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FORUMS General Gear Talk Flash and Studio Lighting 
Thread started 04 Nov 2010 (Thursday) 22:04
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Dave Ziser Lighting System, is there a comparable but cheaper way?

 
dmward
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Nov 07, 2010 08:25 |  #16

The latest release of firmware for the Pocket Wizard ControlTL system supports Nissin Di566 flash.
There is an article on Rob Galbraith (sp?) site describing how they worked with beta firmware.

My experience with Quantum T5Drs and Turbo batteries was favorable as off camera flash.
The Turbo batteries recycle a 580EX or 580EXII at about the same rate as a Canon or knock-off 8 AA pack with NiMH batteries.

I quit using and sold my Quantum gear and now use the Control TL stuff with 580EX and 580EXII Speedlites.

A 580EXII, AC7 mount and battery pack on a nano stand is a nice, compact off camera light source that can be used in manual or ETTL mode and controlled with an AC3 on the camera.

If one were to use the Nissin Di566 the total price would be less than the Quantum by a lot.
The Quantum is more powerful but Its rare when the 580EX is firing at full power.

As for the Zumbrella; It and the collapsible Westcott are essentially the same. Ziser claims his lets more light trough. Again, when I had a Zumbrella it worked fine, but when it got wrecked in a blow over, I decided to get the Westcott version. Less than half the price and it works fine.


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symbolphoto
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Nov 07, 2010 08:44 |  #17

MR do little wrote in post #11239196 (external link)
Can you say Trio ?

Its a small company with a user base mainly located in the US. Some people seems to think they are the hottest thing since sliced bread just because they where innovative once upon a time.

Bingo.

Paul, i'm agreeing with you more and more. Does that mean i'm becoming more jaded? ;)




  
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HeadShotz
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Nov 07, 2010 08:54 |  #18

Jannie wrote in post #11239868 (external link)
Okay I'm asking again because I really want to know. Half of that system he uses is that umbrella, al umbrellas are not alike, some not even close. Westcott makes his and I'm under the impression that it is indifferent fabric which is not as dense as the standard double fold Westcott umbrella which is my favorite shoot through for speedlights. But chatting with a Westcott rep at an event here last summer , he mentioned it was more dense, which I would not be interested in- which is it? His umbrella costs about twice as much as the standard Westcot's so I'd like to know more before I but-to-try with the possibility of it ending up in the closet with about ten other umbrellas I don't use. And yes I really do like the light from that cheap strobist Westcott double fold umbrella when using it as a shoot through

It's the exact same umbrella as the Westcott only Ziser has "Zumbrella" printed on his. I own the westcott version and held and inspected the Zumbrella at one of Ziser's Captured by the Light tours last year. Same thing...same material..same hex shaft. It's marketing fluff. There's no special magic there. In fact before the invention of the Zumbrella David use to preach just get any shoot through umbrella...which he did.

Look through Ziser's excellent portfolio and tell me if you can tell me what shots were used with the Zumbrella and what shots were used with whatever other shoot through umbrella he had at the time.

His style is based on off camera directional light. The "quality" of the umbrella has little to do with it. Save your money...get the Westcott version if the collapsible version of an umbrella is attractive to you. My westcott collapsible sits in my equipment bag and is rarely to never used anymore. I personally hate the build quality of it...




  
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davisphotos
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Nov 07, 2010 09:21 |  #19

I have a Quantum T5D, and it's an amazing flash, but I don't know that I would spend the money on another, unless I were to get the Pilot, which is an on-camera TTL flash that can control the T5D via radio.

I agree with the other posters that there are numerous less expensive options to the Quantum system-I have an old Sunpak 555 that I like a lot, and there are a good number of the old 'potato masher' flashes like it available for not a whole lot of money.


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wdwpsu
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Nov 07, 2010 09:33 |  #20

Mr. Ziser is a great marketer.. I got sucked in to his Zumbrella, and it's a fine shoot through umbrella.. More versatile, and less loss of light compared to the no-name one I used before. But, if it were to die in a wind guest, I'd replace it with the Westcott model, as it's the same thing.

As far as the QFlash, he's been using it for years. And, it's getting a little long in the tooth. There are a lot more affordable options now. Elinchrom packs a much larger punch for a very close price. And, personally, I'd rather stick with bouncing the speedlites, and then bringing the big guns (in my case Alien Bees) for room lights or formals.


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symbolphoto
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Nov 07, 2010 11:59 |  #21

wdwpsu wrote in post #11240195 (external link)
Elinchrom packs a much larger punch for a very close price. And, personally, I'd rather stick with bouncing the speedlites, and then bringing the big guns for room lights or formals.

Exactly, the Quadra is much more weildy during a wedding day. Throw a deep octa on a pole and you have yourself a highly portable system with plenty of power. Speedlites we bounce... and that's about it.




  
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MR ­ do ­ little
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Nov 07, 2010 13:45 |  #22
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mumbles wrote in post #11239990 (external link)
Does that mean i'm becoming more jaded? ;)

:lol: That's not necessarily a bad thing..;)


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Paul L.

  
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Jannie
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Nov 08, 2010 10:51 |  #23

Granted the build quality of the Westcott is pretty weak- I recently read that they hav improved on that- at least making a better shaft. I kept trying other umbrellas but with my 580EXII and the way I work (about 3' away) with it- I find it can give me a look I like when used as a shoot through. I have had to do somenrepair stitching and yes Inwish the quality of build was better so I bought a second one as backup. If the newer one is better then I'll upgrade to it for that reason alone.


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wdwpsu
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Nov 08, 2010 11:13 |  #24

Jannie wrote in post #11246504 (external link)
Granted the build quality of the Westcott is pretty weak- I recently read that they hav improved on that- at least making a better shaft. I kept trying other umbrellas but with my 580EXII and the way I work (about 3' away) with it- I find it can give me a look I like when used as a shoot through. I have had to do somenrepair stitching and yes Inwish the quality of build was better so I bought a second one as backup. If the newer one is better then I'll upgrade to it for that reason alone.

What is the Westcott Model Number that is the same as the Zumbrella? Also, David Ziser has been talking about a much larger shoot through he's "beta testing". My guess is that the non-branded version of that already exists through Westcott, too.


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TopHatMoments
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Nov 08, 2010 11:53 |  #25

Zisers name tagged gear is just like a jersey with a team logo. Purchsed to get attention.

Say what you will about his gear but, he turns down more work than most are offered.
His gear can be stuffed in a bag, or for the most part his lighting style of gear is waiting on him where ever he goes.

His gear better than any other out there? In here that will be childishly pounded out for ages.

Annie Leibovitz uses high dollar Profoto strobes and for the most part a softlighter II < a $70 brollie..

It's not who has the best gear. It is who uses there gear the best that fills the bank account.

I've been reading here for awhile and sometime I can't help but wonder.

I wouldn't use that, or my gear is far superior to your gear, heck if that's the case don't tell us show us.

What should really be the point is hey, that's great! How did you get it to work like that not
That stuff is junk

OP you can use just about any umbrella you wish, the combinations are endless.
Bounce umbrella a bit more directness in the light throw over a softbox. Both you lose light depending on material, color... Some silver reflective umbrellas will even gain you some punch.

Speed lights will work just fine. You might need to move it in closer but it will work.
You don't need any of those high or low dollar flash holders either. A stand that will hold an umbrella and some Velcro tie straps will work. You can even lay the flash closer to the center that way. Want more punch or faster recycle, use two speedlights, still cheaper than Ziser's setup.

The gentalman that uses a brand of lights that many here are fond of ( and they'll fight you over it too ), when he's out an about, he uses speedlights an he is famous for it. Look at some of his YouTube tutorials and see what he uses. You can find hundreds of his published prints, far more shot with speedlights than strobes.


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MR ­ do ­ little
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Nov 08, 2010 11:59 |  #26
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TopHatMoments wrote in post #11246933 (external link)
The gentalman that uses a brand of lights that many here are fond of ( and they'll fight you over it too ), when he's out an about, he uses speedlights an he is famous for it. Look at some of his YouTube tutorials and see what he uses. You can find hundreds of his published prints, far more shot with speedlights than strobes.


Whom are you referring to ?


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Nov 08, 2010 12:01 |  #27

Jannie the only way I can think of to answer that question, would be if you LCS had both and would allow you to try both in store. Maybe with a light meter even.

I know a few that use a spray bottle of water to mist there umbrella at times. They swear by it. Me I just look and go ???

I have been known to put aluminum foil in the center to a bit of center punch.


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Nov 08, 2010 12:04 |  #28

He is one of the most famous noink shooters out there. If you fin the right YouTube he has a monster hug cat also.


Canon to PhotoShop, “Beam me up”! LR3 set course for CS5, Warp speed 64!___ ((dpp___/==***^***

  
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MR ­ do ­ little
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Nov 08, 2010 12:06 |  #29
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If you mean Joe, he uses both speedlights and strobes. If you think he is mainly shooting with speedights you might wanna read up on him.


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Paul L.

  
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Nov 08, 2010 12:06 |  #30

And there's no way I'd climb the empire stat building to hang out with a camera mounted on a rod when a heli would work.


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Dave Ziser Lighting System, is there a comparable but cheaper way?
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