Everyone's a pro nowadays.

JWright wrote in post #10033847
I've been reading this whole thread with interest and felt I had to comment about this:

I disagree with the licensing of photographers and disagree with the comparison to handymen and construction workers.

If a plumber makes a mistake, the house might flood from a broken water line, or worse, explode from a botched gas line installation. If a carpenter makes a mistake the building could collapse and if an electrician makes a mistake, someone could be electrocuted.

If a photographer makes a mistake, the worst thing that's going to happen is that they might end up on Judge Joe Brown...

One of the few times Adams was wrong...

The digital revolution is still going on and will continue for quite a while. Give it several years and the market will shake itself out to the point where the photographers delivering the quality product will still be around and the rest will revert to hobby photographers.

Also, the economy has to have an effect on this as well. There's likely a large number of unemployed persons whe were hobby photographers when they had a full time job, but are now looking to use their photography as a way to make some money. As the economy improves, a lot of these will return to full employment in their chosen fields and revert to photography as a pastime.

Again Adams comments were more to protect photographers and their incomes and respectability Not saying I agree but it would certainly change the game and it would weed out a lot of the riff raf.

JWright wrote in post #10033847
I've been reading this whole thread with interest and felt I had to comment about this:

I disagree with the licensing of photographers and disagree with the comparison to handymen and construction workers.

If a plumber makes a mistake, the house might flood from a broken water line, or worse, explode from a botched gas line installation. If a carpenter makes a mistake the building could collapse and if an electrician makes a mistake, someone could be electrocuted.

If a photographer makes a mistake, the worst thing that's going to happen is that they might end up on Judge Joe Brown...

One of the few times Adams was wrong...

The digital revolution is still going on and will continue for quite a while. Give it several years and the market will shake itself out to the point where the photographers delivering the quality product will still be around and the rest will revert to hobby photographers.

Also, the economy has to have an effect on this as well. There's likely a large number of unemployed persons whe were hobby photographers when they had a full time job, but are now looking to use their photography as a way to make some money. As the economy improves, a lot of these will return to full employment in their chosen fields and revert to photography as a pastime.

I think you missed my point with about the handymen, the public became aware of unqualified inexperienced and just plain inept handymen as a result of the licensing law and the media attention it received. If you reread my post you'll see I already said that a bad photographer poses no physical threat to the buyer only an economic one.

I don't have a crystal ball so I can't make predictions about the future, I sincerely hope yours are accurate.

friz wrote in post #10034473
If they can talk someone into paying for their work, they are a pro.

Actually I agree, if they deliver professional quality work as promised they're a pro photographer. If they deliver shoddy work or no work at all they're a pro too, a professional con man.

jetcode wrote in post #10022589
most people want to escape a humdrum day job .

They can switch with me; I want one of those jobs that pays steady so I can do photo on the side like everybody else. and afford to buy those dream lenses people talk about all the time...200 2.0L, 400 2.8L, a nice jeep...

Then I can go back to just enjoying photography rather than do it because I need the $$$.

They think its an escape? Its fun, yes It is, its great...till you realize just how underpaid you are and stress about not being able to find work from month to month.

Who wants to be a professional photographer? Not me. I want to be a successful and wealthy professional photographer so I can quit shooting for cash and instead shoot what makes me happy.

there's another side to every story...

Karl Johnston wrote in post #10034658
They can switch with me; I want one of those jobs that pays steady so I can do photo on the side like everybody else. and afford to buy those dream lenses people talk about all the time...200 2.0L, 400 2.8L, a nice jeep...

Then I can go back to just enjoying photography rather than do it because I need the $$$.

They think its an escape? Its fun, yes It is, its great...till you realize just how underpaid you are and stress about not being able to find work from month to month.

Who wants to be a professional photographer? Not me. I want to be a successful and wealthy professional photographer so I can quit shooting for cash and instead shoot what makes me happy.

there's another side to every story...

Why not do both and the photography you do to feed the family if you get in the right fields can also send the kids through college, pay the mortgage and buy all those great lenses you mentioned.

some people love shooting what they shoot professionally.
alot of the best wedding photographers love doing it just to do it, and not just for the money.
the money is just a big upside. lol

airfrogusmc wrote in post #10034696
Why not do both and the photography you do to feed the family if you get in the right fields can also send the kids through college, pay the mortgage and buy all those great lenses you mentioned.

I'd love to..but theres no regular-humdrum jobs with openings

There do seem to be a lot of DSLR's these days. A lot more than used to be. Affordability is the reason.


The queen and I were at an event this weekend. Proudly displayed in the lobby area were about 25 photographs from a local pro photographer for sale. The least expensive one was $400. The wife said that I have better stuff than that, which she is supposed to say. She also said that there are better pictures on that website you go to (this one).

And she was right. I wonder how many money people (and there were quite a few in attendance) actually bought that stuff.

HoosierJoe wrote in post #10036693
There do seem to be a lot of DSLR's these days. A lot more than used to be. Affordability is the reason.


The queen and I were at an event this weekend. Proudly displayed in the lobby area were about 25 photographs from a local pro photographer for sale. The least expensive one was $400. The wife said that I have better stuff than that, which she is supposed to say. She also said that there are better pictures on that website you go to (this one).

And she was right. I wonder how many money people (and there were quite a few in attendance) actually bought that stuff.

You should spend a Saturday in NYC.. All of the tourists have at least a Rebel. The pop flashes on the subway get annoying...

Karl Johnston wrote in post #10034658
They can switch with me; I want one of those jobs that pays steady so I can do photo on the side like everybody else. and afford to buy those dream lenses people talk about all the time...200 2.0L, 400 2.8L, a nice jeep...

Then I can go back to just enjoying photography rather than do it because I need the $$$.

They think its an escape? Its fun, yes It is, its great...till you realize just how underpaid you are and stress about not being able to find work from month to month.

Who wants to be a professional photographer? Not me. I want to be a successful and wealthy professional photographer so I can quit shooting for cash and instead shoot what makes me happy.

there's another side to every story...

If you think photography pays well you ought to try making a living as a musician. I know players with dream gigs (like playing bass for Santana) who have to move to NYC to keep bread on the table. I know people with significant professional histories that rely on teaching to make ends meet because the gigs aren't there. I took a workshop once with Galen Rowell. The students were mostly doctors and lawyers and engineers because $900 for a weekend is out of reach for most working photographers who try to survive on $35k a year. The truth is that these professionals are looking for a creative escape. The hand made acoustic guitar boom was fueled by high paid professionals because most working musicians can't afford a $4500 guitar let alone a $27k guitar (same builder 10 year spread). One doctor in San Diego had at one point 110 or more high end acoustic guitars but can't play a note. It's an escape.

I knew this years ago (about music) and busted ass for a very long time to establish a career that paid well. Music and photography can pay very well but usually to a select few who not only have the talent to produce but have established a presence in the business.

breal101 wrote in post #10034616
Actually I agree, if they deliver professional quality work as promised they're a pro photographer. If they deliver shoddy work or no work at all they're a pro too, a professional con man.

Who is the idiot the con man or the one who hires the con man? Last I heard the one with the budget was calling the shots and I seriously doubt an art director is going to risk their career on a failed execution of their ideas.

Menelaus wrote in post #10038392
Not caught up on the thread, but has anyone mentioned that our very own 5D-loving Jay has caught some attention?

http://www.lightstalki​ng.com …-hear-about-in-the-future

Seems Jay (FlyingPhotog), Phamster and Karl Johnston have been singled out as 3 of the 7 Photographers we will probably hear about in the future.

Congratulations, gentlemen!

I also find that the more pro someone is, the less they feel the need to tell people that they "are a pro"

mikekelley wrote in post #10039007
I also find that the more pro someone is, the less they feel the need to tell people that they "are a pro"

It shows in there work and most full time pros don't refer to themselves that way usually.

geno.ca wrote in post #10038966
Seems Jay (FlyingPhotog), Phamster and Karl Johnston have been singled out as 3 of the 7 Photographers we will probably hear about in the future.

Congratulations, gentlemen!

Future we've already known about them here. Certainly 3 of my favs!!!