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FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre Still Life, B/W & Experimental Talk 
Thread started 20 Nov 2010 (Saturday) 13:41
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Infrared photography with Canon 7D help?

 
sweitzen
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Nov 20, 2010 13:41 |  #1

Does anybody here shoot in infrared with an UNMODIFIED Canon 7D?

I just got an infrared filter, and tried a couple shots (Manual mode, f/4 15", ISO400, tripod -- sufficient to see a fairly clear image in the LCD) . However, I'm not getting the dark skies and white foliage effect. Post procession was essentially nothing but desaturating 100% to create a B&W.

Comparison of identical shot without filter at proper exposure, also 100% desaturated looks nearly identical.

My thoughts are:
1. There's a further trick to doing this in-camera that i didn't do.
2. There's a lot more to post-processing the images to bring out the expected infrared effect.

or

3. The hot mirror in the 7D is just too effective, and what little deep-red visible light gets through the filter is, indeed, what primarily comprises the image.




  
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johneo
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Nov 21, 2010 09:25 |  #2

Can you post an example? (or a link to one)

Haven't tried IR with my 7D and filter. When I tried it on my 10D (which was before I had it converted to IR) I pretty much had "similar" results though it was much better after conversion. PP shouldn't be that big a deal. Did you perhaps overdo the PP?

Which filter are you using?

Project for the day ... see if I can find my IR filter ( :confused: ) and give the 7D a try.


2 - 5DMKII's, Powershot SX 150 IS
7D, 5D, IR/5D, 10D, IR/10D, Elan 7NE
17-40 L, 24-70 L, 70-200 f/2.8 L IS, 100-400 L IS,
TS-E 24 f/3.5 L, 28-135 IS (x2), 50 f/1.8, 85 f/1.8 550EX, 430EX
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johneo
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Nov 21, 2010 19:25 as a reply to  @ johneo's post |  #3

Found my filter ... 7D with an IR filter works just like any other camera I've tried.

First shot is 7D.
Second shot is the same photo converted to grayscale.
Third shot is the 7D using the Hoya R-72 filter, believe it was 13 seconds @ f/2.8
Forth shot is from my converted 10D.
I didn't shoot the 10D and 7D IR at similar settings because with the converted 10D long exposures aren't needed.
I'll also point out that I didn't spend a lot of time trying to get similar shots or in fact the best shots ... shooting with a filter is a pain! :rolleyes:
But, I think you can see the difference between the 7D B&W shot and the 7D IR shot
BTW ... the sky was pretty hazy so it would be hard to get dark (black like) skies. But you can see the line of tree to the left in the background, as well as the grass ... dark in the B&W photo, light in the IR

IMAGE: http://www.riview.com/IR/7D-noir.jpg

IMAGE: http://www.riview.com/IR/7D-BW.jpg

IMAGE: http://www.riview.com/IR/7D-IR.jpg

IMAGE: http://www.riview.com/IR/10D-1.jpg

2 - 5DMKII's, Powershot SX 150 IS
7D, 5D, IR/5D, 10D, IR/10D, Elan 7NE
17-40 L, 24-70 L, 70-200 f/2.8 L IS, 100-400 L IS,
TS-E 24 f/3.5 L, 28-135 IS (x2), 50 f/1.8, 85 f/1.8 550EX, 430EX
40mm pancake

  
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sweitzen
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Hatchling
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Nov 22, 2010 10:38 as a reply to  @ johneo's post |  #4

Thanks!

I bought a Singh-Ray I-Ray filter.

I don't know if I saved any of my shots from yesterday; they were all pretty bad.

There was almost no noticeable difference between color photo converted to grayscale and IR photo converted. Foliage was a little lighter, but not white. It was fairly overcast, and I couldn't get any shots in direct sunlight -- i don't know if that has anything to do with it.

The shot you did with 7D and filter -- did you just convert the photo to grayscale, or do more processing?

I was playing with the custom white balance, shooting a white sheet, and then applying that as a color correction to subsequent images. The result wasn't monochrome, but muted tones, and i found it a pleasing effect. However, it is, as far as i can tell, only applied to JPG, and not to RAW. When I imported the data into photoshop, the RAW were the original deep red color.

Do you know how to apply the calibration photo to subsequent photos (working in RAW) in Photoshop CS4 so I can get the same color effect as the JPG had, but have it in RAW so I can process it further if I like?

So far, everything I've read says only to swap the R and B channels, and that just looks horrible.




  
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johneo
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Nov 22, 2010 11:18 |  #5

sweitzen wrote in post #11326659 (external link)
The shot you did with 7D and filter -- did you just convert the photo to grayscale, or do more processing?

I only resized and converted the jpg to grayscale. No othere processing.

I don't shoot RAW, only large fine jpeg and try to do minimal processing on them (that's anything I shoot)

The sunlight does make a big difference when shooting IR. Noticably when shooting a leafy tree where part of the leaves on the tree are in the shade. (looking for examples but can't find them now :( )


2 - 5DMKII's, Powershot SX 150 IS
7D, 5D, IR/5D, 10D, IR/10D, Elan 7NE
17-40 L, 24-70 L, 70-200 f/2.8 L IS, 100-400 L IS,
TS-E 24 f/3.5 L, 28-135 IS (x2), 50 f/1.8, 85 f/1.8 550EX, 430EX
40mm pancake

  
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sweitzen
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Hatchling
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Nov 22, 2010 13:14 as a reply to  @ johneo's post |  #6

I am toying with picking up a used 5D on ebay and converting it to IR-only, but only after I've taking shooting with the filter as far as i can go.

I really like how IR makes B/W photos look, and having one converted to allow normal exposures opens up using it for portraits, too.




  
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johneo
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Nov 22, 2010 14:12 |  #7

sweitzen wrote in post #11327369 (external link)
I am toying with picking up a used 5D on ebay and converting it to IR-only, but only after I've taking shooting with the filter as far as i can go.

I really like how IR makes B/W photos look, and having one converted to allow normal exposures opens up using it for portraits, too.

See if you can find an old 10D for cheap and have it converted, if money is tight. I had my older 10D converted to Deep B&W IR and it's a lot of fun to play with. My older 5D is being converted now to Super Color IR and can't wait until it gets back.

I bought my R-72 filter to give IR a try with my old Sony digital. Found out the filter also fit on my Canon Nifty Fifty lens ... results were a little better than the Sony but still, what a pain in the ... Shortly after, the shutter went on my 10D and when I got it back, shipped it off to be converted.

Here's a shot i took a year or two ago. Just pulled over, thought it would look cool, got out my 10D-IR and took a few picks. I always try a few settings but long exposures are a thing of the past! You can see that by how smooth the water was in the shot.


IMAGE: http://riview.com/IR/0097ir2.jpg

2 - 5DMKII's, Powershot SX 150 IS
7D, 5D, IR/5D, 10D, IR/10D, Elan 7NE
17-40 L, 24-70 L, 70-200 f/2.8 L IS, 100-400 L IS,
TS-E 24 f/3.5 L, 28-135 IS (x2), 50 f/1.8, 85 f/1.8 550EX, 430EX
40mm pancake

  
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sweitzen
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Hatchling
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Nov 22, 2010 15:00 as a reply to  @ johneo's post |  #8

Are you using MaxMax to do the conversion?




  
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johneo
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Nov 22, 2010 19:10 |  #9

sweitzen wrote in post #11327954 (external link)
Are you using MaxMax to do the conversion?

No, LifePixel.com


2 - 5DMKII's, Powershot SX 150 IS
7D, 5D, IR/5D, 10D, IR/10D, Elan 7NE
17-40 L, 24-70 L, 70-200 f/2.8 L IS, 100-400 L IS,
TS-E 24 f/3.5 L, 28-135 IS (x2), 50 f/1.8, 85 f/1.8 550EX, 430EX
40mm pancake

  
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Mark ­ II
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Dec 17, 2010 23:19 |  #10

johneo wrote in post #11327728 (external link)
My older 5D is being converted now to Super Color IR and can't wait until it gets back.

Just sent a 40D off to Lifepixel..... Any updates from your new Super color IR? :)


1DX7D - 40D IR converted Sony RX100,
Canon 85 L II, EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II, EF 24-105L, 16-35mm f/2.8 II L, 100L & 60mm Macro , Fisheye EF 15mm f2.8, Tokina 10-17

  
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m_fitton
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Dec 18, 2010 09:17 |  #11

I'm certainly no expert, but I also have been trying out a R-72 filter on my 50D and after getting results I wasn't happy with, I started to dig around a bit. It seems that if you take an image of something with a strong green colour ie; grass, leaves etc, and use that as your custom white balance you will get the results you need. The only thing I don't know about and haven't had time to try it, is when taking the image of the greenery with the filter in place, how long should the exposure be for that image... I would get out a bit more and try this but there isn't much greenery here anymore...LOL

hope it helps :)




  
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LearnMyShot
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Dec 18, 2010 11:17 |  #12

this might help: a step by step tutorial: http://www.learnmyshot​.com …hy-Technique-Step-By-Step (external link)



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mdflowe
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Apr 25, 2011 23:29 |  #13

It's been a while since I shot any IR, so i hope my recollection is correct ... the trick is to do a custom white balance on the green grass or green leave patch in the trees. Using a white piece of paper only makes the whites white. Setting it to a green grass area makes the leaves and grass white. Then do some PP with conversion to B&W. There's some experimentation to get what you want but don't use white paper or gray card is what I was told by the serious IR shooters.


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7D-Grpd(2) | 10D-IR | 580EX II(3) | 70-200mm F/2.8L IS II | 24-105mm F/4L IS | Pelican 1510 | LowePro Bags | List more lenses later.

  
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jblaschke
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Apr 26, 2011 11:10 as a reply to  @ mdflowe's post |  #14

I can't speak for the 7D with any certainty, but the issue *might* be with hot mirror. I've shot much IR with an unmodified XTi/400D. After setting custom white balance, landscape shots on a sunny day generally take about 10 seconds at f/8 to give me a good exposure and nice histogram. A month or so back, I didn't have my XTi so used the 50D instead. Using the same lenses and settings, 10 second exposures were almost black, and 20 second exposures were murky. I tried to rescue some in Adobe Camera Raw, but the IR effect was muted.

Obviously, the hot mirror on the 50D is significantly more effective against infrared than that of the XTi, and I would assume the 7D hot mirror is just as effective a filter, if not moreso. Since 720nm filters do allow a small amount of visible spectrum to pass, the longer exposure times are letting in enough visible light to muddy up and spoil the IR image. The solution, such as it is, may be to get an older body with a less efficient hot mirror, or bit the bullet and get a conversion.


Canon 7D | Canon 50D IR modified | Canon EF 70-200mm 2.8 IS L | Canon FD 500mm 8.0 Reflex | Canon EF 85mm 1.8 | Canon EF 50mm 1.8 mk I | Canon EF-S 10-22mm | Tamron 28-75mm f/2.8 | Meade 645 (762mm f/5)
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labbai
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Jun 10, 2011 09:55 as a reply to  @ jblaschke's post |  #15

Maybe these sites will give some assistance: http://nightsheep.devi​antart.com …ssing-IR-Photo-s-90232994 (external link) and http://www.wrotniak.ne​t/photo/infrared/ (external link)
It's all about post processing in digital IR photography


Canon, Gitzo, RRS, Zeiss, Pelenghttp://labbai.blogspot​.com/ (external link)

  
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Infrared photography with Canon 7D help?
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