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Thread started 20 Jan 2011 (Thursday) 11:19
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Higgs ­ Boson
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Jan 20, 2011 11:19 |  #1

I've been debating this for a while:

Canon 7D with 10-22 EF-S lens....1800+860 = 2660 dollars

Canon 5D with 14mm lens....2500+2400 = 4900 dollars

That's a pretty big dollar difference between the two.

I currently have a Rebel XS with the 24-105 L lens. I'd like to get a good/great wide lens and a body that I can feel good about keeping a few years. I am very interested in full frame quality but I am not sure that anyone but me will notice between a 5D and 7D IQ, even though we all know there is some....

What would you do?


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qbfx
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Jan 20, 2011 11:32 |  #2

Canon 5D with 14mm f/2.8 Samyang lens.....2500+300 = 2800 dollars


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Higgs ­ Boson
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Jan 20, 2011 11:34 |  #3

Ah, well, I guess I'm a fanboy/brand loyal/whatever you want to call it. I'll be honest, I'm not buying a Samyang anything....not that I don't appreciate the suggestion, I should have said that in my OP.


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gonzogolf
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Jan 20, 2011 11:40 |  #4

I guess I'm a bit puzzled by your either or proposition. If you are happy with the possibility of 10-22, the equivalent on a FF camera would be a 17-40L or 16-35L. So there are less costly options including the full frame camera.




  
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Jan 20, 2011 11:45 |  #5

^

Well, to be honest, 14mm on a 5d is rather wide... Its wider then the 10-22 on a 7d.

Theres no zoom either compared to the 10-22.

I'd personally +1 the 17-40 or 16-35.

14 is really quite wide with some noticeable distortion, not something that could be a solo thing.


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Higgs ­ Boson
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Jan 20, 2011 12:09 |  #6

I guess I thought a 10-22 EF-S already had the equivalency math done. If that's not the case, I need to re-evaluate my decisions. Thanks!


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KhanhD
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Jan 20, 2011 12:09 |  #7

5D + 16-35


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gonzogolf
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Jan 20, 2011 12:11 |  #8

Higgs Boson wrote in post #11679224 (external link)
I guess I thought a 10-22 EF-S already had the equivalency math done. If that's not the case, I need to re-evaluate my decisions. Thanks!

If you havent worked with an ultra wide, you really should spend some time with one before you spend too much to get it. They are nice when you need them, but they are not without issues.




  
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Jan 20, 2011 12:14 |  #9

Higgs Boson wrote in post #11678992 (external link)
Ah, well, I guess I'm a fanboy/brand loyal/whatever you want to call it. I'll be honest, I'm not buying a Samyang anything....not that I don't appreciate the suggestion, I should have said that in my OP.

Too bad, there are a ton of very excellent glass that doesn't have the Canon brand on it. Just like how the Tokina 11-16 beats the Canon 10-22... and not to mention that warranties from 3rd party manufactures can be multiple years, where Canon only gives you 1 year.


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amfoto1
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Jan 20, 2011 12:22 |  #10

The primary time you'll notice the difference between 5DII and 7D image quality is if you do very large prints and/or crop heavily.

There is more control over depth of field with a full frame camera, but that's much less of a consideration when shooting with very wide lenses.

I use 12-24 Tokina on my crop cameras and 20mm prime is my widest on full frame. Both are pretty darned wide. For example, the 2mm difference between the Toki 12-24 and Canon 10-22 is equal to approx. 2 or 3 steps backward. A less radically wide lens, or one that doesn't have a really large (unnecessarily) aperture, is often more easily or better corrected.

Optics are always about compromise. You can even see it in Tokina's lens line-up. The 12-24 is an f4 lens. The f2.8 of their 11-16mm attracts a lot of people, but note how narrow the zoom range becomes. I also feel few will actually need f2.8 on such wide angle lenses. Most of the time we're stopping this type of lens down, not using it wide open. Certainly we aren't expecting to blur down backgrounds very much with it. Low light might demand a larger aperture, but today's cameras are higher ISO capable, offsetting to some degree the need for larger apertures (and I.S. for that matter, especially on shorter focal lengths).

Don't rule out third party lenses just as a matter of course. In some cases they are better built than Canon's offerings and offer equal image quality, and sometimes for a good deal less money. The Toki 12-24 I use is an example... built like "L" series I've owned and used, equal in IQ to, but costing about $500 as compared to the EF-S 10-22 for $750.

If you are looking for top image quality and still considering a cropper, be aware that the T2i, 60D and 7D all produce identical images with the same sensor and image processor (7D has dual processors to allow it to shoot at higher speeds). A lot of people buy the 7D simply because it's gotten such rave reviews, without evaluating if they actually need or will even use it's features. It's essentially designed to excel at sports/action. This doesn't mean it can't be used for other things and do them very well... It just means you are buying and paying for features you might not need.

The considerably less expensive 60D and T2i both use the same, new, 63 zone metering system of the 7D, too. They have simpler AF systems, which are straightforward and good performing. A lot of people new to the 7D find it confusing and difficult to work with.

5DII is a nice camera and very capable. It's AF is quite similar to the 60D or T2i, just adds a few hidden "expansion" points that the crop cameras don't have. If you are for some reason wanting ultra wide angle, the Sigma 12-24 is a full frame lens that sells for around $750 (The Tokina 12-24 is technically a "crop" lens, altho I can tell you it works on FF up to 18 or 19mm). This Siggy is the widest non-fisheye available from anyone. I think it compromises a little on image quality, to go as wide as it does. But, that's typical.... Optics always involve some compromise.

If you have your heart set on a 5DII and Canon 14mm.... You might want to rent them first. I agree that the full frame camera with the 17-40 or 16-35 would be more versatile and generally useful.


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Higgs ­ Boson
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Jan 20, 2011 12:22 |  #11

Well, I guess maybe I will wait, pick up a FF camera first, see what 24 looks like with the lens I have, and go from there.

I was just considering being able to get wider for less $ with a 7D and wide EF-S lens....

Mostly I am tired of my XS. I got it a year ago to learn on and I've outgrown it, I think. Whatever the case may be, I don't like it anymore! I can see an IQ difference going to FF and I bought my 24-105 in anticipation of going FF. I find myself wanting a wider shot more often than closer. I also haven't shot any action up to now, but I am not sure that not because of my equipment. I know my limitations..... :-)


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Higgs ­ Boson
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Jan 20, 2011 12:33 |  #12

What about a 60D or 7D with an ulta wide EF lens? 14mm.....That would get me down to 22mm crop.

Great.


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Bytes ­ U
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Jan 20, 2011 12:40 |  #13

Higgs Boson wrote in post #11679311 (external link)
Well, I guess maybe I will wait, pick up a FF camera first, see what 24 looks like )

This would have been my recommendation... you may find 24mm on a FF is what you wanted all along. Your 24-105L is a great lens for the money.


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Jan 20, 2011 12:57 |  #14

Bytes U wrote in post #11679411 (external link)
This would have been my recommendation... you may find 24mm on a FF is what you wanted all along. Your 24-105L is a great lens for the money.

I agree with this. You seem to mostly be a landscape photographer since you are so interested in WA. That being the case as FF is perfect for you IMO.

I am more of an action sports guy, so 7D is right down my alley.


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Higgs ­ Boson
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Jan 20, 2011 13:00 |  #15

What I shoot mostly are stills of cars. Think magazine type of shots. After that, moving shots of cars (so now we have a problem).

However, it is 95% still shots.

Then I shoot landscape type shots.

I also take portrait style pics of people, animals, etc.

Rarely do I ever shoot flying birds, running people, etc.


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