Must maintain composure, and NOT give up!

Hi Everyone!

Well, I hope everyone has been having days/evenings filled with great captures. As some of you may already know, I ventured into the world of strobes recently. First I ordered (1) AlienBee 800, then after reading some material I decided I'd invest in another, so I ordered my second AB800 which arrived a few days ago. With that, came the 48" umbrellas, stands, back-drop (muslin), with stand. You see, I've been shooting my trusty Canon580EX and it's many predecessors, mounted on my bodies with some form of defuser (latest was Gary Fong's Light Sphere) for the past 6 years. This year I desperately wanted to evolve, learn and offer something better.

Today, I sadly received a wake-up call that studio lighting is not as easy as it looks. Oh, did I mention I also invested in a Sekonic light meter. Well, I read all the instructions, and gave it a "basic" shot (as I use the word basic loosely).

So without further delay, here are a few practice images using my wife, daughter and youngest son as what was suppose to eventually be a Christmas back-drop to create cards for and use for a Holiday upcoming party.

Ugh... so much to write, and so little time. Let me list my shortcomings before you have a look and burst with laughter.

-1 The images show two catch-lights in their eyes (not sure if that's suppose to be that way -- but it looks odd to me).
-2 Images look dull, and hazy (Maybe because I'm shooting RAW in Adobe color scheme -- shouldn't matter if you're shooting RAW right?)
3- When I meter, the subjects seem properly exposed but my histogram is peaking toward the left.
4- Lastly, I'm quite disgusted with myself, but won't give up. The flash-heads are turned down to 1/2 power. Seems when I adjust exposure by stopping down on the f/stops, the backdrop looks hazy. Then again, it could be because I have it on a tilt because the darn thing doesn't fit in my living room.
5- The stand I purchased (from eBay) doesn't seem to extend the full height of the muslin.

OK, here we go: http://www.pbase.com/d​ortiz/disaster101

Enjoy. I would have posted a few samples hear but for some reason, I can't post PBase links here.

Any suggestions, additional hair-lighyt maybe.. who knows at this point.

Regards,
Dave

Have you done any post processing to these images? when shooting in RAW you will need to tweak the images to get them to look like you want...
also there is no "right" histogram...you have to learn how to interpret the histogram based on what you are shooting.
overall the images arent that bad, some tweaking will get the pop I think you are after...

1. if you're using 2 lights in front of your subject, you'll get 2 catch lights. clone one out if it bothers you

2. the bg will end up out of focus depending on the Fstop you use, but at F11, it could just be a crap backdrop. If you had real scenery, the image might look quite different.

3. call ME STUPID... fake tree! disregard that comment about brightly lit objects

4 & 5- not sure what to tell you except keep shooting. The facial tones aren't bad, nor are the shadows.

No reason why you can't post pbase images here....

HTTP response: NOT FOUND | MIME changed to 'image/gif'

I think they need a little PP. The back drop isn't real appealing, but keep at it!

Backdrop might look better if it were more out of focus. Move subjects closer to you and open the aperture a bit?

OK guys, so this is most helpful. The backdrop I purchased from eBay for $64.00-$70.00 around that figure. Also left my UV filter on my Canon 24-70 f/2.8L lens - not sure if that may have something to do with it.

Thinking of going babk tp Paul c buff site to order the transmitters for better separation, but I didn't see a hair light there -- can someone point me to a site that sells those. Also, should I buy a higher. Quality back-drop??

Finally, for these kinds of portraits (usually two people), do you guys recommend portrait 3/4 body or landscape. Either way, would the traditional way be full body 1/4, 1/2, or 3/4

Decisions - decisions.

Dave

distance between backdrop and subjects first of all,

second of all, keep 1 flash more powerful than the other. Use the more powerful light as a main light with a soft modifier (shoot through umbrella or softbox) and use the less powerful light off to more of an angle to fill in the shadows a bit.

This will create a more contrasty, more exciting, better looking picture.

Dan

Think I'll try that also. That being said, do I need a third light for separation?

czeglin wrote in post #11280156
Backdrop might look better if it were more out of focus. Move subjects closer to you and open the aperture a bit?

Dan, too close to the backdrop? What distance do u suggest? I can turn the umbrellas around and shoot through them.

danielc118 wrote in post #11280196
distance between backdrop and subjects first of all,

second of all, keep 1 flash more powerful than the other. Use the more powerful light as a main light with a soft modifier (shoot through umbrella or softbox) and use the less powerful light off to more of an angle to fill in the shadows a bit.

This will create a more contrasty, more exciting, better looking picture.

Dan

Here is a quick tip working with backgrounds.

Move the subjects about 2-3 feet more in front of the back drop.

You are using only two lights. You are getting very flat lighting if you have them both at the subjects facing forward at 45 degrees facing inward. Try using one umbrella higher up, about 2 feet above their heads in height, and off to one side. Then place the other umbrella on the opposite of the subjects, so the light are almost facing each other. This way you will get a glow going behind the subjects, which will give them more depth and contrast.

Also, the background looks very dark, you actually need to light the back drop, so it is bright. But with only two lights, you can use some white reflectors to bounce some light to fill some shadows. You really need a third light in most portrait setups.

Thanks Kurt for the most informative post. I went to the Alienbees website and don't see anything the looks like an overhead hair light. Was considering getting some device to fire my 580EX for background but was hoping to remain consistent with all light temp.

Maybe some reflectors if a bg light can't be found?

KurtGoss wrote in post #11280233
Here is a quick tip working with backgrounds.

Move the subjects about 2-3 feet more in front of the back drop.

You are using only two lights. You are getting very flat lighting if you have them both at the subjects facing forward at 45 degrees facing inward. Try using one umbrella higher up, about 2 feet above their heads in height, and off to one side. Then place the other umbrella on the opposite of the subjects, so the light are almost facing each other. This way you will get a glow going behind the subjects, which will give them more depth and contrast.

Also, the background looks very dark, you actually need to light the back drop, so it is bright. But with only two lights, you can use some white reflectors to bounce some light to fill some shadows. You really need a third light in most portrait setups.

DOrtiz wrote in post #11280275
Thanks Kurt for the most informative post. I went to the Alienbees website and don't see anything the looks like an overhead hair light. Was considering getting some device to fire my 580EX for background but was hoping to remain consistent with all light temp.

Maybe some reflectors if a bg light can't be found?

as has been said, do what was suggested with the lights. and yeah, at least 3 feet more away from the background. Shoot with a larger aperture to throw the background more out of focus, ie, f/2.8

to be honest, in my opinion, you'd do really well with a read through of the off camera lighting guide at http://www.strobist.bl​ogspot.com/

you will learn a lot more than just our suggestions can give you.

you won't find a specific "hair light" for sale, its just any strobe that you have lying around, a 580 will be more than enough.

Dan

Ok: Try this.

1. When metering the subject point the white dome toward the camera's lens NOT the flash head.
2. Have the subjects sit.
3. Make sure that the subjects are at least 6 ft from the BG - more is better.
4. The lights should arrainged so that you have a MAIN light and a FILL light. The main shout be approx .5 stops brighter than the fill.
5. The main light should be at approx 4 ft higher than the tallest subjects head, and approx 45 degrees from camera center.
6. The fill should be higher still and .5 stops lower in exposure, and approx 60 degrees from camera center and placed behind the camera.
7. Face the ladies toward the MAIN light.
8. Get rid of extremely tacky Xmas BG. It puts you on par with what you see at wallymart. If you want a great portrait BG get a grey/black/blue Old masters. They can be gelled to get any color combo.
8. A hair light and a BG light would certainly help seperate your subject from the BG.
9. Learn how to pose groups, using gender, relationships, and head hights to get the groups correct.
Learn the inverted W, the U shape, The T shape, the Diamond and the Circle poses for groups.
10. Learn the basics of Rembrandt style of lighting. That will get you started

Before I take the plunge ....

OK, I have one transmitter and two receivers on que. For the background separation issue, is this: http://alienbees.com/u​br.html what I'll need? Of course this means I'll have to buy another light and stand. Is so, can I go with the AB400 or should I keep all 3 as AB800s?

Any help/advise before I place this order will be most helpful. Because once I do thats all the funds I'll have available for a long time.

Thanks everyone for your valued help and guidance. The transmitter/receivers I gather are a good investment because I can move the lights around without worrying about a sync cord? Just holding off on that order until it's determined if I absolutely need a third light or not.

Regards,
Dave