I'm a bad boy... I used the Green Box today.

hairy_moth wrote in post #10118133
Okay.. I did a very quick test this morning. I turned on my camera, which was in manual, and setup to photograph in RAW. I set the ISO to 200 (too low for an inside picture in my den).

Then I flipped it to P and took a picture.
Then I flipped it to □ and took a picture.


The two shots, which were both captured in RAW, have been converted and attached. P did not change the ISO, nor did it activate the popup flash. I am sticking with my strategy: if and only if I would otherwise miss the moment, flip it to green box, point and shoot.

The argument that P is better because I can take control is void for me: if I have time to take control, I am staying in M or Av. The pictures are attached with EXIF intact (the shots certainly aren't worth looking at)

edit: I just noticed in the EXIF that P also retained my prior metering mode and exposure compensation settings from when I was last in Av and/or M.

If you've been shooting already, your popup flash will already be up if you need it and your ISO will already be in the right range. All you need to do is switch to evaluative. If there's suddenly a shot you must have, raising the camera and switching from whatever mode you're in to Auto takes the same time as it does to press the metering selection button and changing the metering mode. Switching to auto might actually take longer since you have to look at the camera and switch modes using your left hand (except on a Rebel series).

In the OP's case, he was using M and couldn't find the right exposure. All he needed to do was switch to an auto mode and use evaluative metering (or actually, he could've just used evaluative and centered the arrow). It was not some sudden opportunity where his camera was turned off or using completely different settings. Moreover, P, Av, or Tv would allow him to shoot RAW and process it as he saw fit if he got an image that he really liked.

toxic wrote in post #10127696
If you've been shooting already, your popup flash will already be up if you need it and your ISO will already be in the right range.

You missed my point completely. For example, if I was outside taking pictures of something that was backlit using Av; and now have gone inside. Unexpectedly, I see something happening (inside) that I want to get a picture of very quickly. In this case, my camera is still turned on, but my ISO will probably be at 200 and my exposure compensation is at +2.. If I start mucking around with the settings, I will miss the shot. Or, if I have my camera with me on the way somewhere.. I have no idea what my settings are from the last time I have used it, and again I see something unexpected that I want to get a picture of immediately. In this case, I don't want to take a chance on my settings. These are the situations that I am talking about.

toxic wrote in post #10127696
All you need to do is switch to evaluative. If there's suddenly a shot you must have, raising the camera and switching from whatever mode you're in to Auto takes the same time as it does to press the metering selection button and changing the metering mode.

I disagree. Changing the metering mode requires you to press one of the buttons, and watch the display while you rotate the dial. Depending on the light, that display can be hard to read. By comparison, it is very easy to see the green box next to the dial.. only one setting.

toxic wrote in post #10127696
Switching to auto might actually take longer since you have to look at the camera and switch modes using your left hand (except on a Rebel series).

Again here, you missed the point.. I am in a different shooting situation from when I last looked through the viewfinder. I am not talking about situations where I already have my eye to the viewfinder and the settings in or near to an appropriate state for the moment.

toxic wrote in post #10127696
Moreover, P, Av, or Tv would allow him to shoot RAW and process it as he saw fit if he got an image that he really liked.

On the 7D, green box does allow you to shoot raw.. As my experiment above demonstrated.

hairy_moth wrote in post #10127636
For what it's worth.. I hate the popup too (about as much as I hate green box). The biggest problem for me with P, however, (after that test) is that it retains my settings (e.g., ISO, Exposure Bias).

Most of the time when I have used green box, it is because I knew my current settings would not work... so P wouldn't help in those situations.

I see about the ISO, but I never noticed the metering affect. I guess you also have to consider if you changed the AF point, too.

hairy_moth wrote in post #10127865
You missed my point completely. For example, if I was outside taking pictures of something that was backlit using Av; and now have gone inside. Unexpectedly, I see something happening (inside) that I want to get a picture of very quickly. In this case, my camera is still turned on, but my ISO will probably be at 200 and my exposure compensation is at +2.. If I start mucking around with the settings, I will miss the shot. Or, if I have my camera with me on the way somewhere.. I have no idea what my settings are from the last time I have used it, and again I see something unexpected that I want to get a picture of immediately. In this case, I don't want to take a chance on my settings. These are the situations that I am talking about.

In the first case, I would rotate the rear dial quickly so its about 0 (i.e. I'm not counting clicks, but I know +2 is a lot of clicks from 0), press the ISO button and rotate it quickly (which will get me to 1600) and switch the metering mode to evaluative (which is one click from spot). I don't think that takes substantially more time (if at all) than bringing up my left hand and rotating the mode dial to Auto (which I don't know by clicks since I don't use it).

In the second case, sure, but I don't think I was talking about that.

If you are comfortable with your camera, you should know which button to press and which way to turn the dial to change AF mode, metering mode, ISO, etc. These are settings that are changed regularly. Switching from creative to auto modes is not usually a regular thing, and they require your other hand.

I'm not saying the camera is up to your eye. I'm saying you're already shooting, so the camera is not turned off, but you run into a completely different lighting situation.

Ok, that I didn't know, but for most cameras, Auto is Jpeg only.

Whatever.. I have already spent more time talking about green box on this thread than I have using it in the past 3 years.

I would say - whatever mode captures the event succesfully is the right mode.

I don't use green box much but I would in a push.

It is the only mode where one push is enough to capture the image.

I would probably use auto if I needed to just get the picture and there was no time to change settings, however it's a little annoying you can't choose the focus point or set it to RAW.

What's a green box ?

picard wrote in post #10128822
What's a green box ?

its the full auto mode on the dial on your camera (the dial to choose M, AV, TV, P, sport, portrait, etc. etc. etc)

I jumped to M and AV right when i got my camera a loooong time ago but i have to admit, when something has to be done really quickly and your guess work in M is still off auto mode can really save the day haha.

I have a fast moving 1 year old, and a non photographer wife. You can bet my 7D sits on the coffee table in auto mode, so we can both grab and shoot when he does something silly - day or night. Popup flash or not, auto mode or not.

Any photo is better than no photo. Use the tools on your camera and get off your high horse about how others use theirs.

pcj wrote in post #10137962
I have a fast moving 1 year old, and a non photographer wife. You can bet my 7D sits on the coffee table in auto mode, so we can both grab and shoot when he does something silly - day or night. Popup flash or not, auto mode or not.

Any photo is better than no photo. Use the tools on your camera and get off your high horse about how others use theirs.

I completely agree, don't know how many times I ended up missing the shot or getting a bad shot with my camera trying to capture the moment in M mode or one of the other semi-manual modes. I'm getting more use to either setting the camera in P or Full Auto mode when I need a very fast shot and don't have time to mess with the settings, I just wish Full Auto wasn't in Jpeg mode.