I was published! How do I best approach this situation

I recently have been published in Februarys Penthouse, they used one of my live performance burlesque shots. I was credited. But have not really talked to anyone about being paid for any of my images. They REALLY wanted to use this particular image, It opened the article and is half a page :cheer: I have heard of photographers approaching publications even after the fact asking about being paid for images. Currently my images are licensed to the club i was working for just for promotional use and not for profit or anything of the sort. When is it appropriate to be asked to be paid for an image, should I still ask them for payment for the image? what is the industry price for images, I just want to know how I can best approach this situation for now and future reference!

Couple of questions.

How did they get the picture? Did they contact you directly, or did it come through the club? If it came through the club then that may cause complications as someone may have given it away on the understanding that they were free to do that.

If it came through you, did you give them any details so they can pay you? Postal address/bank details?

I had to google Penthouse, just to check what they do you understand... I would guess they have their set rates for this sort of thing. Most of the magazines I have dealt with do, and so as long as they have a way of paying you it will arrive at some point.

They contacted the club and got the image that way. I knew it was happening but simply didnt even think about it. (my fault) Some people have told me to just contact Penthouse and they should pay me. I talked to the club owner and It was pretty clear that they didn't understand how it worked. I would think any magazine deals with this kind of thing all the time.

thinkjasonacton wrote in post #11792659
I recently have been published in Februarys Penthouse, they used one of my live performance burlesque shots. I was credited. But have not really talked to anyone about being paid for any of my images. They REALLY wanted to use this particular image, It opened the article and is half a page :cheer: I have heard of photographers approaching publications even after the fact asking about being paid for images. Currently my images are licensed to the club i was working for just for promotional use and not for profit or anything of the sort. When is it appropriate to be asked to be paid for an image, should I still ask them for payment for the image? what is the industry price for images, I just want to know how I can best approach this situation for now and future reference!

1) Was the image used within the scope of promotional use (for the club)? If so I would think that the usage is licensed, if not ....

2) Did you register your copyright before it photo was published? If not do so tonight via the electronic copyright office. http://www.copyright.g​ov/

You also might seek counsel from an intellectual property attorney.

Wayne

thinkjasonacton wrote in post #11792659
Currently my images are licensed to the club i was working for just for promotional use and not for profit or anything of the sort.

Sounds like the Club used it for promotional purposes in Penthouse and now your upset because Penthouse used it. Putting a picture inside a magazine (of a club) is promotional purposes. I don't think copyright would help you in this case.

This is why you detail the use of your photographs, to the letter as to how, when and where they can and can not be used, along with how many prints can be used. This way if further use is needed, they need to contact the photographer, to purchase more rights.

QUOTE
"Sounds like the Club used it for promotional purposes in Penthouse and now your upset because Penthouse used it. Putting a picture inside a magazine (of a club) is promotional purposes. I don't think copyright would help you in this case."

I think your making an oversimplified conclusion to my statements. I'm not upset, I'm just wondering what is the best way to go about getting paid, and how to protect your images in a publication. Also, from what I was told from the club owners they were not happy with the article, the dancer in the images was not even informed, nor did they try to make money off of my images to begin with. After talking with the owner, whose clubs have been reviewed in magazines like US weekly, this was not a big deal for him or his business partners...it was actually more of a downgrade in their eyes. As a fairly young, up and coming professional in the Dallas area, I am very grateful for the exposure and photo credit. I just need to know what I should or should have done, for future encounters.

thinkjasonacton wrote in post #11793730
QUOTE
I just need to know what I should or should have done, for future encounters.

1. Put it in writing before the shoot.
2. © & register your images, AND include EXIF © info in the image file.

PhotosGuy wrote in post #11794230
include EXIF © info in the image file.

You can do it, but it's useless if people delete the EXIF info.

thinkjasonacton wrote in post #11793730
QUOTE...

I think your making an oversimplified conclusion to my statements. I'm not upset, I'm just wondering what is the best way to go about getting paid, and how to protect your images in a publication. ... I just need to know what I should or should have done, for future encounters.

Yes I am oversimplifying the situation, As for being paid for this usage you might not be able to receive any payment, as any publisher is likely to defend their usage as being legal (a critical assumption) and As I understand it you did license the photograph for advertising usage which this may have been.

Now as for how to assure payment for unexpected usages in the future I would suggest registering the copyright of all your images (An entire shoot can be registered for $35.00 via the electronic Copyright Office) , and learning how to wright a good usage agreement which should be part of your initial agreement with your client. This usage agreement should be broad enough for the clients use, but not so broad as to allow for usage other than that which is agreed to, and should not allow for the client to give others permission to use (without your agreement) your intellectual property. This is an area which an intellectual property attorney should probably assist you in. Once you have a good basic contract it can be used for most of your clients and yes your attorney should know in advance that this is your intent, as they should be willing to inform you what can and what cannot be modified in the contract. IF they are unwilling to advise you in this perhaps you should seek a different attorney.

Wayne

Jason-

While the magazine is directly responsible for securing the license for publication, when the image is provided directly by a client or subject, they have some responsibility too. If you sue Penthouse, they will sue the club. Everybody loses.

When you provide images to a commercial client-such as the club-you need to be very clear on permited use and potential fees. Its up to you to educate clients with a signed license agreement and make financial deals before publication. Your license should specify that transfers of images to third parties must be negociated by you the photographer. In that situation, you could negociate the price and the magazine can decide if they want to pay the fee or use something else. Trying to get paid after the fact is difficult and often very ugly.

Good Luck-
Scott

You licensed the club to use the image "for promotional purposes".

The club used the image "for promotional purposes", which happened to include submitting it along with a press release or an idea for an article in the magazine. The magazine took them up on it and used the image. It sounds as if they used it editorially, not commercially. Not that this really matters since you simply licensed it for "promotional purposes" which might include either commercial or editorial usage.

No additional money is due to you, since you've already licensed the usage, via your agreement with the club. They simply did as you allowed. I'm really not sure what you expected the club to do with the image. This is exactly the sort of use that I'd expect to see under an open ended promotional usage license.

Believe me, Penthouse has a battery of attorneys standing by ready to deal with you. Every major publisher is very adept at dealing with licensing issues and copyright infringements. So don't expect to get anything out of this.

Take this as a lesson, you need to gain a better understanding of licensing terminology and how to write up your licensing agreements. I agree that you should be registering your images and doing other things to protect your copyright, but those are really a separate issue.

The crux of this situation is image licensing terminology and using it properly in your agreements with your clients.... before, during and after the shoot.

I recommend searching on Amazon for some books about image licensing. ASMP has put together several good guides. The book "Pricing Photography" by Michael Heron is almost ten years old now, but is still a good guide to all aspects of the transaction... writing up licenses that will protect you and setting your prices based upon licensing specifics.

Go buy several copies of the magazine so you can include tearsheets of their use of your image in your portfolio.

I'm just wondering and hypothetically speaking: IF the club had actually requested to Penthouse that the photographer get photo credit, would Penthouse have any liability if they did not comply with that request?

noxcuses1 wrote in post #11797201
I'm just wondering and hypothetically speaking: IF the club had actually requested to Penthouse that the photographer get photo credit, would Penthouse have any liability if they did not comply with that request?

A useless question without more "lawyer info". Did they make the request in writing? Do they have a signed acknowledgment of receipt?
Or was it a verbal aside during a conversation? And of course, do they really care if you didn't get it?

Don't want to hijack the OP's thread, but I've been following up here to see what happened with this.

A very similar thing happened to me as well. I licensed an image to a client for promotional use. I DID have a written license where the client was to give me credit when my photo was used in a publication. My client DID request photo credit (in writing), and I do have the email from my client requesting credit. The publication didn't give the photo credit, nor will they add my photo credit to my image on their web page, even after multiple requests.

The publication lied to me and said the client didn't ask for credit, but the client's email shows otherwise.

Shouldn't there be some sort of liability on the part of the publication for non-compliance or something?