Examples of Group Shots in low light?

I have been working on my skills for doing low light pictures with large groups (weddings and anniversary parties so far) and have had some success. I feel like I could do still do better as the pictures don't seem as sharp as I think they could be, so I was wondering if some of you with lots of experience could post some examples of group shots in low light conditions (high iso, low shutter speeds, and reasonable DOF)? I am just looking to confirm the sharpness, noise, etc. that I should be expecting.

Thanks,
Erin

Hello there Erin .

What kind of camera are you using and are you using flash at all? The simple anwer is that it is very difficult to create a high quality image under the conditions you describe. Low light, high ISO, poor quality light will result in flat, low contrast, unattractive images. The other problem is you will often have to deal with "ugly" lighting. These includes down spots, and pools of lamp or other artificial light that will often cause very unflattering eye shadows and other characteristics that will be difficult or impossible to correct in PP.

You really need flash for quality group images.

How I tackle group shots in low light - like at weddings and other social events - is I ALWAYS use flash for my best results. I set the camera on MANUAL, use an ISO of 400 or 800, place my (external) flash on AUTO, and then select shutter speed of 1/30 - 1/60 with aperture of f/5.6 - f/8 depending upon how much ambient light you want included in the scene. - Stu

The reality is that if I'm facing a circumstance of shooting a large group in low light conditions, I'm using flash and probably multiple flashes. You can do what you're describing, but it the group is large enough to need to be mutiple rows, you'll need a smaller aperature of maybe 5.6-8 which means you'll need shutter speeds that not only necesitate a tripod, but very still subjects.

I have done pictures with both a 40D and my new 5DMII.

The first shot was from my 40D with 24-70L Lens (I think) - Settings were F2.8 (major problem I know), ISO 800, 1/60, and my 580 EXII Flash set to auto on a flash bracket.

The second shot was from my 5DMII (new) with 24-70L Lens - Settings were F 4.5, ISO 1600, 1/60, and my 580 EXII Flash set to auto on a flash bracket. With a terrible background as they didn't really want to get the pictures taken.


Thanks for your help!

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The second shot is an example of "ugly" light. I know - I've done the same thing.

Problem is IMO, that when you use flash with really high ISO, the really run the risk of the ambient light overpowering the meager "splash" of flash light. And that's exactly what happened here. The ambient ceiling and other lights are causing some ugly eye and chin/neck shadows. This is why I am typically down around ISO 800 and f/6.3 or thereabouts. This causes more "flash light" in the face - although NOT the nuke effect - but enough to eliminate or minimize those ugly shadows.

Since I was already at ISO 1600/f4.5/ 1/60 wouldn't moving to the settings you stated would make it significantly underexposed? As I would be losing ~3 stops of light. Are you using additional OCF to compensate?

"This is why I am typically down around ISO 800 and f/6.3 or thereabouts. "

Actually no. Your second shot is very typical of a lot of my event work - PR receptions, banquets in dark halls, weddings, etc. I am letting my 580ex "fill in" what's needed. It will properly expose for the foreground..that is, the people.

For this particular shot I would have used ISO 800, 1/40 second and f/6.3 for a modest DOF.

The 1/40 would have been "dragging" enough to allow background ambient light to creep in, and the f/6.3 would have given be a good range of sharpness, edge to edge, for all those people. I am only using the one 580ex, and it is throwing out enough light for the people in the foreground. The background will in fact be slightly darker, but I don't care as that is not the important element in the image. Does this all make sense?

ekrizo wrote in post #10209125
Since I was already at ISO 1600/f4.5/ 1/60 wouldn't moving to the settings you stated would make it significantly underexposed? As I would be losing ~3 stops of light. Are you using additional OCF to compensate?

"This is why I am typically down around ISO 800 and f/6.3 or thereabouts. "

ekrizo wrote in post #10208789
(high iso, low shutter speeds, and reasonable DOF)? I am just looking to confirm the sharpness, noise, etc. that I should be expecting.

This almost seems an impossible task with an ordinary speedlite, "in low light". DOF will really challenge you especially if you're shooting wide open. I've taken photos in reasonable light to find that the back row or the person closest is not in clear view. Shutter speeds - it's amazing that even 1/60th sec can even blurr someone seemingly quiet still even with IS. I'd avoid group shots in low light with high ISO. If you must I'd aim for a mid range aperture, high iso, IS, 1/60th sec and TWO speedlites, one triggered remotely - and take a few! Noise software may also help.

Good luck!

highway

That 2nd shot is really not bad given the casual setting of the scene.

I can't tell what color that ceiling is but I think by mounting one of those those cheap omnibounce diffusers on your flash head and aimed at 30-40 degrees would have:

1.) Provided much softer frontal minimizing those shadows and...
2.) Provided some more ambient light behind the group.

When using direct flash at this range in low light, your back lighting will only be blocked by the subjects you're shooting.

And that 5D could've handled 1600 ISO quite easily, thus increasing some of that ambient.

sapearl wrote in post #10209178
Actually no. Your second shot is very typical of a lot of my event work - PR receptions, banquets in dark halls, weddings, etc. I am letting my 580ex "fill in" what's needed. It will properly expose for the foreground..that is, the people.

For this particular shot I would have used ISO 800, 1/40 second and f/6.3 for a modest DOF.

The 1/40 would have been "dragging" enough to allow background ambient light to creep in, and the f/6.3 would have given be a good range of sharpness, edge to edge, for all those people. I am only using the one 580ex, and it is throwing out enough light for the people in the foreground. The background will in fact be slightly darker, but I don't care as that is not the important element in the image. Does this all make sense?

Digital...go figure. I would have been at 400 or 500 ISO, f/5.0 and hand held at 1/30th
Remember when shooting medium format? 1/30th f/5.6 400 asa with a bounce card above my Metz 45CT-4. Somehow it seemed so much easier!!

Got that right Paul . Those old Metz potato mashers were quite some weapons. I actually used the CT-5 for a while with that wonderful little fill strobe right under the main head. It was great for totally eliminating those ugly eye and neck shadows.

images by Paul wrote in post #10209637
Digital...go figure. I would have been at 400 or 500 ISO, f/5.0 and hand held at 1/30th
Remember when shooting medium format? 1/30th f/5.6 400 asa with a bounce card above my Metz 45CT-4. Somehow it seemed so much easier!!

sapearl wrote in post #10209742
Got that right Paul . Those old Metz potato mashers were quite some weapons. I actually used the CT-5 for a while with that wonderful little fill strobe right under the main head. It was great for totally eliminating those ugly eye and neck shadows.

Yup and if was a big group where I needed to move back (remember 80mm w/no zoom!!) I went to my CT 60 beast! I loved medium format and the latitude that film gave you. But I also remember the shoulder battery pak that must have weighed four pounds on my shoulder all damn day!!

Erin, here's an example from a wedding I did a little while ago. No PP was done to this proof other than global RAW adjustments:

http://www.pbase.com/s​apearl/image/102290692

I used 1/25 sec, f/5.6, ISO 800 and the single 580ex bounced, with the little white card extended. Had they ordered this as an album print or additional enlargement I may have done some additional minor post. Otherwise I was very happy with this casual group exposure.

sapearl wrote in post #10210060
Erin, here's an example from a wedding I did a little while ago. No PP was done to this proof other than global RAW adjustments:

http://www.pbase.com/s​apearl/image/102290692

I used 1/25 sec, f/5.6, ISO 800 and the single 580ex bounced, with the little white card extended. Had they ordered this as an album print or additional enlargement I may have done some additional minor post. Otherwise I was very happy with this casual group exposure.

hi sapearl
i was looking thru your gallery and noticed all the pictures said no flash used
obviously you used for the night shots but what about your daytime shots? do you prefer not to use flash for fill

ekrizo wrote in post #10208789
I have been working on my skills for doing low light pictures with large groups (weddings and anniversary parties so far) and have had some success. I feel like I could do still do better as the pictures don't seem as sharp as I think they could be, so I was wondering if some of you with lots of experience could post some examples of group shots in low light conditions (high iso, low shutter speeds, and reasonable DOF)? I am just looking to confirm the sharpness, noise, etc. that I should be expecting.

Thanks,
Erin

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