Are Uploaded Print Dimensions Supposed To Print At Exactly Those Dimensions?

I just had my first experience at having to frame an 18"x24" printed image, but things didn't turn out as trouble-free as I thought it should, which leads me to ask the question (since I don't have prior experience with this type of thing) whether uploaded print dimensions are actually supposed to print at the dimensions indicated in the file, or will there always be some tolerance?

Here's the story:

I understand that there are standard print sizes and that if I have an odd print size (which is the case here), I need to choose the next largest size up that will incorporate the needed print size. In this case, I prepared a black-and-white image in Photoshop that was EXACTLY 18"x24" in landscape orientation. I then extended the canvas to 20"x30" and typed "Please Trim White Border" into the white margin. As per Mpix's online instructions, I saved the file as a .jpg at 250dpi. I double-checked everything, uploaded the file and ordered it so that it would be printed on their dedicated black-and-white printers. The idea was to receive this print and insert it into a nice wooden frame that my wife and I had purchased as a house-warming present for some close friends of ours. Unfortunately, things did not go as planned.

Upon receiving the print, I tried to insert it into the frame, but it was a little too wide and a little too long. The trimmed print they had sent to me actually measured 18 3/8" x 24 1/4". Figuring I had done something wrong (due to my inexperience), I opened the file and double-checked my measurements. Everything checked out, again, but I still thought I had made a mistake somewhere. Not being in any particular hurry, I sent an e-mail to Mpix's customer service explaining what had transpired and waited for a response.

The next day, I received a reply indicating that what they had printed for me was actually what I had uploaded to them. Included in their e-mail were screenshots of my file on their computer showing exactly what I had on my computer. Huh? Here's where my head began to hurt. Their explanation said the opposite of what their screenshots were showing. Again, not having any experience with this type of thing, I was still second-guessing myself, but I couldn't understand their contradicting e-mail, either. I proceeded to send them another e-mail asking them to re-verify what they had sent to me as an explanation because it looked like their words were contradicting their screenshots. Two days later, I received an apology for their mistake and an offer to reprint and ship my print at no cost. I have to admit that I was feeling pretty good after reading their second e-mail. This confirmed that the error was not mine, so although I had originally thought that I had somehow made a newbie mistake, I actually hadn't. Whew!

Normally, this is where I would have chalked this whole thing up to a production mistake on Mpix's behalf and moved on.....but, then I received their "corrected" reprint. This time, the print came sized at 18"x24 3/16".

At this point, I'm not going to go through this whole back-and-forth exercise with Mpix anymore and I'm just going to carefully attempt to trim some of the print so that it fits correctly into the frame, but I'm still left with the question of why this happened again?

Am I to expect this sort of issue when sending files to printing companies or did Mpix just have something wrong set up on their black-and-white printer?

Common sense tells me that if you have a frame of a certain dimension and need a print of that dimension to fit correctly inside of that frame, you should be able to upload a print in that dimension to a printing company and that's exactly what one should expect to receive, right?

Am I expecting too much or is this tolerance a normal occurrence?

Thank you in advance for any insight that you seasoned professionals may have on this issue.

it does sound like a tolerance issue, even if 3/8" is more than i would expect. there is a 20x24 option at mpix. the standard sized prints (at least small ones) are at much tighter tolerance. so starting with 20x24 and asking them to trim only long sides might have helped...??

It's more than likely their paper sizes are a little big.

ISO paper sizes have a tolerance of:
±1.5 mm (0.06 in) for dimensions up to 150 mm (5.9 in),
±2 mm (0.08 in) for lengths in the range 150 to 600 mm (5.9 to 23.6 in) and
±3 mm (0.12 in) for any dimension above 600 mm (23.6 in).

The lab I use here in the UK also supplies prints that are slightly too big. I have a Rotatrim cutter for correcting the size.

Sally and Hank, thank you for your suggestions. Next time, I'll just assume that some sort of trimming will be required on my end. I have a Fiskars rotary trimmer, but not one that will accept this size of print. I used a straight edge and carefully ran a blade on the edge of the print and was able to successfully trim the excess. After everything I've been through, the whole exercise just seemed redundant, in my opinion.

Thanks again to the both of you for your input!

Mass production labs routinely enlarge every image by about 3-5% to compensate for shifting of the paper roll and resultant misalignments in the printer and cutting machines.

tzalman, thank you for this observation. Although image enlargement may be a necessary practice in order to compensate for the things you've noted, this doesn't help the overall need of ordering and receiving the exact size of print for a particular project. In my opinion, something is seriously wrong with the print ordering/print printing process.

PicSniper wrote in post #10434797
tzalman, thank you for this observation. Although image enlargement may be a necessary practice in order to compensate for the things you've noted, this doesn't help the overall need of ordering and receiving the exact size of print for a particular project. In my opinion, something is seriously wrong with the print ordering/print printing process.

Volume doesn't allow each photo to be printed and cut to exacting dimensions. If you need precision, you gotta do it yourself and spend the (relatively significant) time on it. Or find a lab that hand-cuts with X-acto knives. Just don't complain that such a lab charges significantly more dough.


You know that triangle?

       Price

Speed     Quality

Thank you for your observation. I'm well aware of the relationship between price and quality, although I'm a believer that sometimes you can get better quality items for less expense than the leading brands, but that's a whole different argument.

In my case, speed was not an issue, so this was not a factor I considered when getting this image printed. As my wife usually does with her prints, I could have easily had this printed at Costco or Wal-Mart, but decided to use Mpix's true black-and-white printing service and spend whatever it took to get this gift done as properly as possible. In other words, quality was what I wanted and I didn't mind spending the extra money to get it. Let me clarify that Mpix did a great job printing, packaging and shipping my print. I was just expecting it to get to me in the dimensions that I had uploaded, hence my post.

The replies I have received here have confirmed what I really never imagined would be the case. If I ever send another image to be printed in an exact size for a frame, I will expect to have some "post processing" trimming to do.

Ok, so now I'M confused. If your customer is printing from what you have given them, is the sizing that I create going to be a problem for them? Can someone please explain to me what I need to do to size photos prior to giving them to the customer?

fallenangelmc666 wrote in post #10446120
Ok, so now I'M confused. If your customer is printing from what you have given them, is the sizing that I create going to be a problem for them? Can someone please explain to me what I need to do to size photos prior to giving them to the customer?

Crop (or shoot) a little looser.

tzalman wrote in post #10449274
Crop (or shoot) a little looser.

And I never crop to fit a frame. Crop the shot as it should be cropped to make the subject look it's best, & then use a mat to cover the "excess" space.
https://photography-on-the.net …php?p=970537&po​stcount=17

PicSniper wrote in post #10434797
tzalman, thank you for this observation. Although image enlargement may be a necessary practice in order to compensate for the things you've noted, this doesn't help the overall need of ordering and receiving the exact size of print for a particular project. In my opinion, something is seriously wrong with the print ordering/print printing process.

One option you may have is to ask MPix if they can give you the "real" image dimensions the printer needs, including the margins to prevent the "zoom" effect you might get what you want.

Costco (via DryCreekPhoto) has precise image dimensions (in pixels) that allow for printing without manipulation/zooming. For example, my local store has a 300dpi Noritsu. If you upload a 4x6 (that would normally be 1200x1800) as a 1228x1842 image the machine will not scale it at all.

They don't guarantee precisely where the "extra" pixels will fall off, but you can be sure of the size.

I've actually done this with passport and other ID photos that need to be a specific size.

mbellot, thank you for the suggestion. After giving your suggestion some thought, though, I applied your idea to my experience with Mpix and am even more confused now because they took my original file (with proper dimensions) and printed it twice, but they yielded two different print dimensions. Assuming they used the same dedicated black-and-white printer, how did their two prints turn out with different dimensions with the same file? Did they alter my file somehow before printing?

In other words, (as an example) if they told me to use exact dimensions for 20"x30" at 250dpi, I would have (and actually did) upload a canvas-sized file of 5,000x7,500. They, in turn, printed out two different prints with two different dimensions using the same file I had uploaded.

Taking this into consideration, even if they gave me an exact pixel dimension to use which would equate to the correct and desired print dimensions on their printer, the fact that they produced two prints in different dimensions would suggest that there is the possibility that this wouldn't work, unless they somehow altered my file during one of the printing attempts or used a different black-and-white printer for one of the printing attempts.

I have accepted the fact that whatever I upload in the future will not be what I receive, based upon the observations of fellow POTN'ers that have "been there and done that" many times over. In the case of this particular print, I was able to carefully trim one edge of the print and make it work within the frame we had purchased, but what if I would have placed a symmetrical border around my image and wanted to have it printed this way? What then? If I would have received a larger print and trimmed off one or more edges in order to make it fit to the frame's dimensions, my symmetrical border would have lost its symmetry, right?

There just has to be a better way! Precision is something that surrounds us every day, but yet there is no easy way to just upload a file of L"xW" to a photo lab and have it come back to you as L"xW"? In this day and age, I just don't get it...

Possibly a stupid question, but were the prints truly two different sizes, or were they trimmed differently? i.e. did the one you received second just have more trimmed off by MPIX?

I went and looked through a number of MPIX prints I have around, and the smaller ones such as 8x12 were all precisely 8" x 12", whereas a 16x20 was actually 15 7/8" x 19 7/8".

Similar to your method, I always size my prints precisely then add white canvas around it to reach my final print size, but I leave the white border on for hinging to foamcore, and cover it up with a mat.

PicSniper wrote in post #10456014
mbellot, thank you for the suggestion. After giving your suggestion some thought, though, I applied your idea to my experience with Mpix and am even more confused now because they took my original file (with proper dimensions) and printed it twice, but they yielded two different print dimensions. Assuming they used the same dedicated black-and-white printer, how did their two prints turn out with different dimensions with the same file? Did they alter my file somehow before printing?

That is the only logical conclusion, but it's still only an assumption until someone who works for Mpix confirms it.

I can only guess that they actually have more than one b&w machine (likely for a high volume company) and the prints were produced on two different printers with slightly different enlargement settings.