Sorority girls photo shoot

Looking for C&C on these shots as far as the editing and the quality in general. I took these for my girlfriends' daughter and her college roomates. Basically my first time doing group shots and I welcome any input. Taken with my XSi and 17-40 lens. Lighting is with my 430ex. Thanks...

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you didnt post any pics

Sorry, should be up now, lol.

They just look kind of harsh and snapshot like. Probably due to the fact you used f8 far too much.

I'm confused... what school do they go to again?

LSV wrote in post #10130521
They just look kind of harsh and snapshot like. Probably due to the fact you used f8 far too much.

i agree with this. also i dont really like the composition

First off, I think you have done well, particularly because you are not used to group photos.
You have used the sun to your advantage - or at least, not to your disadvantage.
You have all subjects looking at the camera, while trying to look their best.
You have made an attempt at staggering faces.

What, in my opinion, could be improved -
#1 - Background may have been chosen a little better - though of course - there may not have been a suitable area for the 'leap'. F/5.6 may have blurred it out a little more. 17mm is not ideal for this kind of thing, as it tends to distort. Longer FL/slightly wider aperture = less DoF.
#2 - Subjects appear 'detached'. Basically, a bit too much room between them. A couple of interferences - center girl's elbow/right hand of back left girl, hand disappearing for girl far right, as is the right leg of the center-back girl. These are little things that make a difference. F/5.6 may have worked better, as well as a longer FL.
#3 - When you shoot a group - shoot wide. You can always crop back if need be, but lost hands/extremities can't be reproduced. When shooting persons, try and crop/frame to midway between joints. If this isn't possible, include the whole limb. Use your frame right to the top - in your frame (crop?) there is far too much headroom. Finally - I see you made an effort at staggering faces - but this looks a little too contrived. Try to get your faces at differing heights, while randomising a bit more to make it look more natural.

LSV wrote in post #10130521
They just look kind of harsh and snapshot like. Probably due to the fact you used f8 far too much.

what does f8 have to do with it?

The first looks odd.did you use skin smoothing, because their faces all look off? Also the saturation is too high for me anyways.

Others are good, but I would lose all the head space above them.

CosmoKid wrote in post #10133091
what does f8 have to do with it?

f8+17mm means everything from the photographer's nose to pluto is in sharp focus. There are times when that is acceptable and even a good idea, but head on flash+that means it looks exactly like it would from a $5 disposable camera. The backgrounds are far too busy and too bland to actually work well for this type of shot, so why keep them in there?

agreed. i think once he gets the hang of how the combination of subject distance, aperture, distance from background, etc effect the image, he can make better choices.

i just didn't want him to avoid f8 for the rest of his life

The first one looks extremely like a cut and paste job, sort of like you had a blown out sky and tried to mask it back in darker. They all suffer from that cut out look to some degree. By the way, there are much more scenic places on and around campus (I can literally see bone student center and the ISU library from my apartment, I'm familiar with the area to say the least).

James Robert Gratiot wrote in post #10130653
I'm confused... what school do they go to again?

Well, thanks for looking anyway

Deckham wrote in post #10130749
First off, I think you have done well, particularly because you are not used to group photos.
You have used the sun to your advantage - or at least, not to your disadvantage.
You have all subjects looking at the camera, while trying to look their best.
You have made an attempt at staggering faces.

What, in my opinion, could be improved -
#1 - Background may have been chosen a little better - though of course - there may not have been a suitable area for the 'leap'. F/5.6 may have blurred it out a little more. 17mm is not ideal for this kind of thing, as it tends to distort. Longer FL/slightly wider aperture = less DoF.
#2 - Subjects appear 'detached'. Basically, a bit too much room between them. A couple of interferences - center girl's elbow/right hand of back left girl, hand disappearing for girl far right, as is the right leg of the center-back girl. These are little things that make a difference. F/5.6 may have worked better, as well as a longer FL.
#3 - When you shoot a group - shoot wide. You can always crop back if need be, but lost hands/extremities can't be reproduced. When shooting persons, try and crop/frame to midway between joints. If this isn't possible, include the whole limb. Use your frame right to the top - in your frame (crop?) there is far too much headroom. Finally - I see you made an effort at staggering faces - but this looks a little too contrived. Try to get your faces at differing heights, while randomising a bit more to make it look more natural.

Thank you for your input and tips I chose f/8 simply for it being the sweetspot for the lens. Figured f/4 wouldn't change DOF much if any. I started off with the 55-250mm, but the distance between the camera and subjects didn't help the flash and shots came out underexposed.

Flo wrote in post #10133176
The first looks odd.did you use skin smoothing, because their faces all look off? Also the saturation is too high for me anyways.

Others are good, but I would lose all the head space above them.

In the first photo, I did some touching up on the faces to remove glare from the flash...and since reading your critique, I've re-done the edit and am fairly happy with the results...Thank you

CosmoKid wrote in post #10133280
agreed. i think once he gets the hang of how the combination of subject distance, aperture, distance from background, etc effect the image, he can make better choices.

i just didn't want him to avoid f8 for the rest of his life

You are right on Cosmo...I have a lot to learn when it comes to this type of photography. I mostly shoot wildlife and landscape. Portrait and group shots are a whole different animal .

griptape wrote in post #10135409
The first one looks extremely like a cut and paste job, sort of like you had a blown out sky and tried to mask it back in darker. They all suffer from that cut out look to some degree. By the way, there are much more scenic places on and around campus (I can literally see bone student center and the ISU library from my apartment, I'm familiar with the area to say the least).

My girlfriend agrees with you on the cut and paste look, lol. Would love to see someone do an edit so I can get an idea on how to make the shots not look "cut and pasted".

First off, that's pretty good for a first attempt. You do have quite a lot of headroom in all of those photos though...

I would ease up on the blacks in #1, they're a little crushed. Also, the background you chose is really busy.
#2 is the best of the series, but the smiles look a bit forced.
#3 seems to have forced smiles as well, and don't be afraid to play with a different aspect ratio to get rid of all that headroom.

Also...the curved wall in #1 makes your photo look more distorted than it is. If you shot it head on with the bell in the dead center of them it would have been much better. Faster SS couldn't have hurt, either (if your flash could pull it off at 1/1 in HSS).

F/4 makes a big difference
Though - maybe more than you want.
Don't concern overly about 'sweet spots'. That's just tech-forum obsessions not worth worrying about - (pssst - especially since you have touched the photos up... )
Regarding your FL - I shoot at 200mm daily - widen your aperture or raise your ISO.