Buying a second-hand DSLR

Hey there,

I've been shooting with my mom's old analog SLR and I'm really having a blast, it's so much fun! Now I'd like to get a second-hand DSLR because the learning curve will be much higher and it's just more awesome (and cheaper. Seriously, a roll of film (36 shots) is 6€, that's like 9$. Outrageous!)

Anyway, I've been looking around sites like eBay (the Dutch one) and just want to get one of the cheapest ones that are still decent (the older models).
Now I've settled on an older XXXD or XXD, and I think there's 4 options: the 400D, 450D, the 20D and the 30D. I can't quite figure out what the difference is between the older XX and XXXD series, but hopefully you guys (and gals) can help me out! I'm inclined towards either the 450D or 20D (I don't have a feeling there's too much difference between the 20 and 30D, amiright?)
It's the plan not to spend more than 200€ max on the body alone (just to get me started, learn a lot more and to see if I réally want to spend a lot of money and buy a better DSLR (also with HD Video probably the T2i/550D or the T3i/600d [who knows]).)

Now I'm just wondering what to do and what you guys suggest. Does the type of photography really matter when choosing between a 20D or 450D?

The thing I like about the 450D is the price (just a tad bit cheaper second hand), the MP (12.2 opposed to the 20D's 8.2 I know it's both a lot but I like scenery (and when having a pic of an awesome mountain-range or something I'll probably want to print a large picture of it)) and the slightly newerness (that ain't a word is it ) of it (second-hand probably less clicks), so the software is a bit more up-to-date with nowadays standard. What I like about the 20D is the 5fps opposed to the 450D's 3.5fps, I also like shooting action sports and that's where the higher fps will come in nice. I reckon the image-quality is also better than from the 450D? (Glass still being the main factor of course)
I really feel like both have their advantages but maybe you guys can come up with some other insights and why one or another might be better!

Thanks in advance,

regards from Dutchy-land!

All of the cameras that you mentioned will take excellent photos, and you will be able to print from any of them... The megapixel count is really irrelevant when you are only talking about the difference between 8 and 12.

The difference between the xxxD bodies and the xxD bodies is mainly in ergonomics and handling. The xxD line is magnesium, and is built heavier than the Rebel line. The 2nd wheel on the back makes changing settings easier and more convenient. Also... The 400D only goes to ISO 1600, while the 30D can be expanded to 3200. I'm not saying that 3200 would be acceptable for most users on this forum, but it is there... The FPS is also nice if you need it.

I am in the beginning stages of upgrade research... I'm going back and forth, but I do not think that I could adjust to the Rebel size and feel. After playing with the 60D, I think that's too small and light...

Good luck with your decisions....

Steve

TijmenDal wrote in post #11321306
Hey there,

I've been shooting with my mom's old analog SLR and I'm really having a blast, it's so much fun! Now I'd like to get a second-hand DSLR because the learning curve will be much higher and it's just more awesome (and cheaper. Seriously, a roll of film (36 shots) is 6€, that's like 9$. Outrageous!)

Anyway, I've been looking around sites like eBay (the Dutch one) and just want to get one of the cheapest ones that are still decent (the older models).
Now I've settled on an older XXXD or XXD, and I think there's 4 options: the 400D, 450D, the 20D and the 30D. I can't quite figure out what the difference is between the older XX and XXXD series, but hopefully you guys (and gals) can help me out! I'm inclined towards either the 450D or 20D (I don't have a feeling there's too much difference between the 20 and 30D, amiright?)
It's the plan not to spend more than 200€ max on the body alone (just to get me started, learn a lot more and to see if I réally want to spend a lot of money and buy a better DSLR (also with HD Video probably the T2i/550D or the T3i/600d [who knows]).)

Now I'm just wondering what to do and what you guys suggest. Does the type of photography really matter when choosing between a 20D or 450D?

The thing I like about the 450D is the price (just a tad bit cheaper second hand) and the MP (12.2 opposed to the 20D's 8.2 I know it's both a lot but I like scenery and when having a pic of an awesome mountain-range or something, I'll probably want to print a large picture of it). What I like about the 20D is the 5fps opposed to the 450D's 3.5fps, I also like shooting action sports and that's where the higher fps will come in nice.
I really feel like both have their advantages but maybe you guys can come up with some other insights and why one or another might be better!

Thanks in advance,

regards from Dutchy-land!

I had a 300D before the 20D & think you're going to like the ergonomics of xxD camera a lot better.

PhotosGuy wrote in post #11324569
I had a 300D before the 20D & think you're going to like the ergonomics of xxD camera a lot better.

Thanks and I reckon yes. The screen is a lot smaller though (than the 450D's)? Or not that much that you'd actually want a bigger one? It's only 1.8".

If I were buying second hand in the NL I would do two things. I would first check to see if I knew anyone going to the US soon (not too hard in the NL) so I could buy more for my money. Secondly I would buy a xxD body as they tend to be a bit more robust so theoretically they should last longer. You should be able to ask the buyer to tell you the shutter count to give you an idea of usage.

Also, what is your budget?

Acute Exposure wrote in post #11325445
If I were buying second hand in the NL I would do two things. I would first check to see if I knew anyone going to the US soon (not too hard in the NL) so I could buy more for my money. Secondly I would buy a xxD body as they tend to be a bit more robust so theoretically they should last longer. You should be able to ask the buyer to tell you the shutter count to give you an idea of usage.

Also, what is your budget?

About 200 for the body itself.

It's funny, now that I've been looking around a bit I'm seeing that these prices tend to be the standard (more or less) for a second-hand in good shape:
20D: 180€
30D: 200€
450: 300€ at least (I saw one for 175€ but the guy instantly sold it I think, haha!)

I think I'll be going with the 30D, I like the better burst mode and that's defo worth the 20€ I think.

As for the America idea, it doesn't seem like they're much cheaper (if at all) over there, besides, it's a lot of hassle getting to find someone who goes there, wants to pick it up and I really don't want to use a converter every time I charge my batteries

I got a deal for 260€ for a good 30D with battery-grip, 2 batteries and a 8gb compact flash card. Doesn't seem all that bad to me... Good probably knock some off that as well.

Wow. That is a great price for a 30D I would definitely buy it in NL then. The poser is 110-220 so no converter necessary though. The 30D is a great body and should serve you well.

Acute Exposure wrote in post #11325506
Wow. That is a great price for a 30D I would definitely buy it in NL then. The poser is 110-220 so no converter necessary though. The 30D is a great body and should serve you well.

What do you mean by the poser?

And ye, I think it's a great price, I'll probably pick one up to finally kick it off!

TijmenDal wrote in post #11325551
What do you mean by the poser?

And ye, I think it's a great price, I'll probably pick one up to finally kick it off!

power, pretty sure it was a typo, unless you have very old posers....

Any of those cameras take great pics, including the one you bought, the interesting bit and more determinant factor comes when you start trying to pick lenses, plenty of good threads here on that subject

PhotosGuy wrote in post #11324569
I had a 300D before the 20D & think you're going to like the ergonomics of xxD camera a lot better.

Me too, the 20D is much better than the 300d, still using it till the 5dmk2 comes down in price. it will still do amazing pics, the person behind the camera will still be the limiting factor.

Whooops... I did indeed mean power.

dervish99 wrote in post #11325695
Me too, the 20D is much better than the 300d, still using it till the 5dmk2 comes down in price. it will still do amazing pics, the person behind the camera will still be the limiting factor.

Sure enough it's better than the 300D, but is it also better than the 450D?

The 450D is much more expensive than the 400D (so the 400D is more in my budget). The 450D body goes for 275-300€ in the Netherlands, while I would have no problem picking a 400D body up for less than 200€. Or is a 30D/20D much better than a 400D? It seems to me that both the 400 and 450D aren't nearly as good as the 20 and 30D. With the hype of having a DSLR nowadays everyone is getting one and they just think the xxxD series is for beginners, so that's what I get, while the xxD series are semi-pro and even the older xxD's are better than the newer (e.g 450D) xxxD models.

Just like the 40D blows the 550D out of the water photo-wise (or so I've been told).

I'm more-and-more inclining towards the 30D because of the small price difference but the bigger screen and the higher fps (and DigicII). Unless you guys got a good reason NOT to get the 30D as my first DSLR I'm pretty sure that's the one I'm going for.

TijmenDal wrote in post #11326806
Sure enough it's better than the 300D, but is it also better than the 450D?

The 450D is much more expensive than the 400D (so the 400D is more in my budget). The 450D body goes for 275-300€ in the Netherlands, while I would have no problem picking a 400D body up for less than 200€. Or is a 30D/20D much better than a 400D? It seems to me that both the 400 and 450D aren't nearly as good as the 20 and 30D. With the hype of having a DSLR nowadays everyone is getting one and they just think the xxxD series is for beginners, so that's what I get, while the xxD series are semi-pro and even the older xxD's are better than the newer (e.g 450D) xxxD models.

Just like the 40D blows the 550D out of the water photo-wise (or so I've been told).

I'm more-and-more inclining towards the 30D because of the small price difference but the bigger screen and the higher fps (and DigicII). Unless you guys got a good reason NOT to get the 30D as my first DSLR I'm pretty sure that's the one I'm going for.

I feel threatened

Not sure what exactly you are driving at with a lot of the above, but the bit I've highlighted in red is pure fiction from an IQ point of view......

From what I can recall the 450D IQ is better than the 40D, although the 40D has other advantages over it. Of the 400D vs 30D I think you are referring to I personally would take the 30D, I had the 400D and loved it, but at that time I know I envied the guys with xxDs

landth wrote in post #11328265
I feel threatened

Not sure what exactly you are driving at with a lot of the above, but the bit I've highlighted in red is pure fiction from an IQ point of view......

From what I can recall the 450D IQ is better than the 40D, although the 40D has other advantages over it. Of the 400D vs 30D I think you are referring to I personally would take the 30D, I had the 400D and loved it, but at that time I know I envied the guys with xxDs

Haha! It's just something I've heard. There was this one pro guy who sad that, no matter what, the 550D is still a 'rebel' and the 40D isn't.

I can pick up a 20D with a bag and all the original stuff with 13.000 clicks for 160-180€ or so...should I go for that? Because the 200€ doesn't have a battery nor a charger with it (or so I think, the guy was gonna check again, but his post said he didn't have them). I could buy a charger (I looked around for a charger, it's 15€ for some weird brand, but it fits the EU-standard) and a battery (for like 10-15€ each), so that would put me at like 250€ for the 30D (no lenses).

Putting it thát way, the 30D being almost 100€ more than the 20D I'm feeling more like the 20D is the way to go... Damn, this is so hard!

Its your money, I wouldn't presume to tell you how to spend it, but I would buy the 400D over the 20D every day of the week....