Coming from a statistics background in the corporate world, I do a lot of data analysis. Yes, I am a nerd.)
MJPhotos24 wrote in post #9894854Most important thing is produce better results than mom and dad can!
100% agree. This is what makes the difference and keeps them using you in the future. I run into the same problem with parents trying to take their own photos at the same session. I do a couple of things to make it as difficult as possible on them without being obvious that I am intentionally disadvantaging them. Outdoors I try everything I can to be shooting directly into the sun. Since I am using serious strobes, I can manage the light where their gear can't. Indoors I leave the optical triggers on my strobes turned on. Since their P&S camera sets its exposure by firing a preflash then a final flash, the preflash triggers my strobes which totally freaks out their cameras metering and leaves their actual photo underexposed to beat the band. They either think I am a photo god when they see my prints compared to theirs or quickly realize that having all the fancy gear really makes a difference and know they can't compete with it.
kb9tdj wrote in post #9894938The deeper I get into this the more I believe the adage that this kind of work is 90% business/marketing and 10% photography (or some ratio to that effect).
I disagree with this. While the business/marketing is critical to getting an initial deal, the quality photography will go a very long way to keeping the work year after year. For a lot of parents, they view these photos as required purchases and they are much happier to pay for something that is better than what they can do on their own and the more you sell, when in a kickback to the league model, the more they make and the happier they are.
kb9tdj wrote in post #9894779Thanks a lot for all of the great details; you definitely have given me some things to think about. Did you ever try just photographing the player holding their order form? Knowing my luck the forms would get out of order and I'd be screwed on identifying who was who.
I have not tried that but it is not a bad idea. As mentioned above, I have had outstanding luck with the coach make the list of names option and am very happy with how quickly it allows me to move through things.
kb9tdj wrote in post #9894779As far as the camera goes, I'm still leaning toward getting a used Mk III from Roberts, but am VERY seriously considering holding off on that for now and getting a used 300 f/2.8 lens first. I really would like to have the 300 before fall sports starts up since there is a lot of night shooting during football and soccer season. Who knows, maybe the Mk III prices will be a little lower come late summer or early fall.
However, (there's always a "however" or "but") I did get a phone call today from the sports editor at the Greenfield Reporter and it looks like I'm going to be (hopefully!) credentialed for the Indianapolis Motor Speedway for the month of May. I could really go for a second body to use up the the track, so I'm still going back and forth between the lens and body. I know....GLASS FIRST! The 300 is really the last piece of my lens puzzle that I need and would like to get that put to bed.
Any chance that the paper would let you use a body of theirs for time at the track?
Can't really argue with the notion of investing in a 300 over a second body. While having a backup/second body is always nice, so is having a killer long tele like the 300. I think you will find that hugely beneficial if you get to spend time at the track as well. I love long glass for shooting around a track.
DAVE - I realized after typing all this that I did not add your question to the post so am adding it here. I do not have a formal contract with any league I work with. I hate paperwork so avoid it whenever possible. Since I am getting paid before doing anything and gain nothing from having a contract, I don't push it and fortunately the leagues never ask for one either. Everything I do is verbal and a handshake.
WHEW!! That was a lot of typing. Hope it makes sense. 
