How do you compete with this?

tjames wrote in post #11173815
You don't compete with this.. at least if you want to stay in business. I can tell you right off the bat that if clients are referring to cheaper photographers you're not providing anything of value for them to use you OR you are targeting the wrong market altogether.

i completely agree with this one.

i read something before and it said "cheap clients refer their cheap friends. expensive clients refer their expensive friends."

I think the bigger issue is that it's becoming easier for the hobbyist to afford / obtain the same type equipment that a full time professional would use. It seems everyday you see a new "photographer" popping up on Facebook producing awesome quality images, and they taught themselves the whole deal from start to finish. It's coming to a point where if you can get the same quality from the hobbyist doing it for nothing, what's the point in spending the money for the professional? Add to it the nationwide economic situation and you have your obvious answer.

nathank wrote in post #11260105
I think the bigger issue is that it's becoming easier for the hobbyist to afford / obtain the same type equipment that a full time professional would use. It seems everyday you see a new "photographer" popping up on Facebook producing awesome quality images, and they taught themselves the whole deal from start to finish. It's coming to a point where if you can get the same quality from the hobbyist doing it for nothing, what's the point in spending the money for the professional? Add to it the nationwide economic situation and you have your obvious answer.

The folks producing awesome quality had to put in the time and effort to learn what it takes to produce that awesome quality. They have as much "right" to charge for their services all they want, or do it free. Most of the time if they start out free they don't keep at it because it becomes a real job sooner rather than later. At that point guess what? Hey they're professionals too!

See how that works?

No one really works free. When it's fun it can be free and no big deal. When you start to get real expenses that you wouldn't otherwise have (oops! my hard drive isn't big enough. oops! I need more memory cards. oops! A camera died during a session and needs repaired/replaced etc etc) or hassles you wouldn't otherwise have (oops! She thinks she looks fat and needs you to liquify all the shots. oops! She's not happy with ANY of the photos and is demanding a reshoot even though it's a full tank of gas to get there and back and you really don't have time because you're already booked for 30 more cheap/free sessions etc etc) you start to realize "OMG this is a pain in the ass! I need financial compensation that at least makes it worth while!"

It's kinda like grilling for a party in your back yard. Cooking a couple burgers ain't such a big deal and you're with close friends & family so you're glad to helm the CookMate and front the cost of it all. Then the neighbors show up uninvited. Then they invite their friends. Their friends invite their friends. Soon you have 250 people you don't even know expecting a free meal. You can't even sit down to enjoy your own party because you're suddenly a full time fry cook...and financing the privilege.

Just had a friend who hired a photographer like this because we were out of state and couldnt shoot her photos she needed.

I laughed and cringed at the same time when she told me they gave her a CD with 500 photos on it and I asked if I could look at them.

The silly phootgrapher basically gave her every photo straight out of the camera...blurry ones and all?? What a total dork. I mean of the 500 some odd shots, about 100 of them were so blurry, any normal photographer in their right mind would have deleted them on the camera and NEVER burned them to disc.

Cracks me up to see people paying for work like that

cdifoto wrote in post #11260280
The folks producing awesome quality had to put in the time and effort to learn what it takes to produce that awesome quality. They have as much "right" to charge for their services all they want, or do it free. Most of the time if they start out free they don't keep at it because it becomes a real job sooner rather than later. At that point guess what? Hey they're professionals too!

See how that works?

No one really works free. When it's fun it can be free and no big deal. When you start to get real expenses that you wouldn't otherwise have (oops! my hard drive isn't big enough. oops! I need more memory cards. oops! A camera died during a session and needs repaired/replaced etc etc) or hassles you wouldn't otherwise have (oops! She thinks she looks fat and needs you to liquify all the shots. oops! She's not happy with ANY of the photos and is demanding a reshoot even though it's a full tank of gas to get there and back and you really don't have time because you're already booked for 30 more cheap/free sessions etc etc) you start to realize "OMG this is a pain in the ass! I need financial compensation that at least makes it worth while!"

It's kinda like grilling for a party in your back yard. Cooking a couple burgers ain't such a big deal and you're with close friends & family so you're glad to helm the CookMate and front the cost of it all. Then the neighbors show up uninvited. Then they invite their friends. Their friends invite their friends. Soon you have 250 people you don't even know expecting a free meal. You can't even sit down to enjoy your own party because you're suddenly a full time fry cook...and financing the privilege.

Very well stated.

If you can't Dazzle them with Quality, baffle them with bullchips.

Reminds me of Jeff Dunham and Peanut. Peanut,, WTH!! Were yaaoouu thinking.

Byte size: ZERO | Content warning: NOT AN IMAGE

nathank wrote in post #11260105
I think the bigger issue is that it's becoming easier for the hobbyist to afford / obtain the same type equipment that a full time professional would use. It seems everyday you see a new "photographer" popping up on Facebook producing awesome quality images, and they taught themselves the whole deal from start to finish. It's coming to a point where if you can get the same quality from the hobbyist doing it for nothing, what's the point in spending the money for the professional? Add to it the nationwide economic situation and you have your obvious answer.

You obviously get it.

I get that you all take pride in your work. There's nothing wrong with that. You should be proud of your work. However if you want to keep your business running, you can't be so arrogant or ignorant that you ignore the fact that someone else has figured out how do what you do and is willing to do it for less. People do not care how long you've been around if they see that Joe's Photography Shack can do the same thing for less. Keep in mind I'm assuming the potential client is reviewing both portfolios.

It's not rocket science. You have two options. 1. Figure out a way to cut your operating expenses, i.e. your pride. 2. Refine your marketing skills to justify the higher expense. Based on the responses I've seen, I don't know which option will be the biggest hurdle. Joe's Photography Shack will get the business each and every time until you make the jump. You can say "I'm better because I have X years of experience, therefore I must charge more" all you want, but if the client is happy with the end result and Joe's Photography Shack is willing to undercut you, who won in the business sense? It's pretty obvious.

I was a full time web developer from 2000 to 2002. The company I worked for charged $150 an hour for development, $100 per month for hosting, and $75 a month for up to 5 updates, and $100 for a domain name. Roll the calendar a few years forward... You can get a domain name from an unnamed place for $8 a year, you can buy a NICE template for $20 to $50, and pay $60 for an entire year of hosting with all kinds of free stuff included. Does that mean that the domain name, design or hosting package you can purchase is sub-par? Absolutely not. It means that someone else figured out how to do it cheaper and is willing to do it cheaper. Again, who is actually winning?

I am, cause the more the so called want to bee's provid there prints, the more some look elsewhere, in search of a white wedding dress that has detail in it, not just white. Photographs where there eyes don't look like dark dead spots, hair that is in it's place. The list goes on and on.

Saddly everyone thinks the wedding market is the place to be!
If you do not approach each and every photoshoot like everything rides on it's outcome, you are not giving the client what they deserve.

Your sorely mistaking if you think the budding hobbyist is hurting the professionals.
It is quite the opposite.

Those that try, justify what and how they do by the word trying.

Those that can have already justified there work by doing. There is a point when it's not about the money but, ability.

Those who evolve around it being the money first, started out last and are hard pressed to catch up.
Let them seek out approval where they can, justified by who will acknowledge them and comfort there cause.

You can type about it till your blue in text and it will never change.
To argue over it really does make good starting script for a comedy hour.
Debating will never change it.
The hobbyist does a great service in showing what nice work looks like.
The pro shows off a bit of work, my the hobbyists are nice but , can you take mine for me? Yours are so, they look so real.

Now I know this is gonna chap a few but ahh, those that know how will not even flinch about it.
The ones that will flench and do there best to rebuke it are the ones, trying to justify there own version of not quite there yet, how dare they try to put me down. In fact the only mindset that puts them down is there own.

Welcome to the WWW Stop Down, today's bout will be over such and such, in the far corner we have In the corner here we have let the games begin, participants come out clicking and let the best Print sell!