Ferrarigate part 2

Ferrari managed to turn a very successful 1 - 2 finish at the German GP into a total media disaster, didn't they. What is it they don't understand about the media, who will rightly milk this for everything they can get from it?

How absolutely stupid, having lucked into first and second places at turn 1, they had absolutely no need to have done anything. I hope the FIA throw the book at them. The problem with that is Jon Todt, who is the person probably responsible for the 1982 version!

To say that neither Massa or his engineer are exactly pleased with the decision would be an understatement.

Right, what would be a reasonable punishment? Strip the team of this weeks results, maybe ban them from two more events as well? Oh, and sack Domenicalli.

*Later edit: According to the news, they have been fined £100,000! Chicken feed. Thats just like saying "naughty boys". It's either legal, in which case the rules need changing, or it's not (and the rules presently say its not) and they should be properly punished.

$100K is the maximum "on the spot" fine that the Stewards can impose.

It has also been referred to the World Motorsport Council for "further consideration".

$100K is loose change to Ferrari. They should be stripped of the positions/points and lose 5 places in the next race.

Ferrari have always assumed they run F1, not the FIA and have had "special" treatment for many years. Unless they are severely punished they will simply go back to their old cheating ways and F1 will suffer as a result.

WIth Todt's hand on the F1 steering wheel I doubt we will see justice.

KennyG wrote in post #10601591
$100K is loose change to Ferrari. They should be stripped of the positions/points and lose 5 places in the next race.

Ferrari have always assumed they run F1, not the FIA and have had "special" treatment for many years. Unless they are severely punished they will simply go back to their old cheating ways and F1 will suffer as a result.

WIth Todt's hand on the F1 steering wheel I doubt we will see justice.

Nail on the head!!

I know we will will never see justice. It would have been nice to see Todt as poacher tuernd gamekeeper, but its never going to happen.

So expect to see other teams openly doing the same in the near future. Until yesterday at least it was done discretely, but Ferrari don't seem to understand the word.

Actually this is Ferrarigate part 3, not 2. I'd forgotten an ocassion at the AI Ring when Eddy Irvine was told to have a "braking problem" so Schuie could catch up half a lap and overtake to take the win.

If the FIA do nothing, what price flaunting other rules?

Either the rules apply or they don't. I think it'll be interesting to see how it turns out. Maybe the teams can just pay up-front for rules infingments, 100k for issuing team orders, 50k for every 1kg under-weight, 200k to run an extra qualifying lap after the checker has dropped...

What a crock!!

Ferrari have ruined a great race where Alonso went unpunished for a crap start and ends up with big smug grin on his mug knowing that his contract is better than Filipe. Massa and the paying public have been ripped off. The sponsors can only stand around and look at their shoes instead of celebrating a great victory.

Maybe its the sponsors who need to understand the damage been caused by this. Because thats were the real muscle lies. Forget Jon Todt, he was the choice of the last incumbant and look at the mess he created.

The Sponsors don't care. Alonso can't do any wrong in the eyes of Santander and the Spanish fans and Phillip Morris (Marlboro) were there right through the *cheating* Schumacher years.

Just posted on f1.com
"Following their controversial one-two result at the German Grand Prix, Ferrari have been fined US$100,000 by the FIA after race stewards deemed they had breached sporting regulations and the case has been referred to the World Motor Sport Council".

Ken you are spot on, small change to them...........

Richard Brewer wrote in post #10606798
Just posted on f1.com
"Following their controversial one-two result at the German Grand Prix, Ferrari have been fined US$100,000 by the FIA after race stewards deemed they had breached sporting regulations and the case has been referred to the World Motor Sport Council".

Ken you are spot on, small change to them...........

That's at least 24 hours old.

I'll say it again, the Stewards can not impose a higher financial penalty. Breaches of the Sporting Regs and Disrepute charges can only be dealt with by the WMSC. Small change it may be, but those are the facts.

Guys, I am Italian and i am a ferrari fan since I was 1... I have found it it disgusting even because i put a bet on massa to win the race at 12/1... So very upsetting... That said I think it is part of formula 1 and there is not much that people can do... Jenson save the tires or lewis save the petrol has the same meaning otherwise you will get a Vettel - Webber situation ...

In regards of the fine 100 K for ferrari its like fill up the tank of my car for me... Nothing.

I don't think anything else will happen specially after that mclaren had the all ferrari books and setting of the car... Unfortunately the F1 without Ferrari is nothing and without the Mclaren loose another 50% of the interest...

Therefore a little slap and everyone is happy...

That said i am taking them to court for my bet... hahahhaha...

Bernardo wrote in post #10609522
... Unfortunately the F1 without Ferrari is nothing...

Nothing but fair and sporting would be a travesty of justice.

I say throw the book at them like they seem to like to throw it at McLaren.

Bernardo wrote in post #10609522
Unfortunately the F1 without Ferrari is nothing

F1 with Ferrari is a laughing stock.

As Luca Di Montezemolo has explained, both drivers are employed by the team. They do what's best for the team. On Sunday, what was best for the team was that Felipe let Alonso past him, because Alonso really was a lot quicker. As Vettel said when asked in the post-race interview, "Yeah, maybe they should have crashed?" It's best for the team to have the quicker driver in front, and there's no sense in letting the two cars race for P1 and risk a Red Bull situation where they touch and both end up out of the points.

If you feel bad for Felipe, remember that he was the beneficiary of team orders when he was fighting for the championship with Hamilton, and Ferrari rigged Kimi's pit stop so that Felipe could jump him on track. It happens. Teams favor the driver who has the best chance to with the championship, and this year that driver is Alonso. Felipe is not a contender for that championship, so the best scenario for Ferrari to secure the most points for both championships is P1 Alonso, P2 Felipe, so that's what they did. If you don't like it, watch something else.

To everyone who complains constantly every time the FIA decides not to ban Ferrari from competition for life and strike every evidence of their existence from the record books, you may recall that McLaren have clearly displayed team orders to their drivers as well, multiple times (Coulthard/Hakkinen in 97 and again in 98, and Hamilton/Alonso in 07). Team orders exist in the sport for a reason, and I think the only thing wrong is the rule itself. Get rid of the rule and let teams manage their drivers how they feel it will benefit the team the most.

h0rde wrote in post #10612314
stuff

Rule 39.1 of the F1 Sporting Regulations.

“Team orders which interfere with a race result are prohibited”. That is as clear as it can possibly be. Ferrari are the team responsible for the creation of the rule (Schumacher / Barrichello, Austria 2002) yet they have publically flouted it.

The fact that other teams have used orders is as irrelevant as arguing with a Cop that the car in front was driving as fast as you but only you got stopped. 2 wrongs do not make a right.

The Stewards, having full access to the radio transmissions, lap times etc clearly feel there is a case to answer, but it is beyond their remit to deal with it.

Over to the World Council, with Captain Todt & First Mate Ecclestone at the helm....oh, hang on...