Everyone's a pro nowadays.

Go look on Facebook groups, search "Photography", scroll through for a bit, and then reply back to me


Some of them are pretty good, but there are often those along the lines of
"540 Fans
My rate is $100 an Hr. DSLRS are expensive
Canon rebel xs with 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6"
*look at their pictures, all snapshots, not even properly exposed sometimes*

forthewinwin wrote in post #10026343
Go look on Facebook groups, search "Photography", scroll through for a bit, and then reply back to me

Ok, 157,000* hits across all parts of FB. People, Groups, Pages, etc.

What exactly am I looking for?

(*Out of how many millions of total users...)

justmeagain wrote in post #10026339
this is very sad and very true indeed.

Yeah for the short term but to have longevity you need to deliver and deliver consistently. Its a smaller world out there than you might think and you really are only as good as your last job.

airfrogusmc wrote in post #10026376
Yeah for the short term but to have longevity you need to deliver and deliver consistently. Its a smaller world out there than you might think and you really are only as good as your last job.

After nearly 25 years of freelancing in the broadcast industry, I can tell you all that this is the key phrase!!!

This thread has it all. I'm impressed. Pros, shmoes, and everything in between!

argyle wrote in post #10022540
Agree, and a lot of it starts in the schools. Can't flunk Johnny because you might hurt his self-esteem (followed by Johnny most likely flunking out of college later); kids can't play dodge ball because the slow-footed would be humiliated; can't have a single valedictorian because its not fair to the person that didn't study as hard and had to settle for second. Its the "everybody's a winner mindset" that evens things out in the short run, only to leave people unprepared for reality once it sets in. Way too much enabling going on...so much so that some don't learn from their mistakes because they're not really "mistakes", so the problem gets repeated. Just look at the American Idol auditions...kids with absolutely no talent whatsoever finally face the cold reality of being told so, and the reaction is to call judges stupid. Eventually, the marketplace evens things out, no matter the calling...even photography.

amen to that, especially here in CA. The winning team still gets a trophy...in a game where they didnt even keep score!

rolex87 wrote in post #10026589
amen to that, especially here in CA. The winning team still gets a trophy...in a game where they didnt even keep score!

Our local little league goes one better...

3 Runs = 3 Outs and change sides.

There's at least one game still going on from around 1982. The kids playing now are married with kids of their own!

mikekelley wrote in post #10026494
This thread has it all. I'm impressed. Pros, shmoes, and everything in between!

You forgot Proshmoes...

A load of cr$P IMO.

Stephen King started out as an amateur. He didn't have a license. Some of the best creative people either become "professional" later in life or, in many cases, never became "professionals".

Who cares if someone buys a camera, no matter what quality, and decides to make a go of it?

this thread has grown huge.
when my initial post was just a rant about how people think they are amazing photographers just because they have DSLR. and some people just need some humility.

Again,
there's a difference between being proud of your work, and being proud of yourself.

iwasinvertedx wrote in post #10026968
this thread has grown huge.
when my initial post was just a rant about how people think they are amazing photographers just because they have DSLR. and some people just need some humility.

Again,
there's a difference between being proud of your work, and being proud of yourself.

What prodded you to rant about this?
Why do you care what other people do? If you are confident in your own abilities then what other people do should not matter one bit.

On the flip side, just b/c a "photographer" has been shooting for 30 years, doesn't mean jack. It's what you do with the time that counts. Quality over quantity. Some "old-timers" have a difficult time accepting that the learning curve has been accelerated by a HUGE amount with the advent of Digital Photography.

nicksan wrote in post #10027001
What prodded you to rant about this?
Why do you care what other people do? If you are confident in your own abilities then what other people do should not matter one bit.

On the flip side, just b/c a "photographer" has been shooting for 30 years, doesn't mean jack. It's what you do with the time that counts. Quality over quantity. Some "old-timers" have a difficult time accepting that the learning curve has been accelerated by a HUGE amount with the advent of Digital Photography.

Nick,

I'm an old timer and I agree about the camera operation but learning to see and to be able to capture that vision consistently and to be able to understand and see light still takes a lot of work no matter how much faster learning some areas have become. And there is something to be said for knowledge and experience that comes from doing something a long time.

Again if you are feeding the family with it and you've been doing it for say 30 years and you've been successful doing it you gotta be doing something right. You truly are only as good as your last job. Experience is the photographer because of that experience, can pull off the shoot even when everything around him is failing and it happens.

To the OP I think I'd hire the guy to assist me thats proud of both.

airfrogusmc wrote in post #10027082
Nick,

I'm an old timer and I agree about the camera operation but learning to see and to be able to capture that vision consistently and to be able to understand and see light still takes a lot of work no matter how much faster learning some areas have become. And there is something to be said for knowledge and experience that comes from doing something a long time.

Again if you are feeding the family with it and you've been doing it for say 30 years and you've been successful doing it you gotta be doing something right. You truly are only as good as your last job. Experience is the photographer because of that experience, can pull off the shoot even when everything around him is failing and it happens.

To the OP I think I'd hire the guy to assist me thats proud of both.

There is absolutely no substitute for quality experience. I completely agree with that. Yes, if you've been doing it for the last 30 years and making a living doing it then you are doing something right. I think a certain level of proficiency is implied however but not guaranteed. You can be mediocre and still make a living for a very long time, provided you market yourself right. Why? B/c the public at large doesn't know any better. If they did, we wouldn't have cookie cutter pop music, tabloid magazines, etc. But we do, and we'll also have people hiring mediocre photographers for whatever job that needs to be done.

Just the way it is. Ranting about it in a photography forum won't get anything done...IMO.

nicksan wrote in post #10027136
There is absolutely no substitute for quality experience. I completely agree with that. Yes, if you've been doing it for the last 30 years and making a living doing it then you are doing something right. I think a certain level of proficiency is implied however but not guaranteed. You can be mediocre and still make a living for a very long time, provided you market yourself right. Why? B/c the public at large doesn't know any better. If they did, we wouldn't have cookie cutter pop music, tabloid magazines, etc. But we do, and we'll also have people hiring mediocre photographers for whatever job that needs to be done.

Just the way it is. Ranting about it in a photography forum won't get anything done...IMO.

Yes I agree and also agree with why anyone should care if some has the cash to buy anything the want. Its nobodies biz.

I think photography is only going to become more competitive. I don't see necessarily that as a bad thing. I think a lot of the photographers that are mediocre are not going to last, at least full time, no matter how much experience one has. Marketing is only going to get you in. To have any staying power you have to give the goods. Especially in areas where you are working with other creative professionals and in areas where the lowest price is not the major concern but hiring a photographer for the way he sees is. These are the clients I want and have. The ones that understand and hire me for a job because it fits with the way I shoot.

I have started to reply to this 3 times and deleted 3 times. I just gotta say it: I agree, there are alot of very arrogant, self important artists of all kinds- it is just easier to find the photographers that aint got the chops cause their work is so easily compared to others work.
Every field of work out there has its share of people with that fake it till you make it arrogance, there is always some old age and treachery, some good old boy networks and lots of know it all experts. Photography is no different.
When I was struggling to get through school, I took all kinds of jobs. I met arrogant table busboys, self important gas station attendants, and guys that thought they were the worlds greatest school custodians. Some people just can't get any pleasure out of being good at something unless they can be the best, and some of those guys think that the only way to be the best is to tell everyone that they are the best.
It's a problem best solved by distance, as in keep walking, turn away and keep moving, or in some cases run. Whatever you do don't let it bother you, and rest assured that when skill really matters, when it's life and death, the government steps in and administers tests for your protection. Hire journeyman electricians that are licensed and bonded, get your car worked on by certified mechanics, go to a doctor that has a diploma on the wall and make sure your lawyer has passed the bar exam. But if you are hiring a wedding photographer, all you can do is look at their portfolio and if it just doesn't stand up to be as good as they think they are, keep moving. fast.
It's just like any other profession, but with apologies to all the truly great pro photographers out there that might read this, it aint exactly rocket science and it definitely isn't life and death.