Pricing question

cdifoto wrote in post #11496959
Then don't run around offering to shoot portraits of anyone and everyone yet. Get good at it via family first.

so one is supposed to go from doing shoots for free to doing shoots for the going rate of a standard professional photographer? Wouldn't me doing shoots for free be more expensive to me than doing shoots for a lesser rate than an established pro? Aren't there different price points that people are willing to pay for a photographer?

cdifoto wrote in post #11495607
Personally, I'd rather sit on my rear end and watch a movie at home than go out and operate in the red.

hence why i stopped doing computer repair and lessons... rather drink a beer or play with the kids than waste my time for a few bucks...


OP - Good Luck man.. keep your head up and dont get frustrated... gloves come off when you talk about being part time starting... opposed to the many that already ARE in the business..... give ya credit for asking... i couldnt ask that question and not expect to get blasted into a fetal position!!!!!!!!!

TeleFragger wrote in post #11496984
hence why i stopped doing computer repair and lessons... rather drink a beer or play with the kids than waste my time for a few bucks...


OP - Good Luck man.. keep your head up and dont get frustrated... gloves come off when you talk about being part time starting... opposed to the many that already ARE in the business..... give ya credit for asking... i couldnt ask that question and not expect to get blasted into a fetal position!!!!!!!!!

No blasting, I simply for once put cards in the proper spot.
Candy coating will only give you bank account a cavity!

TopHatMoments wrote in post #11497013
No blasting, I simply for once put cards in the proper spot.
Candy coating will only give you bank account a cavity!

ahhh i agree.. at least the OP wants to know... hell i would just wing it and hope for the best... (im not good with confrontation!!!! HAH...)

Ahtz wrote in post #11496968
so one is supposed to go from doing shoots for free to doing shoots for the going rate of a standard professional photographer? Wouldn't me doing shoots for free be more expensive to me than doing shoots for a lesser rate than an established pro? Aren't there different price points that people are willing to pay for a photographer?

I edited my wording to clarify my point, because I figured this is how you'd respond.

cdifoto wrote in post #11497082
I edited my wording to clarify my point, because I figured this is how you'd respond.

haha. I agree with that. I still think there is a transition between shooting for free for family and friends, and working into being able to charge a reasonable rate with paying clients. That is where I am at, in the transition.

I think the transition from free family sessions to paid client sessions should at least be profitable. You're currently not profitable...not even a little bit. You also stated that you "want the $65." Why do you really want the $65 so badly when you have a day job? It won't even fill the tank of an SUV.

so then I need to figure out how to market myself to the higher paying clients

Yes. Just don't confuse "higher paying" with "wealthy" because the higher paying aren't always wealthy, and the wealthy aren't always higher paying.

Ahtz wrote in post #11494351
I think you need to do the math to figure out what you need to charge to pay for the cost of running a business but after you do that math, you better hope its something people are willing to pay.

For example.. if I am a really poor, inefficient businessman and figure it costs me $2000 per family shoot to stay ahead of the game, and then charge that rate, I won't get any business because my work is not worth that. But thats what it costs to run my business you say?

Its funny I say all this while knowing that my rates are lower than it would cost to sustain even my part time business. I've struggled to even get someone to want a photo shoot at my "standard" $200 rate yet alone a "Christmas Card Special" of $25.

Time for me to start reading about advertising I guess....... Thanks for all the advice and input.

I figured out how to price and run my side 20 plus years ago.

Those are not scoops of expense, from my head.
Let's take you own prices. 2hours- 25 HRI's on a CD $200.00

If you put 61 keepers on a CD you had at least two hours in it.
$50.00 per hr session fee ( again dirt cheap ) 2hrs = $100.00

That leaves $100.00 for 25 files. $4.00 a file

61 files @ $4.00 = $244.00 | 2hrs $100.00 leaves $25.00 for 61 files. $0.41 per file!!
---------
It's near Christmas, so I'll throw out a present.
- I do a good bit of Corp. work; CEO's, Exec's and what not. All a business expence for them. I have been asked almost every time during the shoot ( if I have not been there before ) if I do family? Why yes I do and it hints of can you charge me for a family shoot here, so I can use the deduct? Some of my Corp shoots are so high priced that it would scare Fonald Drump itself. I've heard tell of a few weddings that went something like that. Who knows how it goes in the world of

I think I speak for myself as well as a lot of other photographers. As far as going from no clients to charging standard rates is done by doing the following.

This is what I did, of course this was in 1980 when I started as a professional "fashion" photographer.

Shoot lots of friends, family, friends of friends of family, etc. for FREE!!! LEARN WHAT YOU ARE DOING! Get a good portfolio to show clients that are willing to pay, then put together packages at current rates.

Now before anyone flames me I feel NO ONE should pick up a camera and start charging for photography until they know what they are doing. Look at it as school and you are paying tuition. I know in the digital age "everyone" is a photographer because everyone can afford a good camera, and has a photo printer.

People tend to respect a photographer if you are still learning and are upfront with shooting them for a learning experience to build a portfolio. If they want to pay you, let them offer what they want, don't expect anything.

When you have great samples, that you can show people, not just 2 to 3 people, at least 10, then you can justify charging a price that is fair for both parties.

My career was not really so much portrait related. I shot models, actors and entertainers. I probably shot 5% of the people I shot for free my entire career(1980-2007), because they were great for my portfolio and made my paying clients want me that much more.

I think now adays, people want to make the good money instantly. When I approached the Agencies I eventually worked with full time, I had 10 "average to good shots", was honest with them and told them I was going to shoot for a living and be around for the long haul. I asked them to supply my with models to shoot for TFP. I shot for 3 months straight, not making as dime. But, my portfolio was top notch after 3 months. And according to my business plan, I closed the "free" door and never looked back. I started charging the same thing as the other guys were charging, stuck by my guns and did very well.

Did I ever discount? I ran specials for a few times, and found I shot fewer people and made less money. I had a REASONABLE fee, and I stuck with it. Fow over 10 years I was booked over 30 days in advance, shooting 3-8 sessions a day 5 days a week, at regular rate. I always gave a discount to repeat customers, because I appreciated them returning.

I guess my point is most of us that shoot for a living hate to see anyone doing photography and trying to charge for something when they have no clue what they are doing (not meant to any posts in this thread).

Learn what you are doing, charge accordingly, MARKET CORRECTLY, and you should have no problem making money.

I have a friend who is now shooting that I help "manage". He is doing very well, and is a average shooter. However, we do a great deal or marketing and ALWAYS make the client think he is almost too busy to shoot them. You have to make them "want" you. If you slash your prices and haggle, that shows desperation, people sense that.

Just like in any other business, it is extremely easy to make money. Treat your customers fair, charge a fair price, and give everyone 110% and you will always have customers.

just my 2 cents

I haven't read all the posts but, Just because you have a day job doesn't mean that you should be cheap. IT'S A BUSINESS. Do you know that a shutter repair can be about $300? Yes they do fail. Most anyone can take a decent portrait but do you have all the proper gear to take creative portraits? What can you offer that the established pros are not offering? For example, the main pro in my area always uses the same locations, in the same lighting, for senior portraits, By using other locations and more creativity, my business is growing. I also have a day job.

As far as pricing, you should check the pricing of established pros in your area and adjust accordingly

Those are great photos and (#1) the customer should realize that she's not going to get that caliber of photo with a Kodak digital camera. (#2) Your contract states $125 so thats what the customer should expect to pay. I would (in a round about sort of way) make the customer feel as if she is insulting your talent (which she is by undercutting your contract by over half). Ask her "Why only $65?" (use the word "only". It makes their price seem minuscule). Then ask them "Didn't you like the photos?" This will make them squirm a bit.

Stick to your guns.

Good luck!

No reply from the client... Guess they aren't worth what i'm asking as far as she's considered.

Client; How much are your fee's.

Photographer; a little bit less than a weekend at the Ritz, with dinner's and the bar bill.
And you will have something to show for it when you receive the Prints.

Flowers, wilt.
Dinner, flushes.
Movies, forgotten.
Shows, ah maybe they remember the show, ( because they have the PlayBill and ticket stubs ) humm a montage of photographs they can see, and a ticket stub to prove they did indeed pay that much for a 1 night stand!

Photographs, last a lifetime. ( some maybe longer )